Original words of Jesus Christ still being spoken now? will them survive until end of times?

The Peace of God to all that belong to the Light,
Dear Readers,

St John 15:7
If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you.

St Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

St Mark 5:41
He took her by the hand and said to her, "Talitha koum!" (which means "Little girl, I say to you, get up!").

Although the Gospels and also all the other books that refer to the teaching of Jesus Christ are already translated to any possible language that exist on earth, his very words were once spoken in a language that is almost disappeared over the face of the earth, it is called Aramaic and it is the mother tongue of all the Semitic languages.

For incredibly that it appears , and considering that modern languages that evolved from it are already in so mature stage like Arabic, Meqri, Soqotri, Shehri, Harsusi, Erithrean or Hebrew, there is still alive Aramaic language in our days.

The only real speakers of Aramaic in our days on the world are the Assyrians, where there is still on our days an important Christian community, in the North West of Iraq and in the borders with Syria.

The point is that this people with so ancient roots in middle east are right now targeted by the Islamic State of Syria and Levant (ISIL) also called Islamic State of Iraq and Syria ( ISIS) precisely for the fact that they are a very important ethnic group that is non Muslim but live in the perimeter of their sphere of influence.


aina.org...


The question here is if this language that is attached to the Christian faith in the Levant will be able survive until the end of times, or there will not be more Aramaic words in this planet when Jesus come back again to earth, as it is prophesied to occur in the end of times, in particular in the prophecies of the Apocalypses , the book of revelation of the new Testament.

Although all the political turmoil of Assyria shows that chances are that we will not listen Aramaic anymore in the world soon, the prophecies of Jesus seems to predict a very different outcome.

Here a link about the challenge that Assyrians are affronting right now:

www.msn.com...


Here some prophetic verses of the New Testament concerning the survival of the words and teachings of Jesus until the end of times:

St Luke 18, 8

I tell you, he will see that they get justice, and quickly. However, when the Son of Man comes, will he find faith on the earth?"

St John !2, 49
For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.

St Matthew 24,35
Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.

St Mark 13:31
Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.

St Luke 21:33
Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.

1 St Peter 1:25
but the word of the Lord endures forever." And this is the word that was preached to you.

The survival of a language that is by far the eldest one ever spoken in the western world is by itself a miracle, taking in account that other languages of less age like Sanskrit or Ancient Greek are already over, and Latin only exist in the city of Vatican.

Are we going to see a kind of miracle that will save the original language of Christ to remain until his second coming? or the facts in middle east are perhaps telling to us that his so announced second coming is sooner than we expect?

Here some links that give you an idea of the strange or almost paranormal ability that Assyrians have to be able to recover against all odds themselves of some of the most terrible genocides ever occurred in History:

www.ncas.rutgers.edu...

www.aramaicbooks.com...


Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness

Jesus didn't invent morality. We may not always know the right thing to do, but most of us know what we shouldn't be doing.

It's a moot point. The Gospels in the Bible were written far after the death of Jesus. In the case of John, over 100 years. Nobody really knows what he said. It's just a guy who heard a guy who heard a guy: total hearsay. So the fact that Aramic is or is not spoken is largely irrelevant.

The language it is in is inconsequential, it is the meaning of the words so that you understand the preachings. How else would he spread his preachings to the gentiles if not in their own languages?

a reply to: schuyler

Let me suggest respectfully to update yourself about recent Archeological findings, concerning evidences that validate the Bible.

The very first Gospel to be written of the four we call canonicals it is St Mark , not St John.

Now, in January of this year a copy of St Mark gospel on papyrus from the very first century , by sure from before 90 AD was found in an Egyptian mummy coffin.

Although at this point is premature to claim that is written in Aramaic, chances are since a dialect of that language was also spoken by Christian Coptics of Egypt.

www.christianexaminer.com...

Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness

a reply to: TinfoilTP

Well Dear Tinfoil,

Assyrians are Christians that belong to the most ancient tradition of this faith. They are not Christians because some other Christians missioners brought to them the news of the gospels translated in modern languages, with all the risks that such translations always involve. They became Christians of first hand, listening the disciples and apostles of Jesus to preach directly to them.

They could perfectly teach us many things in the original meaning that Jesus gave to the words better than any University or seminar in the western world.

So it is very consequential and extremely relevant that they have survived with their culture still intact so many genocides along History, since that special protection is one of the fundamental promises of Jesus to his followers, as you can read in the verses quoted at the opening post of this thread.

Martyrdoms have been many along History, but the miraculously ability of the original Christians to overcome them is what made possible the spread of the teachings of Jesus until our days.

