Freddie Gray's Death Ruled a Homicide; 6 Officers Charged!

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: WarminIndy

No the knife was not illegal, that is from the words of the police department.

Yes he had a history, what does that change?
Or should we just kill criminals?

Maryland knife laws He had already been arrested for an illegal gun, he was on probation for that.

(c) Prohibited. — (1) A person may not wear or carry a dangerous weapon of any kind concealed on or about the person.

Apparently, it is illegal for Ninjas to conceal throwing stars (shirikens).

What kind of knife was it?

His history isn't just for minor drug trafficking, he had been arrested for second degree assault. I think it was accidental and no, I do not agree we should just kill people we think are criminals. But how would you yourself stop a criminal if you had to stop him?

Give us a solution, please.

originally posted by: Neutrality
a reply to: Xcathdra

Also, you are not grasping the fact of a RESTRAINED person. A person with bound limbs has little to no control in a car ride of any sort with no restraints and no FRICTION to cause restraint. Get it now?

and you can retrain kids in the back of the car yet they can still slam there head against something cant they?

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: Neutrality
a reply to: Xcathdra

Also, you are not grasping the fact of a RESTRAINED person. A person with bound limbs has little to no control in a car ride of any sort with no restraints and no FRICTION to cause restraint. Get it now?

and you can retrain kids in the back of the car yet they can still slam there head against something cant they?

Not if they are restrained correctly. Car seats are designed to prevent that.

How was he restrained? Was he only handcuffed or was he shackled at the ankles?

ETA: Let me just say this, the true injustice is that he had a lost life from the moment he was born. It ended tragically and too soon.
Had there been presented to him a different life, this might not have happened.

originally posted by: WarminIndy

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: Neutrality
a reply to: Xcathdra

Also, you are not grasping the fact of a RESTRAINED person. A person with bound limbs has little to no control in a car ride of any sort with no restraints and no FRICTION to cause restraint. Get it now?

and you can retrain kids in the back of the car yet they can still slam there head against something cant they?

Not if they are restrained correctly. Car seats are designed to prevent that.

How was he restrained? Was he only handcuffed or was he shackled at the ankles?

Please show us how to restrain a person in the back seat of this police van where he cannot hit his head against anything.

Even if he was placed into his seat and seat belted in he can still slam his head against something.

Mr. Gray, just like the bulk of kids on vacation, are of an age where they are not restrained using car seats.

a reply to: WarminIndy

But how would you yourself stop a criminal if you had to stop him?

Good question, I'll let you know when it happens.

I will say he deserved to get booked and processed per his right, that is my solution.

I just don't see what bringing up his past has to do with anything aside from trying to dehumanize.

He had a rap sheet, that doesn't change that what happened is not what is suppose to happen.

a reply to: Xcathdra

When you are in a vehicle and it makes any kind of turn or adjustment in speed do you not feel it? You DO. Now imagine that same ride where you have nothing to counter that feeling (I.E cushioned seats, seatbelt, knowledge of the adjustment, hands and legs to counter). You WILL be thrown around unrestrained even at a turn going around 10 MPH (NOT an out-of-control turn). Why? Because when the car turns at 10MPH and you are sitting static without RESTRAINT, suddenly you are travelling 10MPH at the nearest object, aka the wall of a van.

How do you not understand that?

a reply to: Xcathdra

Please show us how to restrain a person in the back seat of this police van where he cannot hit his head against anything.

Do the walls of the van not count?

a reply to: Xcathdra

Yes, it's called a seatbelt

Incase you are unclear
Seatbelt

When driving, the driver and passengers are travelling at the same speed as the car. If the car suddenly stops or crashes, the driver and passengers continue at the same speed the car was going before it stopped. A seatbelt applies an opposite force to the driver and passengers to prevent them from falling out or making contact with the interior of the car.

originally posted by: Neutrality
a reply to: Sremmos80

GPS is not accurate enough to determine that, not even remotely close.

Which is precisely why they won't use it. I already covered what they will almost certainly use at the trial. The van in question is a Chevy van equipped with airbags. Since 1974 GM has installed EDR's in all vehicles equipped with airbags. EDR's are originally designed to collect vehicle accident information. But they also collect and store information about driving habits. The type of information EDR's collect is speed, acceleration, vertical and lateral movement, position of the gas pedal, breaking information and some even collect information on tire inflation.

