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democracy fail.

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posted on May, 9 2015 @ 07:15 PM
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originally posted by: grainofsand
and the bank account never lies...£120 per month on the iPhone contract for parent and kids when the same could be covered for £45 per month on pay as you go, £100 per month on a full Sky package, £50 per month for the new sofa when you could have bought a 2nd hand one for £50 and a £10 throw would make it look new... I could go on.


Just to back to this for a moment.

My sister has just bought a small second home nearby because she has a short-term contract with a local company. The first thing she did was trawl the second-hand shops and whatever the UK version of craigslist is (do we have craigslist here? same kind of thing anyway) for furniture.

Apart from buying new beds & mattresses, she searched and haggled and fitted out the place for about £500 with second-hand stuff. Lovely pair of sofas, good condition, £30 each. Nice dining table and chairs, £80. £60 for a fridge freezer. The list goes on. A little bit of elbow grease, some bleach, some Mr. Sheen, and a few quid on a throw for the sofa (that's the comment you made that reminded me of this!) and it looks like she's bought everything brand new from a posh furniture shop.

She doesn't need to do that. She's very well off financially. It's the mindset that makes the difference. It's probably the same mindset that got her where she is today, in fact.

What she doesn't do, is feel the need to head to the local "rent to buy" place with 1000000% interest to pick out a new sofa that swallows up half her food budget for the week, when a bit of effort and elbow grease can get you what you need rather than what you want but can't afford.

Mindset.




posted on May, 9 2015 @ 07:25 PM
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I think the OP is saying we do not have a true democracy ...
Or as Ghandi said ... "Democracy? That would be a good idea"

For sure it would be a good idea
We elect public servants ... they are not our masters or are they
We give power to those who seek it
We get the government we deserve

Only conclusion being ... if you want power go seek it
If you want to be led be led
If you are unhappy you have given your power to those you deem not worthy
Take responsibility and step forward

Those who seek power are ruthless in their pursuit of power
You decide is it the scum or the cream that rises to the top

It would be good if the welfare of the whole was to the fore
But being naive does not help ... power breeds corruption and self interest

If you want something different be different ... step up

I myself care little for politics
I would rather garden and paint and write and travel and be loyal to my friends and fair to those I meet and try to be a decent member of my community ... that is my personal politics

As for Real Democracy ... that is a nice idea ... but Human Nature gets in the way





edit on 9-5-2015 by artistpoet because: (no reason given)

edit on 9-5-2015 by artistpoet because: Typo

edit on 9-5-2015 by artistpoet because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 07:32 PM
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originally posted by: grainofsand
I will of course exclude people who have been 'sanctioned' but that is always another story.


The majority of those conversations went along the lines of:

"Ok, so you're saying that you didn't attend the appointment because you had to attend an interview/doctors appointment/whatever"
"Yes"
"Did you contact the JC beforehand to let them know?"
"I tried but I couldn't get through"
"Do you have the employer/doctor/whatever appointment letter with you"
"No, I didn't have an appointment letter"
"Ok, but they can confirm you attended?"
"Ah, well, what happened was, I was just leaving the house and I stubbed my toe, then missed the bus, then it was too late to attend and too late to go the JC"
"Ok, but they can confirm that you had an appointment?"
"Ah, well, it wasn't exactly that there was a specific appointment, I thought I should go in anyway to ask for work/see the doctor/whatever."



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 07:49 PM
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originally posted by: EvillerBobThat's a very long-winded way to say that you're a sore loser.


except i didn't vote, ergo i couldn't lose. you're missing my point.



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 07:52 PM
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originally posted by: grainofsand What are you whinging about exactly?


i'm 'whinging' about the failure of the electoral system. ok?



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 07:54 PM
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originally posted by: blupblup
a reply to: RoScoLaz4


You should give credit and put quotation tags around it.



when i wrote it myself?



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 07:57 PM
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originally posted by: SecretKnowledge
a reply to: RoScoLaz4

Surely your not taking credit for that?

Needs to be in quotes


my words.



