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Atheism and Monotheism

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posted on Apr, 14 2015 @ 09:30 PM
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originally posted by: Klassified
The default answer is: They were never "really" Christian to start with, or they wouldn't be an atheist now.

Yeah, I know. I just like to hear them throw that accusation out there.

It then begs the question. How do they know they're a real Christian?





posted on Apr, 14 2015 @ 09:32 PM
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originally posted by: WakeUpBeer

originally posted by: WarminIndy
Once you know, you can't unknow.


How do you explain formerly religious people?

For example, many atheists are former Christians.


Once you know, you can't unknow. Simple as that.

What really is Christianity to you? Is there an idea in your mind? What images are evoked when you think about Christians?

Do we all wear the same clothes? Do we all smoke the same brand of cigarettes? Do we all drink the same drink? Do we all eat the same food?

And many former atheists are now Christians.



posted on Apr, 14 2015 @ 09:36 PM
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originally posted by: WakeUpBeer

originally posted by: Klassified
The default answer is: They were never "really" Christian to start with, or they wouldn't be an atheist now.

Yeah, I know. I just like to hear them throw that accusation out there.

It then begs the question. How do they know they're a real Christian?



I would have no problem saying it.

You mean, how do I know I am a real Christian? Because I know Christ, that is how I know.

I don't know Plato, but I've read his stuff. I don't know Marx, but I've read his stuff. I don't know Richard Dawkins, but guess what...I've read his stuff.

I know because I know. I know because what I know can't find any other person to say that it is someone else. Once you know that, you can't unknow. Many people are walking around with an idea of Jesus, they don't actually know Jesus.

Who is this Jesus? Well, that's for me to know and you to find out.



posted on Apr, 14 2015 @ 09:41 PM
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a reply to: WarminIndy

So are you saying you've met Jesus himself then??? How do you know him outside of the idea of him??? Can you explain to me the event that took place that allows you to say "I know Him"???



posted on Apr, 14 2015 @ 10:02 PM
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originally posted by: WarminIndy
Once you know, you can't unknow. Simple as that.

I take this to mean, once you've truly experienced it you know it's the truth.



What really is Christianity to you? Is there an idea in your mind? What images are evoked when you think about Christians?

To me it is just one of the many religions that has taken root in the world. There is no singular image or stereotype that comes to mind when I think about Christians. In a broad sense, I see them as a large group of people who believe they have found the universal truth and feel persecuted because of the Biblical narrative. I feel it requires a level of ignorance (willful or un-willful) to believe in it whole-heatedly, in the face of evidence against the religion. Please note that I do not think Christians are utter morons!



Do we all wear the same clothes? Do we all smoke the same brand of cigarettes? Do we all drink the same drink? Do we all eat the same food?

No. Absolutely not! That would be very disturbing.



And many former atheists are now Christians.

If becoming a Christian improves their life, more power to them.


originally posted by: WarminIndy
I would have no problem saying it.

You mean, how do I know I am a real Christian? Because I know Christ, that is how I know.

I don't know Plato, but I've read his stuff. I don't know Marx, but I've read his stuff. I don't know Richard Dawkins, but guess what...I've read his stuff.

I know because I know. I know because what I know can't find any other person to say that it is someone else. Once you know that, you can't unknow. Many people are walking around with an idea of Jesus, they don't actually know Jesus.

Who is this Jesus? Well, that's for me to know and you to find out.

It's about having a personal relationship. I get that, as do many other former Christians. Many of which felt they knew Christ as well. I am one of them. It was never an idea of Christ. He wasn't just a guy I prayed to before a meal, or when I stumbled and felt remorse. I felt I experienced his presence.


edit on 4-14-2015 by WakeUpBeer because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2015 @ 10:04 PM
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originally posted by: mOjOm
a reply to: WarminIndy

So are you saying you've met Jesus himself then??? How do you know him outside of the idea of him??? Can you explain to me the event that took place that allows you to say "I know Him"???


