It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

NASA May Have Accidentally Created a Warp Field

page: 3
54
<< 1  2    4 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Apr, 26 2015 @ 09:05 AM
link   
Hmmmm. Could that be the real reason for the military flying the mini shuttle onto orbit. Stay up long enough to launch a warp drive probe and then retrieve it? Makes it much simpler to do it undetected.
Just stray thought with as usual no supporting facts.




posted on Apr, 26 2015 @ 09:35 AM
link   

originally posted by: datasdream
Hmmmm. Could that be the real reason for the military flying the mini shuttle onto orbit. Stay up long enough to launch a warp drive probe and then retrieve it? Makes it much simpler to do it undetected.
Just stray thought with as usual no supporting facts.


The military would have the same problems civilian warp researchers have:

an interstellar class warp drive requires 17 gigatons TNT equivalent of starter energy.
A warp field requires large amounts of negative energy mass density.
The way Alcubierre derivative warp works the vehicle needs at least low relativistic normal space speed to get a multiplier sufficient for timely interstellar travel.
Because of this it will need mitigation/avoidance systems for relativistic velocity impactors and we don't have any other than in theory.


Now; it is possible to optimize the first two factors to an unknown degree according to Dr White.
And it is possible a surprise technical discovery could at least increase the amount of negative energy we can produce. E.G; placing the "squeezed" light lasers in a ring configuration and stacking them together. But unless there has been an additional breakthrough in the black world getting the requisite levels of negative stuff needed is considered impossible.
edit on 26-4-2015 by stormbringer1701 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 26 2015 @ 10:15 AM
link   
a reply to: Aliensun



The UFOs have demonstrated since day one of their efforts to make themselves known in 1947 (if not earlier) that they contain in those rather compact devices a use of physics that cancels their mass and allows what we consider impossible feats of movement. --They don't fly! They do not use air for lift or to enable propulsion.


Good point-but how does that explain the lack of sonic booms in UFO encounters?

UFO's can deny gravity all they want but they can't deny the atmosphere.



posted on Apr, 26 2015 @ 11:26 AM
link   

originally posted by: Thecakeisalie
a reply to: Aliensun



The UFOs have demonstrated since day one of their efforts to make themselves known in 1947 (if not earlier) that they contain in those rather compact devices a use of physics that cancels their mass and allows what we consider impossible feats of movement. --They don't fly! They do not use air for lift or to enable propulsion.


Good point-but how does that explain the lack of sonic booms in UFO encounters?

UFO's can deny gravity all they want but they can't deny the atmosphere.




Actually they can. there are a couple of things. if the drive system alters the local space curvature the craft technically can be in it's own little universe when travelling at high speed. there are also surface materials and structures that can prevent the bow shock wave which is ultimately responsible for the sonic boom from growing. we have the initial proof of concept materials necessary to do this ourselves. E.G; supersonic underwater torpedo skins or sub hulls.
edit on 26-4-2015 by stormbringer1701 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 26 2015 @ 01:10 PM
link   
How much can space at the rear end be stretched and how much can it be contracted at the front? Only if this is many times stretched/contracted, will it make a difference when going out of our solar system (if we can get trough the stuff at the outer edge of the solar system).



posted on Apr, 26 2015 @ 01:12 PM
link   
a reply to: wasaka

3D printing already has.

Food replicators > warp drive.



posted on Apr, 26 2015 @ 01:51 PM
link   

originally posted by: QueenofWeird
How much can space at the rear end be stretched and how much can it be contracted at the front? Only if this is many times stretched/contracted, will it make a difference when going out of our solar system (if we can get trough the stuff at the outer edge of the solar system).
while it would be nice to be able to turn the distance needed into a fraction -even a reduction of an inch per 100 yards would accumulate to significance over a light year or even greater beyond. cutting billions of inches of a long journey is an advantage not shared by conventional propulsion systems of the sort we have built so far. And it would lead to significant shortening of trip times at interstellar distances.

to put it another way the alcubierre warp system need not contract the entire distance nor expand it in the rear. the region affected locally is only about 100 meters. plus a bit more for the contraction and expansion. the Alcubierre and White calculations made were for a ten meter diameter ship in a 100 meter warp effect (mostly so that the ten meter ship could rest in a geometrically flat space in the center to avoid inertial issues. ) the contracted expanded zone need only be changed to a small degree to eliminate most of the trip as seen in real space. say 4.5 meters in front and 4.5 meters in back for a total 90 percent reduction in the distance the ten meter ship must travel to get to the nearest star. for every ten meters in real space the ship travels in need only travel 1 meter in warp space. the actual calculation is more complicated. i simplified it so that anyone could understand what is going on in general language.



posted on Apr, 26 2015 @ 02:33 PM
link   

originally posted by: swanne
a reply to: PandaLord

It is known that although light may not travel faster than light, the phase group velocity of a group of photons can give the appearance of moving FTL.