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 07:58 PM
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a reply to: RoScoLaz4




except i didn't vote, ergo i couldn't lose. you're missing my point.


Apathy, one of the biggest problems in UK politics, you complain about the system but when given the chance to have your say do nothing.

case in point...



i'm 'whinging' about the failure of the electoral system. ok?


2011, you could have done something about that but thanks to the apathy of the British public nothing was done.



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 08:00 PM
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a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

We voted a 67% majority to keep FPTP over the AV system which is also somewhat flawed.

Well some of us did anyway, everyone else just complains when it does not work in there favour.



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 08:01 PM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin you could have done something about that but thanks to the apathy of the British public nothing was done.


no i couldn't. voting is A WASTE OF ENERGY. hence. i didn't. you're a fool if you believe otherwise.



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 08:02 PM
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originally posted by: nonspecific everyone else just complains when it does not work in there favour.


i just complain when the whole process is invalid.



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 08:03 PM
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originally posted by: RoScoLaz4

originally posted by: nonspecific everyone else just complains when it does not work in there favour.


i just complain when the whole process is invalid.


Fair enough, what do you do to change the system that you oppose so much then?



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 08:06 PM
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originally posted by: nonspecific what do you do to change the system that you oppose so much then?


nothing. i just 'whinge' on internet forums. more useful than voting.



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 08:07 PM
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a reply to: RoScoLaz4




when i wrote it myself?


Did you really OP....

Link

About the fourth post down your exact words were posted a about 10 minutes before you posted this in you're OP.

Now I know you will probably just say "ahh yeah but i posted in there first"

But what's to say you didn't just read it off that site and go for a copy paste job to get a quick thread?



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 08:08 PM
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originally posted by: RoScoLaz4

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin you could have done something about that but thanks to the apathy of the British public nothing was done.


no i couldn't. voting is A WASTE OF ENERGY. hence. i didn't. you're a fool if you believe otherwise.


And its just as foolish to believe that by doing nothing you will achieve something.

did you vote in 2011.

Tell you what, I will sit hear and wait a few minutes while you go and google just what it was that happened in 2011 that i might be talking about so you can come back and tell me you did....



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 08:09 PM
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originally posted by: RoScoLaz4

originally posted by: nonspecific what do you do to change the system that you oppose so much then?


nothing. i just 'whinge' on internet forums. more useful than voting.


Well at least your honest.

I cannot personally take any of your whining on board if your to apathetic to get up and do something about it personally though.

Have fun wishing life was better, have a cup of tea. maybe play on a games console or wach a dvd


Just don't be suprised when it's the same ten years from now.



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 08:18 PM
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a reply to: RoScoLaz4




voting is A WASTE OF ENERGY. hence. i didn't


I understand your point
I had not voted in many past elections
This time was different though for me that is ... I had someone whom I could trust to represent my community and he was elected

Other times as you say it was/is a waste of time

There should be a box to tick on the bottom of ballot papers that says ... Non of those above
At least that way those who have no confidence in the politicians or politics in general would have a voice

The Tory's won
But I wonder what the vote would be if everyone in the country had vote as to whether they wanted to be ruled by the Tory party ... I would say the majority would say NO

Not everyone has a voice to represent them and for many there is no real choice

No matter which way you spin it ... The welfare of all has nothing to with politics
Politics is about self seeking power hungry individuals who promise this and do that






edit on 9-5-2015 by artistpoet because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 09:46 PM
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a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

[SNIPPED]

Show me any video footage where Cameron isn't pairing SNP and Labour. Where either of his party aren't talking about how the SNP is gonna run Labour and turn them into their little puppets. The fact that you don't want to admit this or at least agree to the point that neither of the parties ran on their policies and instead ran on the idea of making people fear the SNP and them ruling England is what makes me cringe. I will go as far as to bet you either voted for the Conservatives or SNP yourself.