If those first communities wouldn't survive all the prosecutions they affronted it should be irrelevant who was Jesus or what he taught, perhaps our modern civilization never have known even his name.

Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness

originally posted by: schuyler
It's a moot point. The Gospels in the Bible were written far after the death of Jesus. In the case of John, over 100 years. Nobody really knows what he said. It's just a guy who heard a guy who heard a guy: total hearsay. So the fact that Aramic is or is not spoken is largely irrelevant.

Error.

1) three of the four Gospel books were written before 68AD. Matthew 42AD (9 years), Mark 43AD (10 years), Luke 48 AD (15 years). the Gospel of John was written between 90-95, Revelation was written after this along with his three letters too. (John's gospel was written circa 57-62 years later).

BTW, all of these men saw and heard Jesus personally

a reply to: ChesterJohn

That is significant.

Sorry but when ever someone starts laying on bible verses, I think its all just gibberish. Ok all those verses you quoted, what the hell do they mean? I mean it's never really plain is it? None for me thanks. Truth need not hide, nor be spoken in an indirect manner.

Quote.
Are we going to see a kind of miracle that will save the original language of Christ to remain until his second coming? or the facts in middle east are perhaps telling to us that his so announced second coming is sooner than we expect?

Actually I believe his 2nd coming is going to happen in the very near future. No more than 5 years at the outside. And here's why.

In Matthew 24 he makes this statement about his return.

27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.


The question is "What does he mean by referencing the carcass?" And are we in the tribulation of those days currently?

After some thought on the subject I had a epiphany on that. In Matthew 24 verse 15 he makes an obvious reference to the book of Daniel. So what I realized was the "carcass" is another Daniel reference. Daniel 8 specifically. And if you read that prophecy what is Daniel trying to tell you? That in the beginning of the end times a powerful country in the west would attack and conquer 2 nations that were once part of the Persian empire. Literally the carcass is the Middle East. And the US conquered 2 nations back in the first decade of the 21st century. And now with ISIS and the Arab spring and all the various revolts and attacks in that area I can only conclude that we're currently in the the days of the tribulation of the carcass.

And the thing to worry about here? When they get tired of the violence over there and settle down.

a reply to: HUMBLEONE

There is something needed to understand the word of God. If you don't have it you will never understand it

Double post

originally posted by: The angel of light


Although the Gospels and also all the other books that refer to the teaching of Jesus Christ are already translated to any possible language that exist on earth, his very words were once spoken in a language that is almost disappeared over the face of the earth, it is called Aramaic and it is the mother tongue of all the Semitic languages.

How exactly is it the "mother tongue" when it's origins lie in Phonecia? It didn't appear until approx 800 BPE two and a half millennia after earlier Semitic language isolates like Akkadian? The Aramaic of today is not the Aramaic spoken 2000 years ago anymore than modern English is the same as Old English from the
Middle Ages.

For incredibly that it appears , and considering that modern languages that evolved from it are already in so mature stage like Arabic, Meqri, Soqotri, Shehri, Harsusi, Erithrean or Hebrew, there is still alive Aramaic language in our days.

You're forcing your own constructs and confirmation biases onto a system the doesn't require it. Aramaic is no more or less mature than Hebrew or Arabic for example. The linger a language isolate exists, the more it evolves and changes through the years.

The only real speakers of Aramaic in our days on the world are the Assyrians, where there is still on our days an important Christian community, in the North West of Iraq and in the borders with Syria.

Even in this example you neglect the fact that within these few churches keeping spoken Aramaic alive, there are 3 distinct dialects and not 1 homogenous language. There is Neo Assyrian, Neo Chaldean and Suryet/ Turoyo

The survival of a language that is by far the eldest one ever spoken in the western world is by itself a miracle, taking in account that other languages of less age like Sanskrit or Ancient Greek are already over, and Latin only exist in the city of Vatican.

Not the oldest spoken in the western world by a long shot. You may want to look into language groups like Indo European. It's where all your Semitic languages came from.

Are we going to see a kind of miracle that will save the original language of Christ to remain until his second coming? or the facts in middle east are perhaps telling to us that his so announced second coming is sooner than we expect?

Sorry, it's far too late for that. Modern Aramiac bares little resemblance to Imperial Aramaic used by the Achaemenids which bears little resemblance to the Aramaic spoken in the Levant at the dawn of the first millennia. The language you want to save exists in name only.

Neo-Aramaic, or Modern Aramaic, languages are varieties of Aramaic that are spoken vernaculars in the medieval to modern era, evolving out of Middle Aramaic dialects around AD 1200 (conventional date).