I believe you could actually use that phase effect to induce a "Lense-Thirring" effect to dramatically increase the warp field.

Such method would use a huge array of smaller drivers that would fire in phase and achieve far better efficiency and warp field.

This is not nerd talk, I've been on this research since childhood. I've managed to create my own electrostatic drive in my teens that apparently violate conservation of momentum in a closed system.

My next step is to put these drives in a phased array to induce a warp field - ie "Lense-Thirring Effect" in scientifically formal term.

The Lense-Thirring Effect is popularly associated with ergosphere of black holes if anyone wants to look it up in google.

If only this was my job (propulsion research) I could have done it much sooner.



posted on Apr, 26 2015 @ 05:37 PM
link   

originally posted by: Thecakeisalie
a reply to: Aliensun



The UFOs have demonstrated since day one of their efforts to make themselves known in 1947 (if not earlier) that they contain in those rather compact devices a use of physics that cancels their mass and allows what we consider impossible feats of movement. --They don't fly! They do not use air for lift or to enable propulsion.


Good point-but how does that explain the lack of sonic booms in UFO encounters?

UFO's can deny gravity all they want but they can't deny the atmosphere.



There is already research on non-warp-drive sonic boom mitigation. If you can seriously heat up air in front of you and reduce density, or increase the speed of sound by inducing a plasma, then you might be able to reduce the shockwave.



posted on Apr, 27 2015 @ 03:27 AM
link   

originally posted by: datasdream
Hmmmm. Could that be the real reason for the military flying the mini shuttle onto orbit. Stay up long enough to launch a warp drive probe and then retrieve it? Makes it much simpler to do it undetected.
Just stray thought with as usual no supporting facts.


Considering the fact that anything in orbit is visible to amateur satellite trackers (who also photograph the X37) probably not.



posted on Apr, 27 2015 @ 08:05 AM
link   
a reply to: johndeere2020

Hm, interesting. Though I wonder: are you sure you are not confusing Penrose's Process with the Lense-Thirring Effect? I beleive the Penrose Process is nearer of what you are describing, for the Lense-Thirring Effect is more about precession of an object than actual borrowing of energy... But then I must point out that since such process would borrow energy from the rotating body, and slow the latter down, then none of these break momentum conservation.

And in what way does the group phase velocity of a group of photons relate to the Lense-Thirring Effect?




edit on 27-4-2015 by swanne because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 28 2015 @ 07:33 AM
link   
a reply to: PandaLord

I think Futurama came up with this idea first.

"I understand how the engines work now. It came to me in a dream. The engines don’t move the ship at all. The ship stays where it is, and the engines move the universe around it.” - Cubert Farnsworth

The Professor talking about how his engine for his ship works. That instead of it reaching the speed of light and traveling that way the ship instead moves the universe while the ship is just basically suspended there not moving at all.



posted on Apr, 28 2015 @ 01:30 PM
link   
a reply to: stormbringer1701
Ok but how to control the inner gravity? How to have the needed effects not mess with craft or the people in it.
How fast or slow does time move in the craft compared to earth time.

And how does this contracting = graffity effect other objects like stars? I mean you can wrinkle the carpet but not only what you want comes closer to you, also everyhting else on it.



posted on Apr, 28 2015 @ 06:19 PM
link   
Alcubierre and White designed the inner bubble to have locally flat geometry so that the ship would not experience inertial or relativistic effects inside. inside the bubble the ship is standing still. It is the warped area outside the bubble, -to the fore and aft; that are expanding and contracting.



posted on Apr, 29 2015 @ 12:49 AM
link   
If our Universe is a Hologram, as many scientists say it could be, would we really be traveling to other stars? Or just across the holodeck ??

I'm all for space travel. Some of my very best mind trips involve space travels to other places. How I'd love to make them real.






posted on Apr, 29 2015 @ 01:49 AM
link   

originally posted by: paralemptor
If our Universe is a Hologram, as many scientists say it could be, would we really be traveling to other stars? Or just across the holodeck ??