Black boxes—event data recorders like the ones found in airliners—are increasingly common in automobiles and vary from one type of car to another. But cars with airbags have long had onboard computers with the sensors and software necessary to determine within 1/100 of a second that you're in a crash; that's how cars know when to deploy the bags. These computers, called sensing and diagnostic modules, are located inside the transmission hump, behind the dashboard, or under the seat, and constantly collect and process data on the car's acceleration or deceleration. Airbag-equipped cars made by General Motors (which owns Cadillac) have had SDMs since 1974. Beginning in the 1999 model year, though, GM upgraded SDMs to include an event data recorder. The newer SDMs track the car's speed (from the speedometer), engine RPM, the exact position of the gas pedal, and whether or not the brake pedal was pressed, among other statistics.

They are regularly used in court cases. And I all but guarantee they will be used either for the prosecution or the defense in this case. Many people do not know about them and they only find out when they are used against them.

a reply to: Greathouse

From all the searching I have done (not much honestly) those EDR's or "blackboxes" are set to record accident data. Nothing I can find shows they record real-time data. Everything points to they activate at the sense of a crash and record everything from start of accident to about 20 seconds after. Is that correct? If so, the "blackbox" will have no data at all.

_NVM edit

a reply to: Neutrality

Maybe you should read the quote I supplied?


Edit; The pertinent information was when they switched over in 1999. It's pretty silly that you would even think a black box would record 40 years of data.

a reply to: Greathouse

Misread it, I thought you said it was a 1974 Chevy van in use. Still, do those record real-time data? I read the quote, but everything I search says they don't record real-time data. You know, data-storage and all.

ETA- Even with the limited data it claims to collect, that would be real-time data. I can't see a police van that doesn't have actual cameras recording THAT much data of the vehicle. Every press of the gas or brake, constant RPM's.

Big-rig's have those (I know this 100%) but they are real-time data and not at all stored data.

a reply to: Neutrality

Yes they constantly collect data. They were intended use for them is for airbag deployment Analysis. I read about a court case not too long ago where a Corvette blew by a cop extremely fast ( if my memory serves me correctly I think it was 130 mph) and he could not get a radar signature in time. So they arrested the guy impounded the car and got a court order to retrieve the information from the device.

Now the very first time I heard about them was a vehicular homicide around 2002 in Florida where they used information from the Device to prosecute .

a reply to: Greathouse

That's a personal used vehicle as compared to a constantly used law enforcement vehicle. I would need to see actual data storage capacities of these EDR's to believe that they would be efficient for said data collection on a government used vehicle which incurs MUCH more use. Just my opinion though, and I'm willing to research if you provide me a source of specs of one of these.

This is one link I've found on the info

EDR Info

Event data recorders are part of the airbag safety system. They’re what tells the airbags to deploy. And if the crash isn’t forceful enough to trigger the airbags, the EDR doesn’t record the data

originally posted by: Neutrality
a reply to: Greathouse

From all the searching I have done (not much honestly) those EDR's or "blackboxes" are set to record accident data. Nothing I can find shows they record real-time data. Everything points to they activate at the sense of a crash and record everything from start of accident to about 20 seconds after. Is that correct? If so, the "blackbox" will have no data at all.

_NVM edit

So you think the box can tell before there is an accident to start recording? It has to record all the time to have a record if a crash occurs.

a reply to: dragonridr

that's like saying an airbag has to be constantly deployed for it to be effective. It collects data to the microsecond of impact, determining the why's and what's of the accident.

a reply to: Neutrality

The data she was referring to in that blog was crash/ airbagdeployment data which is only talking about the black box.

Sensors mounted around the edge of the car might detect a person there, but if the crash isn’t forceful enough to set off an airbag deployment, the black box probably won’t record it.

Now read my quote again SDM's constantly record data and in 1999 GM black boxes were incorprated into SDM's. I think where we are having a difference of opinion is. You are talking solely about the black boxes I am not. I apologize if I did not make that clear from the beginning.

a reply to: Greathouse

That is the difference for sure. I'm not familiar with any of this other than what simple searches and logical reasoning can present me. I learned what the "blackboxes" do at least! Now time to search the SDM's

Thanks!

a reply to: Neutrality

I've been reading your replies for 2or 3 pages. I have noticed that you shot everybody's opinion down that was given to you.

So I would like to hear how you think Freddy sustain his neck injury?

a reply to: Greathouse

left in the back of a van, make a few hard turns. Stop a few times to make sure he's ok, last stop you say Oh #



5MPH restrained crash, watch the slow-mo