Modern Aramaic has existed in its current form for only 800 years +/-

originally posted by: schuyler
It's a moot point. The Gospels in the Bible were written far after the death of Jesus. In the case of John, over 100 years. Nobody really knows what he said. It's just a guy who heard a guy who heard a guy: total hearsay. So the fact that Aramic is or is not spoken is largely irrelevant.

Absolutely!

The angel of light: The Gospel of Marks has yet to be confirmed as such (discussed on another thread already). They have been analyzing it since 2012 but they have not published their findings as yet, it's all speculation.
www.skepticink.com...
www.livescience.com...

The oldest fragment of the new testament that have been analyzed and confirmed as such is Johns, which is from 125 - 200 CE. en.wikipedia.org...

Believing that the gospels were written by people who actually talked to Jesus is faith which has no evidence. Nothing wrong with having such faith, but for those who don't share such belief there is a lack of physical evidence to confirm it or prove it.

a reply to: peter vlar

How exactly is it the "mother tongue" when it's origins lie in Phonecia? It didn't appear until approx 800 BPE two and a half millennia after earlier Semitic language isolates like Akkadian? The Aramaic of today is not the Aramaic spoken 2000 years ago anymore than modern English is the same as Old English from the

First all It is clear that you are trying to point your darts in some target, but they are falling all in the area to the left of it.

1) Phoenician didn't speak at all Ancient Aramaic, they spoke a language called Phoenician that even does not belong to the same subfamily, it belongs to the Canaanite linguistic family, and it is right now a complete extinct language, no modern form of it survive as a common used tongue of any community.

2) The Canaanite languages are a subfamily of the Semitic languages, but a different one to Aramaic. They were spoken by the ancient peoples of the Canaan region, the Canaanites (including the northeastern Israelites and Phoenicians), Amorites, Ammonites, Moabites, Edomites, and Carthaginians. All of them seem to have become extinct as native languages by the early 1st millennium CE (although it is uncertain how long Punic survived).

3) Phoenician was written with the Phoenician script, an abjad (consonantary) originating from the Proto-Canaanite script that also became the basis for the Greek and hence the Latin alphabets. We are writing these replies essentially in Phoenician alphabet, an believe me it has nothing to do with Aramaic.

4)The area where Phoenician was spoken includes modern-day Lebanon, only coastal part of Syria, northeastern Israel, parts of Cyprus and, at least as a prestige language, some adjacent areas of Anatolia. It was also spoken in the area of Phoenician colonization along the coasts of the Southwestern Mediterranean, including those of modern Tunisia, Morocco, Libya and Algeria, as well as Malta, the west of Sicily, Sardinia, Corsica, Balearic islands and southernmost Spain.

5) The term "Aramaic", meaning the language of Arameans settling in the region of ancient Aram. Ancient Aram, bordering Northwestern Israel and what now is south interior Syria, is considered the linguistic epicenter of Aramaic, the language of the Arameans who settled the area during the Bronze Age circa 3500 BC. There is some confusion about the origin of the language, often mistaken to have originated within Assyria (Iraq). In fact, Arameans carried their language and writing into Mesopotamia by voluntary migration, by forced exile of conquering armies, and by nomadic Chaldean invasions of Babylonia in 1200 BC to 1000 BC

6) Aramaic, in distinction to what happened to all the Canaanites languages, actually evolved in much modern forms, as the three dialects you have already mentioned, that is the only part of your so extensive reply that is partially correct. Now, the fact that by the grace of God this is not a complete dead linguistic family, by having modern versions ease dramatically the study of the ancient forms, this is not like to try to find a Rosetta stone that help linguistics to grasp its meaning, has occurred with Ancient Egyptian or Ancient Maya for instance.

It is funny that you try to attack the fact that the Language has evolved in the last 20 centuries, everybody knows that a language can evolve in much shorter time like that, it is just to take a magazine of the 1950s to see how many new slangs have been created in just American English since then. Nevertheless, we have a path to follow to grasp whatever idiom of the past by knowing the essential grammar of modern English.

By the way, considering the tone of extreme arrogance of your reply I am surprised to see that you have trouble to know that Lebanon or Cyprus are different countries than Syria for instance, and that there is a dramatic difference in between our alphabet ( Phoenician) and the alphabet used to write Aramaic languages.

If you still are doubtful of what please give a glance to this text, written in Syriac Aramaic by a Catholic priest

Sy riac Aramaic Inscription at the Malabar Archbishop house

and to this text written in Syriac Aramaic in the XI century

Ancient middle book in Syriac Aramaic

finally this is the name of Jesus written in Syriac Aramaic, do you see any similarity with his name in our alphabet?

Name of Jesus written in Syriac Aramaic

No more comments from my side to your so extensive reply.

Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness