U.S. House passes estate tax repeal

It disgusts me to hear people want the government to take money that has already been taxed and steal it. Are you that dammed bitter of someone else's success that you would rather let the politicians have at it? Jesus! How about you look at the already taxed amount and then see what you have paid into America. Or better yet if you agree with this death tax theft you come up with a flat fee for dying? 10% would be $500k. Do you want to leave your family with that fee? So what's fair for your estate? We all use America the same, living here.
Unless you're living off of the government and voting people like Obama to get a hand out raise, then it makes since to you I guess. But once you have drained the successful people, destroyed innovation, broke down America, you are left with a dictator and huge government to direct its dumb slaves. Then its Hello Idiocracy! Whew, rant over.

a reply to: FyreByrd

I wanted to ask another source regarding the 'so-called' efficiency of 'private business'.

Additional key findings include:


Federal government employees were less expensive than contractors in 33 of the 35 occupational classifications POGO reviewed.
In one instance, contractor billing rates were nearly 5 times more than the full compensation paid to federal employees performing comparable services.
Private sector compensation was lower than contractor billing rates in all 35 occupational classifications we reviewed.
The federal government has failed to determine how much money it saves or wastes by outsourcing, insourcing, or retaining services, and has no system for doing so.
- See more at: www.pogo.org...

If your Mom and Pop bought a piece of property decades ago to start a business or farm on, and its location over the years became a hot spot for development and is now worth $10-15 million dollars or more (if you can find a buyer in this economy), you will have to pay taxes on its current fair market value over the allowable 5.4 million. That's whether you sell it or not.

While the federal estate tax was initially repealed as of January 1, 2010, on December 17, 2010 it was resurrected and applied retroactively back to January 1. The federal estate tax is collected on the transfer of a person's assets to his or her loved ones after death, and the total tax due is calculated by adding up the fair market values of all of the decedent's assets on the date of death and then applying estate tax credits and subtracting out allowable estate tax deductions.

originally posted by: queenofswords

By the same token, in the ridiculous analogy of the game of Monopoly, if you make poor decisions, lose money, pass up opportunities, get thrown in jail, and fail to manage your investments properly, should everbody else be responsible for you or feel guilty because they got ahead in the game and you didn't?

People need to stop worrying about everybody else's success and focus on what they CAN do to help themselves and THEIR family. The government needs to keep their hands off family assets already acquired. It's not theirs to tamper with. It belongs to the heirs.

You don't make decisions in Monopoly, it's the luck of the dice. So - nope that doesn't work.

And you seem to think people are jealous of others success (projection perhaps) and not all people share your limited definition of success. People are rightly upset at the rape and plunder of common resources by the monied interests - which the framers of the US Constitution worked very dilligently to keep from happening in these United States.

They saw, as we are seeing, the destructive potential of inherited and unlimited wealth. And for you benefit, I posted very well known (if one paid any attention in school) quote from many founders and their advisors (including the sainted Adam Smith) to support by facts. You do know who Adam Smith is right - he of the 'invisible hand' and all that theoritical rot. I truly hate policy made by C students that only read Cliff notes.

a reply to: FyreByrd

And pray tell, what is my definition of success? You don't know me, so you haven't got a clue. I assure you, it is not all about money. But this thread is about estate taxes, so naturally the conversation is focused on that piece of it.

There are many destructive things in our society. Inherited wealth is the least of it.

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: CB328

I see absolutely nothing wrong with accumulation of generational wealth

The founding fathers came here to get away from generational wealth and it's despotism.
The Republicans of course don't see anything wrong with tyranny.

And I thought it might have had something to do with taxation.

That would be 'taxation without representation'.

If you are going to quote a well-known slogan - quote it properly. And that was one of many injustices that the revolutionaries wanted to redress.

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
a reply to: CB328

Where the hell did you learn history?

Maybe there is something to fluoride and GMOs making people stupid

Someplace that actually taught facts of which you seem to be ignorance. Might I suggest a google search of founding fathers and inherited wealth to start - and find out what they actually had to say about it.

BTW - read what Adam Smith had to say about it (and it's perversion of common property) as well.

Fight ignorance - don't deny it.

I can't help but think of all the work it took these people to gain their wealth.
The reality is while my parents left me with bills most people I know get a "what"?
Even taxing it when the person dies much less again for the heirs.
Didn't it get taxed when earned?
What if your parents left you millions?
Yeah, I know...

Same here in the UK with the Mansion Tax, One would think there was a election coming up or something....Slimey low lifes will stoop to anything for your vote.

originally posted by: queenofswords
a reply to: intrepid


The top 1 percent of taxpayers pay more in federal income taxes than the bottom 90 percent.

Simple enough?

If it wasn't for "the evil rich", this country wouldn't have a pot to piss in.

From this 'Tax Foundation' funded and started by wealthy business people:

It was founded at the University Club in New York. Founding members included:
Alfred P. Sloan, General Motors Corporation, chairman
Donaldson Brown, General Motors Corporation financial vice president
William S. Farish, Standard Oil Company, President
Lewis H. Brown, President of the Johns-Manville Corporation
Its first chairman was Lewis H. Brown.
The Tax Foundation publishes studies on state on federal tax burdens, costs of tax compliance, and others like the impact of cigarette taxes on smuggling. The major public campaign of the Tax Foundation is its annual Tax Freedom Day, which calculates the total state and federal tax burden of the nation as a percentage of national income, and converts that into the portion of the year taxpayers must "work to pay taxes".

Funding
The Tax Foundation is funded by private donations from members, corporate donations, and donations from charitable foundation such as the Koch Foundation, Earhart Foundation, etc.