Of course I have. Many people have. You probably did as well, but just weren't ready or didn't recognize Him.

Some people meet Jesus by very natural ways, some people meet Jesus in very supernatural ways. Event? Which particular one do you want? There have been many.

OK, here is one event...

On January 16, 1999, it was a little after 4 AM. I was alone in my house asleep. My husband was at work. I was awakened by the sound of a crash and jumped out of bed thinking someone was in my house. I opened the door and realized I wasn't dressed so I closed it again to get dressed. I then opened it again and was hit by a face full of smoke. Then I watched as one by one the electrical devices and light went off. I knew my house was on fire.

I didn't know what to do, it was dark and smoky. So I did what I thought I should do, I crawled to the bathroom to get a towel wet to put over my face, but it was dark and I could not see. My little dogs were there with me. Then I remembered a verse in the Bible and called out "God, you said that you would deliver me in my time of need, so deliver me!". I heard an audible voice to crawl out to the back door, so I did. As I was crawling past the smoke filled dark living room, I saw a man standing there holding the ceiling up and soon as I got past, it fell. I ran out the back door without my shoes, there was 3 feet of snow and the bank clock just a half a block away said the temperature was 16 degrees.

I knew that I had to get shoes, and went into the front door, into the foyer closet and got my shoes. Amazing, the front door was not locked. I called for my dogs and only one came out. Then I went to the neighbor's to wake them, but no one answered, then as I was going the two blocks over to my husband's aunt and uncle's house, men in a pickup truck stopped and they called the fire department. But their cell phone was a flip phone and I had never seen one before. It was exactly like the recent flip phones, not like what they had back in 1999.

So the fire department came, my husband's uncle went to get him from work and the firemen had to carry my other little dog out. That dog was still in the bathroom where I had just been.

After that, I wondered about the man, I prayed about it and Jesus answered that it was Him. I would not be here now if it had not been for the crashing sound that woke me up and that I had prayed to be saved from it, and He held the ceiling up. I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that is who it was. And that is one incident.

By the time the fire department got there, the whole living room, the dining room and the kitchen were all gutted. My bedroom, I could see where the fire went across my bed. My life was spared.

I am sorry that other people die in fires. I cannot say why that happens. But I am thankful for what happened for me.

By the way, a little personal advice, if your house is on fire you have seven minutes to get out. If you don't you will die of smoke inhalation before the fire gets you. So take that into consideration.
edit on 4/14/2015 by WarminIndy because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 14 2015 @ 10:16 PM
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originally posted by: WarminIndy

Of course I have. Many people have. You probably did as well, but just weren't ready or didn't recognize Him.

Some people meet Jesus by very natural ways, some people meet Jesus in very supernatural ways. Event? Which particular one do you want? There have been many.


Well, if I have met him then you're right, I either didn't recognize Him or he didn't bother to introduce himself. As far as how I would prefer to meet him I would prefer it to start off being in a totally natural and normal way like simply knocking on my door and saying hello or something. In fact the more normal the better that way it's not too confusing for me when it happens. After that I suppose I'll just go from there. Mainly I just want to be fully awake and stuff. If I wake up afterward or it's in a dream then I wouldn't trust that I wasn't just dreaming.

BTW, what was the significance of the guys in the truck having the cell phone?? Was that Jesus too or what, you didn't explain that part.



posted on Apr, 14 2015 @ 10:41 PM
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originally posted by: mOjOm

originally posted by: WarminIndy

Of course I have. Many people have. You probably did as well, but just weren't ready or didn't recognize Him.

Some people meet Jesus by very natural ways, some people meet Jesus in very supernatural ways. Event? Which particular one do you want? There have been many.


Well, if I have met him then you're right, I either didn't recognize Him or he didn't bother to introduce himself. As far as how I would prefer to meet him I would prefer it to start off being in a totally natural and normal way like simply knocking on my door and saying hello or something. In fact the more normal the better that way it's not too confusing for me when it happens. After that I suppose I'll just go from there. Mainly I just want to be fully awake and stuff. If I wake up afterward or it's in a dream then I wouldn't trust that I wasn't just dreaming.

