Putin's Propaganda Machine.

a reply to: tsurfer2000h

you can call them whatever you want if the price is right and you have a place that will let you say it.

a reply to: dragonridr

let's face it. Europe's bankrupt. US is not far behind. UK has been trading insolvent for nearly 5 years. too much debt to too many violent people with big guns.

if russia doesn't send the debt colletors in (or blackwater or nazis or isis or chechens or whatever you want to call them)

china will.

originally posted by: mSparks43
a reply to: dragonridr

let's face it. Europe's bankrupt. US is not far behind. UK has been trading insolvent for nearly 5 years. too much debt to too many violent people with big guns.

if russia doesn't send the debt colletors in (or blackwater or nazis or isis or chechens or whatever you want to call them)

china will.

Think you have it backwards there lining up on Russia's door. Watch the next thing Russia will do is default on their loans this summer.

a reply to: dragonridr

that's where all the "putin stole all the money" propoganda originates.

he's got it all (along with china). and all these "debtor nation's " do not.

it's also the main reason Europe and the US are petrified to do anything against him of substance.

why do you think Switzerland dropped it's euro peg.

or are we getting to complicated for you now?

Actually if China does try to roll in and collect by force our debt is instantly nullified really. So yeah that be real smart for them to do.

a reply to: yuppa

why would funding and arming a group like isis nulify debt owed to china? im confused why youd think that.

originally posted by: mSparks43
a reply to: yuppa

why would funding and arming a group like isis nulify debt owed to china? im confused why youd think that.

If you could prove them being given orders to do so from the chinese to avoid war they could also get the debt nullified as well.

a reply to: yuppa
my point was they would.
right now it's russia.
they are organised by the old iraqi regeme.
who were replaced by the Americans because they kicked out the seven sisters and signed up with Gazprom.

now Gazprom has their oil fields back.

keep up FFS.

originally posted by: mSparks43
a reply to: yuppa
my point was they would.
right now it's russia.
they are organised by the old iraqi regeme.
who were replaced by the Americans because they kicked out the seven sisters and signed up with Gazprom.

now Gazprom has their oil fields back.

keep up FFS.

What are you talking about Gazprom has no oil fields in Iraq. What they do have is a contract to build an oil refinery in badrah. Though I'm willing to bet Iraq changes there mind and goes with BP.

a reply to: mSparks43

you can call them whatever you want if the price is right and you have a place that will let you say it.

Sarcasm isn't your thing...

Duly Noted.

originally posted by: tsurfer2000h
a reply to: mSparks43

you can call them whatever you want if the price is right and you have a place that will let you say it.

Sarcasm isn't your thing...

Duly Noted.

No he just wants to keep changing the subject with really stupid statements that have nothing to do with reality. Instead of discussing Putin's lies he's been telling after all how cam he defend them. Part of Russian propaganda is bury the truth by telling lies to make it harder to see the truth. If you pile up enough garbage on top the truth most people will never see it.

a reply to: dragonridr

are you saying we need to recap the thread again..... Go ahead. I'll wait till we've added the gazprom connection to Isis in more detail.
I'll start with Where exactly do you think the know how, logistics and anti air capability for this

www.theguardian.com...

Comes from?
because a quick google of gazprom neft shows all that to be their oil network.

It's probably worth pointing out, since I've seen so much BS about it, that the price of Brent/WTI oil (seven sisters raw crude) is not really that relevant to the Russian economy. if anything low crude prices are a positive, since they are inputs, and low input prices boosts your economy. (and Gazprom neft takes raw crude wherever it can get it, and sells refined product)

Putin is a politician right?

Why should anyone care about him not telling the truth?

It's not like telling the truth is something that is expected of politicians. But you almost sound surprised. and So far you haven't actually demonstrated any evidence of him not telling the truth.

originally posted by: mSparks43
a reply to: dragonridr

are you saying we need to recap the thread again..... Go ahead. I'll wait till we've added the gazprom connection to Isis in more detail.
I'll start with Where exactly do you think the know how, logistics and anti air capability for this

www.theguardian.com...

Comes from?
because a quick google of gazprom neft shows all that to be their oil network.

It's probably worth pointing out, since I've seen so much BS about it, that the price of Brent/WTI oil (seven sisters raw crude) is not really that relevant to the Russian economy. if anything low crude prices are a positive, since they are inputs, and low input prices boosts your economy. (and Gazprom neft takes raw crude wherever it can get it, and sells refined product)

Putin is a politician right?

Why should anyone care about him not telling the truth?

It's not like telling the truth is something that is expected of politicians. But you almost sound surprised. and So far you haven't actually demonstrated any evidence of him not telling the truth.

Here's a good start Putin claims there's no Russian military in Ukraine. Here's a report that shows otherwise. Than we can discuss his lies to the Russians after words like his bombing of the apartments in Moscow and claiming it was chechens. You know the scape goat he always uses when he does something. Like when he has people killed he finds some poor chechens to pin it on.

www.bloombergview.com...

a reply to: dragonridr
No.
The lie is
->Russia's official position is still that it's not involved in the conflict.

The truth is
www.bbc.co.uk...
with the result being
en.wikipedia.org...

Putins "official" postiion is just that he, personally, as only a head of state can do, has not declared war with the Ukraine, nothing more, nothing less.

Saying "Russia's official position is still that it's not involved in the conflict" is exactly the same as saying.

The UK's official position is still that it's not involved in the conflict in Syria.
Just because the UK Queen hasn't declared war with Syria.

Which would also be BS.

