Race Relations..

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: enlightenedservant

I see it as lying to the students. There is cutting information out and then there is painting a narrative that didn't happen. The latter is what high school history classes usually do. I never realized how bad it was until I took a college level history class and saw the STARK difference in the way things are taught. Sure the myth of American Exceptionalism still partly permeates college level history classes (at least the entry level ones), but the content is WAY more complete and not to mention TRUE.

Can't argue with that. I was never raised on the "American Exceptionalism" narrative, as most of my schools were in ethnically diverse areas. Plus I learned a lot from my elders about the truth of American history, as most of my family history is mapped. So I knew which plantations some family members were from, some of the auction blocks & countries of origins, which parts of the Native Tribes we were related to & who intermarried, etc. And my great grandmother was the daughter of a slave, so you can imagine the stories we'd hear.

The ironic part is both my mom & dad's sides of the families have always been filled with teachers, preachers, and Imams. And others were in the Black Panthers and were community organizers. Basically, my bloodline & relatives refused to integrate (except the ones who always join the military, which is weird to me). I don't believe in the mythical "prophet gene", but my relatives like to joke that we have it. Because none of us can shut our mouths when speaking out against lies, indoctrination, oppression, bigotry, etc. lol

a reply to: enlightenedservant

Here's the problem:
How Texas Inflicts Bad Textbooks on Us

No matter where you live, if your children go to public schools, the textbooks they use were very possibly written under Texas influence. If they graduated with a reflexive suspicion of the concept of separation of church and state and an unexpected interest in the contributions of the National Rifle Association to American history, you know who to blame.

When it comes to meddling with school textbooks, Texas is both similar to other states and totally different. It’s hardly the only one that likes to fiddle around with the material its kids study in class. The difference is due to size—4.8 million textbook-reading schoolchildren as of 2011—and the peculiarities of its system of government, in which the State Board of Education is selected in elections that are practically devoid of voters, and wealthy donors can chip in unlimited amounts of money to help their favorites win.

Those favorites are not shrinking violets. In 2009, the nation watched in awe as the state board worked on approving a new science curriculum under the leadership of a chair who believed that “evolution is hooey.” In 2010, the subject was social studies and the teachers tasked with drawing up course guidelines were supposed to work in consultation with “experts” added on by the board, one of whom believed that the income tax was contrary to the word of God in the scriptures.

Ever since the 1960s, the selection of schoolbooks in Texas has been a target for the religious right, which worried that schoolchildren were being indoctrinated in godless secularism, and political conservatives who felt that their kids were being given way too much propaganda about the positive aspects of the federal government. Mel Gabler, an oil company clerk, and his wife, Norma, who began their textbook crusade at their kitchen table, were the leaders of the first wave. They brought their supporters to State Board of Education meetings, unrolling their “scroll of shame,” which listed objections they had to the content of the current reading material. At times, the scroll was fifty-four feet long. Products of the Texas school system have the Gablers to thank for the fact that at one point the New Deal was axed from the timeline of significant events in American history.

The Texas State Board of Education, which approves textbooks, curriculum standards, and supplemental materials for the public schools, has fifteen members from fifteen districts whose boundaries don’t conform to congressional districts, or really anything whatsoever. They run in staggered elections that are frequently held in off years, when always-low Texas turnout is particularly abysmal. The advantage tends to go to candidates with passionate, if narrow, bands of supporters, particularly if those bands have rich backers. All of which—plus a natural supply of political eccentrics—helps explain how Texas once had a board member who believed that public schools are the tool of the devil.

Texas originally acquired its power over the nation’s textbook supply because it paid 100 percent of the cost of all public school textbooks, as long as the books in question came from a very short list of board-approved options. The selection process “was grueling and tension-filled,” said Julie McGee, who worked at high levels in several publishing houses before her retirement. “If you didn’t get listed by the state, you got nothing.” On the other side of the coin, David Anderson, who once sold textbooks in the state, said that if a book made the list, even a fairly mediocre salesperson could count on doing pretty well. The books on the Texas list were likely to be mass-produced by the publisher in anticipation of those sales, so other states liked to buy them and take advantage of the economies of scale.

More recent article:
Texas Hits The Books

Consider one high school government textbook. It lists four thinkers who influenced the Founding Fathers.

"Three of those on the list make a lot of sense: John Locke, Montesquieu and Blackstone. Those are all either British philosophers or Enlightenment thinkers," says Jennifer Graber, a professor at the University of Texas, Austin.

She says that these three thinkers are all quoted in America's founding documents. But, for Graber, the fourth person on the list raised a red flag: Moses.

"The standards suggest that slavery was only the third most important contributing factor to the Civil War, which we all know is ridiculous," says Kathy Miller, president of the Texas Freedom Network, a left-leaning watchdog group. It contracted scholars at various universities to review the books.

Though the second article goes on to point out that Texas didn't adopt Common Core and as a result is starting to play second fiddle to the states that have in the textbook publishing market. So maybe things will change here. I certainly hope so...