Cameron and his party of rich Eton princesses have plans that will bring this country down. They want to release certain holds on relief for people who need help with the bedroom tax (but I'm sure you're happy for people being forced to pay an unfair tax or forced to leave their homes) they will be forcing people to beg for food and allow the number of food banks to triple (food banks have gone from less than a hundred to six hundred in the last five years but that's fine for you I'm assuming) and I can promise you, they will be selling off the NHS piece by piece and trying to make out like it's the best deal for the people.

You wish to deny it fine. You seem to be defending the Conservatives a lot so like I said, you probably voted for them.
edit on Sun May 10 2015 by DontTreadOnMe because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2015 @ 10:53 PM
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It’s easy enough to understand your frustration, RoScoLaz4, but I’m afraid it is what it is. Our system over here in the U.S. is nothing to brag about, either. We continually elect and re-elect ruthless cut-throats who would be well-suited as Mafia crime bosses, and then call them our “leaders”. We eat up their blatant lies and convoluted schemes, while cheerfully lining up like lambs being led to slaughter. I guess it’s a combination of naivety, brain-washing, gullibility, complacency and downright stupidity, but we do it every time. Oh yeah, and maybe just a dash of masocism to boot. Whatever it is, we seem to have no problem voting against our own best interests.

Personally, I hate politics. For some reason we call the formal education that relates to it “political science”. I have no idea what science has to do with it, other than making it sound nice. IMHO politics is just the art/method of manipulating others and controlling/directing their thinking as to favor whatever agenda you’re advancing at the time. Good or bad, right or wrong has nothing to do with it. Only your vote counts. Being a politician today has nothing to do with representing the people and serving their best interests, but everything to do with elevating one’s personal/social/financial status, gaining power and control, beefing up the bank account and confirming one’s own inflated, narcissistic self-image.

I don’t know about other countries, but for generations now here in the states we’ve beat it into our kids heads from birth the importance of competition, winning, success = $$, blah, blah, blah... Now, I have no problem with those concepts. There are many positive things to be gained from all of them. However, it can become a problem when these ideas are practiced to the extreme and considered as THE GOAL in and of themselves. To be a successful, well-adjusted person I think a few other qualities can be added to the equation to achieve some balance. There’s nothing wrong with a competitive spirit, as long as it’s tempered with a sense of cooperation, as well. It’s great to be a winner, but understand that we often learn more in defeat. Money is a wonderful thing to have. With it comes financial stability, and it opens the door to many opportunities. But who needs 50 billion bucks? To horde this kind of money is purely out of greed. In other words, temper the greed with at least some sense of compassion for the rest of humanity, and share a little with some good causes. The world would be better off. But, I’m afraid the qualities I mentioned to complete the equation are not given the same weight as the others, and are even considered signs of weakness by many.

In other words, I think we’ve created a “Me-Me” world, more and more becoming known as the haves and have nots. And to be honest, I only have my own generation to blame for that. We’ve become too politically/socially correct, we’ve traded in any sense of morals and ethics for the misguided rewards of greed, power and instant gratification. We’ve become very inward in our thinking, no longer having the skills to work and play with others. It’s like we no longer have the time or interest in smelling the roses, or the air after a good rain. We’re losing touch with nature.

Anywho, I guess what I’m trying to get across is, we get exactly what we ask for. Nothing more. Nothing less. The mess we’re in is of our own making, and it’s our own damned fault. I wish I had the answer, but I don’t. By every indication, it seems to me we’re headed for trouble, but I don’t know how you stop an avalanche once it gets started.

Que sera, sera...

PS: By the way, the Democracy experiment failed long ago. It no longer has meaning, and I don’t know of any country that practices it.



posted on May, 10 2015 @ 03:48 AM
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a reply to: VoidHawk

I didn't even know about this "sheep" - why are you banging on about it and also, why are you so bloody arrogant to assume that is the reason people voted for the Conservatives? Sounds like sour grapes to me.

Personally, I think it is down to the British people being sensible and not trusting Labour (or anyone else) who still have not grasped anything about the economy, people's feelings on the EU/Immigration or that tax/spend is not the way to run a country.



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