But it wouldn't make the Queen a liar for saying she hasn't declared war with Syria. (although I doubt she could remember one way or the other)...
If any reporter could brave the stench involved in actually conducting such an interview.

Which is like
All this stuff
en.wikipedia.org...

Obviously you know that right?
Not like your media is filled with BS, lies and misinformation or anything. Is it.

originally posted by: mSparks43
a reply to: dragonridr
No.
The lie is
->Russia's official position is still that it's not involved in the conflict.

The truth is
www.bbc.co.uk...
with the result being
en.wikipedia.org...

Putins "official" postiion is just that he, personally, as only a head of state can do, has not declared war with the Ukraine, nothing more, nothing less.

Saying "Russia's official position is still that it's not involved in the conflict" is exactly the same as saying.

The UK's official position is still that it's not involved in the conflict with Syria.
Just because the UK Queen hasn't declared war with Syria.

Which would also be BS.

But it wouldn't make the Queen a liar for saying she hasn't declared war with Syria. (although I doubt she could remember one way or the other)...
If any reporter could brave the stench involved in actually conducting such an interview.

Which is like
All this stuff
en.wikipedia.org...

Obviously you know that right?
Not like your media is filled with BS, lies and misinformation or anything. Is it.

You think that election was fair?? Armed men in polling areas allowed people in RUSSIA To vote. They even allowed Internet voting I could have voted. No international observers only two parties on the ballot both Russians. Both approved by the Kremlin just like In 2008 a similar pattern unfolded in pro-Russian regions of Georgia - South Ossetia and Abkhazia. Only Russia recognises those regions as independent.

So in other words Putin rigged an election and I guess since he did the same in Russia with his election you think this is normal right??

a reply to: dragonridr

Well, since it is widely accepted that the majority of the population in those areas consider themselves Russian rather than Ukrainian.
rigged or not. It would seem to represent the views of the population.
But that's all beside the point.


You said Putin was Lying because he said Russia is not involved in the conflict.
which would be true if he said Russia is not involved in the conflict.
but since he didn't
It's basic strawman 101

and the only people that seem to be falling for it is you three.

originally posted by: mSparks43
a reply to: dragonridr

Well, since it is widely accepted that the majority of the population in those areas consider themselves Russian rather than Ukrainian.
rigged or not. It would seem to represent the views of the population.
But that's all beside the point.


You said Putin was Lying because he said Russia is not involved in the conflict.
which would be true if he said Russia is not involved in the conflict.
but since he didn't
It's basic strawman 101

and the only people that seem to be falling for it is you three.

No he said there is no Russian troops in Ukraine you are the one trying to argue symantics. He stayed there are no troops there are indeed troops and he lied. this is really quite black and white and amazes me you would even try to argue the point.

"Let me be clear," Putin said: "I will say this clearly: There are no Russian troops in Ukraine."

www.businessinsider.com...

So wish to continue to argue since Putin told us a lie since we see from the latest report Russian troops indeed are in Ukraine. Oh wait I know next you can argue he didn't know Russian troops were being sent into Ukraine. They Just FORGOT To Tell Him right?? Or maybe he's going senile and just forgot At this point your just showing your ignorance.

a reply to: mSparks43

Well, since it is widely accepted that the majority of the population in those areas consider themselves Russian rather than Ukrainian.

And they can consider themselves anything they want, but if they are born in Ukraine they are Ukrainian.

Just because you speak a certain language it doesn't automatically make you that.

You said Putin was Lying because he said Russia is not involved in the conflict.
which would be true if he said Russia is not involved in the conflict.
but since he didn't
It's basic strawman 101

Seems you only see what you want...

Their accounts call into question the Kremlin's continued assertions that no Russian soldiers have been sent to Ukraine, and that any Russians fighting alongside rebels there are volunteers.

And yet we have this from those being sent to Ukraine...

"After we crossed the border, a lieutenant colonel said we could be sent to jail if we didn't fulfil orders. Some soldiers refused to stay there," said the soldier, who served with the elite Russian Kantemirovskaya tank division. He gave Reuters his full name but spoke on condition of anonymity, saying he feared reprisals.

uk.reuters.com...

Well care to explain why Russian troops are being told they will face criminal charges if they don't fulfill orders when they are just supposed volunteers?

Remember Russia doesn't have any active troops in Ukraine...or that is the lie from Putin.

a reply to: tsurfer2000h

You clearly don't understand the significance of a "declaration of war".

Or the rights and obligations of a free society and the social contract.

You really should learn about that.

They teach that sort of stuff in school over this way.

Then again.
You probably shouldn't.
You'll probably get quite angry.

a reply to: mSparks43

You clearly don't understand the significance of a "declaration of war".

Who declared war on Ukraine...if it is from an internal source it would be considered what it is today, a separatists movement one that Russia has no right to interfere in.

And as far as I know Ukraine hasn't declared war on anyone outside of their country, so what is your point on declaring war?

Or the rights and obligations of a free society and the social contract.

And what do those have to do with Russia sending troops into a sovereign nation, because even if some in Ukraine asked for Russia it doesn't give Russia the right interfere in Ukraine's internal conflict.

They teach that sort of stuff in school over this way.

The one's I attended did just fine, but thanks for the info.

Now exactly how does anything you posted have to do with the premise of the thread, you know this one...

Putin's Propaganda Machine.

Because you have steered this thread so far off the reason it was posted that it probably doesn't even make sense to those who may just be reading it for the first time...good job.

Then again.
You probably shouldn't.
You'll probably get quite angry.

Try this...

Post something that comes remotely close to the topic of the thread.

Not a real hard thing to do.