BTW, what was the significance of the guys in the truck having the cell phone?? Was that Jesus too or what, you didn't explain that part.


When I first saw their phones, they were so unusual that it was strange, that is why I remembered it so much. Looking back on it, there was no other explanation for why. I don't know whether they were maybe angelic beings or it was a time warp.

But they were in the right place at the right time. I don't know how they travel through time or across dimensions, but I believe they do. I don't know how, so don't ask me to explain that.



posted on Apr, 14 2015 @ 10:52 PM
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a reply to: WarminIndy

So you never saw the guys in the truck again though. Like they didn't live down the road or anything is kinda what I'm asking. There were just some strangers who you never saw again after that??

It's an interesting story though I'll give that to ya. Glad you and your dogs are ok too and nobody was hurt.



posted on Apr, 14 2015 @ 11:18 PM
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here's an interesting story




posted on Apr, 14 2015 @ 11:33 PM
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Ok, enough personal stories. We should get back on topic I think. Also back to the claim that Atheism is controlled by Catholic Church and/or Dogma or that it is anything at all like Religion, which it isn't unless we change the definition of what a Religion is.



posted on Apr, 14 2015 @ 11:42 PM
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originally posted by: mOjOm
Ok, enough personal stories. We should get back on topic I think. Also back to the claim that Atheism is controlled by Catholic Church and/or Dogma or that it is anything at all like Religion, which it isn't unless we change the definition of what a Religion is.


the natural state is one of atheism, so i know that it doesn't need the papacy to control it, for it to exist. what i'm saying is, they started the movement in the european universities, so they could control it, and in preparation for that, they threw out over 5000 years of ancient history and convinced subsequent generations of college students, that none of it was real. it appears power over "truth" has always been their abiding interest.
edit on 14-4-2015 by undo because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 15 2015 @ 12:30 AM
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a reply to: undo

I think I see what you're getting at now. You're saying the church hijacked the whole growing interest by the populace of non-belief known as Atheism combined with other philosophical trends which were being included with Atheism at the time in an effort to control both the Principles of "Non-Belief and Belief" at the same time.

Is that pretty close???



posted on Apr, 15 2015 @ 01:06 AM
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originally posted by: mOjOm
a reply to: undo

I think I see what you're getting at now. You're saying the church hijacked the whole growing interest by the populace of non-belief known as Atheism combined with other philosophical trends which were being included with Atheism at the time in an effort to control both the Principles of "Non-Belief and Belief" at the same time.

Is that pretty close???


yeah, and i think they are controlling how much science we are allowed to know, the rest they hoard, just like the mystery school traditions have always done.



posted on Apr, 15 2015 @ 01:19 AM
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a reply to: undo

I've thought about that as well as others too. It's quite possible that they are, they certainly have the resources to buy up and hide whatever they want that's for sure.

However, if it's true that they are hiding some major scientific knowledge or technology I don't know how useful it is since it doesn't seem to be dong them much good either. The church in general has been losing much of it's power over time compared to what it had long ago so if they do have something hidden it must be either too powerful to ever use at all or is not understood by them or is useless at this point anyway. Unless you can think of some other reason they would keep something hidden and never use it.

I think another reason Religion and the Mystery schools are trying to run scientific research is because they actually think they know what is best, which is BS. They are far from being superior in morally. I think they may also be afraid of what someone may discover which would destroy the power structure of lies that they have built and are trying to maintain.



posted on Apr, 15 2015 @ 01:25 AM
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originally posted by: mOjOm
a reply to: undo

I've thought about that as well as others too. It's quite possible that they are, they certainly have the resources to buy up and hide whatever they want that's for sure.