Not a particularly non-partisan organization....

www.sourcewatch.org...

You're gonna have to do a lot better....

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: FyreByrd

You can't justify an increase in taxes based on bigger populations because that doesn't justify departments like DHS.

It's my humble opinion, that government creates situations where people then require a need that wasn't there before government intervened, thereby justifying a reliance and a need for government, and thereby justifying an increase in taxes to fund the needs that were initiated by government in the first place.

LOL - I will agree that there is no justification for the DHS - but remember is was tax cutters that brought us that expensive boondoggle.

originally posted by: FyreByrd

YES - the framers of the constitution felt inherited weath would destroy the republic.

From the Economist:

www.economist.com...

If there was one thing the Revolutionary generation agreed on — and those guys who dress up like them at Tea Party conventions most definitely do not — it was the incompatibility of democracy and inherited wealth.

And Adam Smith was a topical reference of the time:

Jefferson cited Adam Smith, the hero of free market capitalists everywhere, as the source of his conviction that (as Smith wrote, and Jefferson closely echoed in his own words), "A power to dispose of estates for ever is manifestly absurd. The earth and the fulness of it belongs to every generation, and the preceding one can have no right to bind it up from posterity. Such extension of property is quite unnatural." Smith said: "There is no point more difficult to account for than the right we conceive men to have to dispose of their goods after death."

Our founders considered talking it even further:

Others wanted to go much further; Thomas Paine, like Smith and Jefferson, made much of the idea that landed property itself was an affront to the natural right of each generation to the usufruct of the earth, and proposed a "ground rent" — in fact an inheritance tax — on property at the time it is conveyed at death, with the money so collected to be distributed to all citizens at age 21, "as a compensation in part, for the loss of his or her natural inheritance, by the introduction of the system of landed property."

THIS!!![/B] As I was taught these basic principles, in accordance with natural law, the earth and its bounty belongs to all for the benefit of all... I cannot add much to what you've already provided. But I can say that under natural law no one has the right -- the natural inalienable right -- to inherit anything. One's parent can leave their worldly possessions to anyone and everyone as they choose. Even then, once they're gone, their wills (and therefore their will) can be contested and even changed. Dead people don't have rights... dead people don't need rights.

One more thing: Despite all the whining and crying about "redistribution of wealth," people either forget (or do not understand) that the sole purpose of money is redistribution!!! It is meant to be traded -- for goods, labor, services, whatever. The free market -- a true free market -- allows the bounty of the earth to be distributed as fairly and equitably as possible, according to available supply and the demands (needs and/or wants) of the living.

I can see not taxing a family owned and run business that passes from parent to child -- or other family members involved in the operation of that business -- because that business is the sum total of their blood, sweat and tears. I would not tax that business as long as the family continued to operate the business. I would say the same about homes -- as in primary residences, not investment properties. As long as the heir chooses to live in that home, fine. But if either the business or the home is going to be sold, it should be taxed. And those legal fictional entities called Corporations? Tax away.

originally posted by: seeker1963


Are you a farmer?

Anyone in your family a farmer?

It's the home grown and family farms that will keep Americans fed! Not the commercial corporate farms that promote and grow GMO crops!

The conversation really has nothing to do with farmers. The estate tax affects 0.2% of taxpayers, farmers make up 15% of the entire US workforce. Quit trying to play this, 'Oh, won't someone think of the farmers!' argument because it's not about them. Saying that you know a guy who knows a guy is anecdotal evidence and really, really doesn't apply to the argument at hand.

a reply to: Willtell

The democrats are pretty much the same.

except they are better at selling it to the sheeple than the GOP.

originally posted by: Metallicus
I hope to pass whatever I have on to me children. Why should the Government have my after tax wealth? They can bugger off.

Because generational wealth creates dynasties. The estate tax makes it so that every generation needs to earn their own way.

originally posted by: John_Rodger_Cornman
a reply to: Willtell

The democrats are pretty much the same.

except they are better at selling it to the sheeple than the GOP.

No the democrats are just human beings.

They have a better philosophy on issues that assist ordinary Americans…

The fact that they don’t live up to those higher empathetic and compassionate philosophical ideals just means their not perfect and are frail humans like all of us.


The GOP on the other hand are also human and prone to fraility, but their philosophy regarding issues is anti-empathetic and non compassionate, greedy, selfish and anti-human and pro elitist


That’s just the facts

Some of you people make my head hurt. Have any of you thought about how much in taxes you would have already paid to amass the 5+million in the first place? Then you want them to pay more??? Some of you spouting this 'everyone should start even, let their kids make their own way' BS are just ridiculous. For a bunch of people constantly spouting about how they want the government to stay out of their way, you sure don't mind when its the other guy (probably worked 50x harder than you at everything to get rich) getting the shaft and not you. You hate the government unless its your tool to inflict harm on others to compensate for your envy of them. Piss off hypocrite.

originally posted by: In4ormant
Some of you people make my head hurt. Have any of you thought about how much in taxes you would have already paid to amass the 5+million in the first place? Then you want them to pay more??? Some of you spouting this 'everyone should start even, let their kids make their own way' BS are just ridiculous. For a bunch of people constantly spouting about how they want the government to stay out of their way, you sure don't mind when its the other guy (probably worked 50x harder than you at everything to get rich) getting the shaft and not you. You hate the government unless its your tool to inflict harm on others to compensate for your envy of them. Piss off hypocrite.

Generational wealth is a very bad thing, to give one prominent example today, Wal Mart would not exist. The, estate tax is designed to kill business. As a result we would not have a mega corporation running around, putting others out of business, and increasing the cost of goods while being a major factor in lowering wages.

The estate tax makes corporations mortal. It is a very good thing.