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Oh I agree on that part. I thought we were just referring to filtering out the perspectives of the other countries and similar situations like that. That's why I kept emphasizing how we were taught from diverse vantage points because my family didn't want us to have that "indoctrinated" viewpoint.

When I was a child, my Mom used to always grill us on how to read between the lines & how to determine a given writer's agenda. She would always say to never blindly accept anything we read because the author may have been wearing sheets (kkk reference, of course). It's a shame that we still have the same groups deliberately "customizing" the curriculum to spread an agenda.

But I think they'll eventually adopt a neutral teaching platform, maybe even like crowdsourcing. That seems to be the most logical approach. Then, scholars & experts from around the world could give input to standardize the curriculum and prevent fringe groups from hijacking it. I don't mean in a NWO kind of way, but the same way algebra is the same where ever you go.

originally posted by: enlightenedservant
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Oh I agree on that part. I thought we were just referring to filtering out the perspectives of the other countries and similar situations like that. That's why I kept emphasizing how we were taught from diverse vantage points because my family didn't want us to have that "indoctrinated" viewpoint.

You were lucky then. I had to figure all this out on my own.

When I was a child, my Mom used to always grill us on how to read between the lines & how to determine a given writer's agenda. She would always say to never blindly accept anything we read because the author may have been wearing sheets (kkk reference, of course). It's a shame that we still have the same groups deliberately "customizing" the curriculum to spread an agenda.

Yes, I am more than a little irked about it. That's why I want SO badly for ATS to create history forum so that I can start dispelling many of the historic myths running around here.

But I think they'll eventually adopt a neutral teaching platform, maybe even like crowdsourcing. That seems to be the most logical approach. Then, scholars & experts from around the world could give input to standardize the curriculum and prevent fringe groups from hijacking it. I don't mean in a NWO kind of way, but the same way algebra is the same where ever you go.

No, see that makes sense. So naturally that will be the very last thing the Government will consider, let alone implement.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: Skid Mark
a reply to: TechUnique

Unfortunately they consider race relations to be a matter of black and white, most of the time. Natives, Asians, and so-called Hispanics are left out in the cold.

I'd say that the Natives are the most stepped on and abused minority class out of any of them. Their population has been SO decimated by government sanctioned racism (*cough*Manifest Destiny*cough*) that they have been reduced to a sad state living in squalor on reservations. Alcoholism and drug use (meth mostly) runs rampant in their communities. And they apparently can't even put together an efficient enough lobby to get professional sports teams to stop using racist team names and images.

In my area the Seminole Indian tribe is heavy into casinos and EVERY Seminole gets a $10,000 per month stipend from it. Not that money can replace the ill treatment its something.

www.sun-sentinel.com...=2

Sadly I was a mortgage broker for a decade and had several Indian clients and ALL of them had major financial issue's even with the tax free $120,000 a year income.

a reply to: sirlancelot

Fun fact: The Seminoles aren't a 100% pure native tribe, but a tribe of blacks and natives (and even at times, whites) that formed something like a commune because they were dissatisfied with the racial relations between whites and minorities in society.

Black Seminoles

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Interesting info. I have to admit, I respect your insight on ATS. We don't always agree, but there's genuine respect nonetheless. Besides, anyone who agrees with me 100% has to be crazy because even I'm not convinced of all of my theories. lol As for the Seminoles, they were highly respected for their resistance and they still exist in the area too. In fact, Florida State University in Tallahassee, Leon County has a licensing deal with them to use their likeness for its sports mascots.

My family has some interesting history from some of their territory. There's a place in Leon County, Florida called Chaires (here), which was started by a wealthy slave owner in the 1830s. He brought his slaves from either Alabama or Georgia. Anyway, he was a big time power broker & was instrumental in America's wars against the Seminoles.

One entire branch of my Mom's family tree were slaves from his plantations (and a separate allied set of plantations). Some of them broke off & joined with the Muscogee/Creek Indians in the area, while some of the Muscogees branched off to our African American communities (usually through marriage). That part of my Mom's side of the family are still legally classified as Creek/Muscogee, since Muscogee tribal membership passes down through the women/mothers.

But those kinds of alliances are something else that isn't taught in our schools. And the constant push for assimilation is making it where most Americans don't even know their own past.

a reply to: enlightenedservant

I agree. These things aren't taught in schools anymore. Most likely the only reason you even know about it is because you have family ties to it. I had to go out of my way to learn these things and it's a shame. History is so much more rich and colorful when you don't discard parts of it because they may offend someones sensibilities.

originally posted by: Skid Mark
a reply to: TechUnique

Unfortunately they consider race relations to be a matter of black and white, most of the time. Natives, Asians, and so-called Hispanics are left out in the cold.

Thats because the Natives, Asians ect don't have the sort of political potential, or potential for violence that a black uprising would accomplish. The videos above while containing truth are really produced to keep the flames burning and not really as an investigation of historical race relations. Race history here reduced to inflame. And it is reduced to propagandize as it is shown in a very limited context.

a reply to: Krazysh0t


Its fairly clear to me that what is generally found offensive is the great progress made and any good gesture by whites to correct these problems. These things don't serve the purpose as is demonstrated in the OP video. The video creators clearly want some to believe that a clan robe hangs in the closet of ever american white family.

originally posted by: SlapMonkey

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: SlapMonkey
To expect the Native population to come back to their former glory after what we did to them is naive.

Who ever said anything about them coming back to their former glory? All I said is that they've had plenty of time to better themselves from what happened to them by our government in the many years past--I was implying that any issues within their own tribes at this point in time are of their own doing, not the federal government or evil "Whitey."

.

This is true, and the current conditions don't serve the purpose like wallowing in the past does. Thats why we see so many black leaders and spokespersons standing on a platform of selected history while they stand knee deep in their own blood, blood shed by their own, death and destruction of a culture who are sold infected blankets by their own tribesman. Said blankets they wrap themselves in while they indict whitey.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: enlightenedservant

I agree. These things aren't taught in schools anymore. Most likely the only reason you even know about it is because you have family ties to it. I had to go out of my way to learn these things and it's a shame. History is so much more rich and colorful when you don't discard parts of it because they may offend someones sensibilities.

The other reason I know is because my elders ingrained it in us to seek the truth & to question everything. But they never tried to get us to follow them, instead pushing us to follow our own paths. So I ignored them all & tried to learn the truth from scratch lol. But many of my relatives are former Black Panthers or were in the Civil Rights movement, so I ended up learning their stories anyway. And I've only semi-recently started going through our archives to learn more about the early branches of my family tree (earlier than the last 3 generations).

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: sirlancelot

Fun fact: The Seminoles aren't a 100% pure native tribe, but a tribe of blacks and natives (and even at times, whites) that formed something like a commune because they were dissatisfied with the racial relations between whites and minorities in society.

Black Seminoles

So what?

The Seminole tribe has found a way to give their members a large, tax free stipend that would make most people who know something about money well off, and then you point out they aren't "real" natives?

What are your motives in that?

Methinks you need to look in a mirror on race relations at this point. It's like if someone is another race other than white in this country and they aren't suffering, you are looking for an excuse for why they aren't. As if you are unwilling to accept that other people in this country can do well.

Are you just looking to brand the country as evil?

You get less and less libertarian ever day.

a reply to: ketsuko

My motives for what? Posting an interesting piece of information that isn't normally taught in high school? I didn't realize it was anti-Libertarian to post true history. Oh wait you are Tea Party. So what do you know about being Libertarian?

I guess you think it is 100% fine for a group of people's history to be forgotten and they are just chalked up to being a bunch of natives. When in fact they are a mixed breed that showed that even in times of extreme racism, blacks, natives, and even whites could get along just fine. I said that piece to give an example of inspirational living in our past, and you had to turn what I was saying into some stupid anti-native rant or something... Do you not know what "Fun Fact" is supposed to mean exactly?

a reply to: enlightenedservant

Good stuff. When I first heard these stories, I was extremely excited to learn that our past included groups of people that were racially tolerant and lived together just fine. Examples like the Seminoles give me hope for the future. It's a shame that the government didn't feel the same way at the time...

originally posted by: seasoul
It's sad, but just as the embers of racism were all but extinguished in America, it seems self-serving elitists have taken it upon themselves to employ agent provocateurs in an effort to fan the flames of racial discord.

The remnants of racism still exist, not so much within society itself or amongst different ethnic groups, but the system. It's no longer a black and white issue, although some believe it is, race relations have improved within society in general, just not so much within the system; specifically the judicial system.

In my opinion, instead of admitting and fixing the discriminatory practices, they'd have us believe that racism amongst the population is worse than ever and deflect it onto us rather than admitting institutionalized racism is the problem, not the people.

This is what the protests have been about, fighting a system that inherently preys upon the weak, disadvantaged, poor and people of color. So yes, discrimination still exists, not so much amongst the population, but in the system, where the embers have all but been extinguished.

a reply to: Daedal

In my opinion, instead of admitting and fixing the discriminatory practices, they'd have us believe that racism amongst the population is worse than ever and deflect it onto us rather than admitting institutionalized racism is the problem, not the people.

You're not wrong, but not quite correct, either... If that makes any sense, at all.

You're right in that racism among the population is better than it's ever been... Contrary to a lot of opinions to the contrary.

Institutional racism, which certainly exists, is, indeed, a result of us. We've allowed it to happen, and to continue to happen because of our apathy.

The institutions will not change by themselves, we have to force the change.

If they never do, what does that say about us? Nothing good, I submit.

a reply to: seagull

In some ways I think we've been duped into believing everything is all and well, and for the most part it is, however, I also think that people in general are becoming aware of the prejudice the system has over the persistent belief relations have not improved.

Whether or not we let this happen because of our disinterest, the next battle is waging for the very cause we were apathetic about, and people are showing interest in changing the system and not just buying the narrative we are divided to keep the status quo.

The next step is here and people are awakening to help change the system.

Good for them....