However, if it's true that they are hiding some major scientific knowledge or technology I don't know how useful it is since it doesn't seem to be dong them much good either. The church in general has been losing much of it's power over time compared to what it had long ago so if they do have something hidden it must be either too powerful to ever use at all or is not understood by them or is useless at this point anyway. Unless you can think of some other reason they would keep something hidden and never use it.

I think another reason Religion and the Mystery schools are trying to run scientific research is because they actually think they know what is best, which is BS. They are far from being superior in morally. I think they may also be afraid of what someone may discover which would destroy the power structure of lies that they have built and are trying to maintain.


did you ever get a chance to read the "all roads lead to rome" thread? i didn't write it. it's at least a couple years old. the guy offers some striking evidence that the papacy was preparing to throw the religions it supposedly supports and created, under the bus. this means they are so successfully in control of atheism and science, that they no longer have use for catholics, christians and muslims. and since he wrote that thread, just look at the genocide of catholics, christians and muslims all over the middle and near east. you fellas are the new catholics. sorry about that. i wish ya luck, though.



posted on Apr, 15 2015 @ 01:37 AM
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a reply to: undo

Who are you fellas??? Are you still implying that Atheists are running some secret society that is destroying all Religion???

Because from what I see the people who are killing Religious people the most are other Religious people. Mostly Judaism, Christianity (Evangelical), and Islam. Although most of that is happening outside of the US at the moment.



posted on Apr, 15 2015 @ 01:55 AM
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originally posted by: mOjOm
a reply to: undo

Who are you fellas??? Are you still implying that Atheists are running some secret society that is destroying all Religion???

Because from what I see the people who are killing Religious people the most are other Religious people. Mostly Judaism, Christianity (Evangelical), and Islam. Although most of that is happening outside of the US at the moment.


nope, i'm saying that you have, as an atheist, been elected by the papacy to survive what appears to be a genocide of the catholics, christians and muslims. if i say i'm an atheist (although i'm not and wouldn't say that), i might survive, but that's contingent on not dying in a race war or war of political ideologies. think of it like a guy who has 5 children but he only likes one of them lol




edit on 15-4-2015 by undo because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 15 2015 @ 02:04 AM
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a reply to: undo

Ok, first of all, I'm sure I haven't been elected for anything. Second, atheists do not represent dome cohesive group. They just have one thing in common which is that they don't believe in some unproven, God, which since it's not proven to them to be true seems like a smart choice.

But anyway. Atheists are and have always been targets of the Religious Powers in the world. So to say any Atheists has been chosen to survive some alleged coming War is foolish. You honestly think Atheists won't be a target in the possible Religious War that various Religious followers are now starting??? In fact to say anyone other than those belonging to their own specific group won't be a target is foolish. Christian groups who engage in war will target every other group but their own. Same goes for any and every possible group you can imagine. Atheists in fact are always the target of every religion so to say they are the chosen ones makes me wonder who you believe is in charge of such a movement anyway???



posted on Apr, 15 2015 @ 02:10 AM
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Is this the thread you're referencing?

All Roads Lead to Rome

I have not read it, but your description of it sounds interesting.

I will have to give it a read. This theory is not something I have heard of. I'm somewhat familiar with conspiracy theories that the RCC wants to bring all religions under its fold by slowly watering them down and making them new age. A one world religion for a one world order type of thing. I'm not sure if I believe that, but I definitely felt there was some interesting evidence to suggest it. Things like big TBN (Trinity Broadcasting Network) personalities slowly changing their messages to embrace the RCC (many Christians disdain the RCC), or other unBiblical things.

Could be a conspiracy. Could just be people's opinions changing over time.

Anyway.. As much as I dislike organized religion, I disagree that genociding the faithful is the way to go.

I also disagree that as an atheist I've been chosen for anything like you've suggested. I pretty much agree with mOjOm in these regards. So I won't elaborate to essentially repeat the same points.



edit on 4-15-2015 by WakeUpBeer because: (no reason given)




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