I'm all for space travel. Some of my very best mind trips involve space travels to other places. How I'd love to make them real.



that is a tangent but i will indulge you momentarily. there was an article yesterday where some researchers showed for the first time that the holographic principle works in non anti-reinmanian spaces ( a type of spaces with negative curvature) or something like that. what that means is the holographic principle went from something that works in topologies not in evidence in the real universe to something that may indeed hold in flat space topologies and as we know space is very flat to very large scales.

phys.org...



posted on Apr, 29 2015 @ 06:32 AM
link   
I've seen a few comments on the extreme ammount of power needed for a working warp drive. Although I understand that has been the theory, if in fact they did actually create a warp field with this EM drive then in practice that may not apply. Since a warp field was not their goal I doubt they were applying the current theory. Can anyone think of how that may be possible with this EM drive?

I've read this on a few areas, not sure how credible they are though. I'll be hoping for some confirmation from NASA.
edit on 29-4-2015 by seeking77 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 29 2015 @ 06:49 AM
link   

originally posted by: seeking77
I've seen a few comments on the extreme ammount of power needed for a working watp drive. Although I understand that has been the theory, if in fact they did actually create a warp field with this EM drive then in practice that may not apply. Since a warp field was not their goal I doubt they were applying the current theory. Can anyone think of how that may be possible with this EM drive?

I've read this on a few areas, not sure how credible they are though. I'll be hoping for some confirmation from NASA.
Well there is good news and bad news.

the reason Dr White could make a warp bubble (if that is what he did) is that the warp bubble he may have created is tiny. unaided by optimization techniques a warp bubble big enough to enclose a ship of modest dimensions is 17 gigatons worth of TNT. The equivalent of the energy required.

Dr White powered his warp bubble using negative energy available in the quantum world of virtual particles. though in theory this is infinite in practice the amount that can be extracted is tiny due to probabilistic mathematical functions.

So the fact is we still have a looooong way to go to get the requisite negative energy. However Dr White has calculated optimizations that bring the negative energy/mass requirements down.

First the shape of the warp ring alters the amount of energy needed for the ring.

Secondly he says you can collapse and expand energy waveform around the ring and this brings down the energy requirements. in fact calculating this effect is how he brought the energy requirements down to 17 GT in the first place. He says he stopped at that point only because he just needed working figures to model his idea of a warp drive. So Further optimization which brings down the energy requirement more is definitely there. there is lots of room to reduce that figure.
edit on 29-4-2015 by stormbringer1701 because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-4-2015 by stormbringer1701 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 29 2015 @ 06:55 AM
link   
As to how it's applicable to the EM drive; The QVPT and EM drives seem to be working on the same general principles at a fundamental level. Dr White and Mr March say they are all warp drives and they are all EM drives.

Needs a little more explanation:

Dr White believes that the EM drives he tested work by pushing on the QV plasma of virtual stuff. This is how he believes his QVPT accesses negative energy as well from the quantum vacuum stuff. So due to their similar form and function he believes the EM thrusters also deal with negative QV energy as well (in addition to the regular energy and particles in the QV.)


edit on 29-4-2015 by stormbringer1701 because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-4-2015 by stormbringer1701 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 29 2015 @ 10:48 AM
link   

originally posted by: mbkennel

originally posted by: Thecakeisalie
a reply to: Aliensun



The UFOs have demonstrated since day one of their efforts to make themselves known in 1947 (if not earlier) that they contain in those rather compact devices a use of physics that cancels their mass and allows what we consider impossible feats of movement. --They don't fly! They do not use air for lift or to enable propulsion.


Good point-but how does that explain the lack of sonic booms in UFO encounters?

UFO's can deny gravity all they want but they can't deny the atmosphere.



There is already research on non-warp-drive sonic boom mitigation. If you can seriously heat up air in front of you and reduce density, or increase the speed of sound by inducing a plasma, then you might be able to reduce the shockwave.



LEt me DIRECT ALiensun to this existing thread www.abovetopsecret.com...

ALso to Weird california sightings. www.abovetopsecret.com...

The reason you dont hear sonic booms in black tris are the way they use PLASMA to reduce air density in front of the Crafts leading edges to almost zero. Think ot the AIr molecules as RAIN. Now think of the Tri as a Windshield TREATED with RAIN-X. Being covered in GRAPHENE allows the entire crafts body to REPEL and SLIDE through the AIR.
Add to this its power source also reduces the crafts MASS while its in operation and you have a craft that can fly anywhere in this solar system in hours



new topics

top topics



 
54
<< 1  2    4 >>

log in

join