If you could be a spook, would you?

Title is it all.

I will elaborate though.

I was inspired after seeing another thread and some responses that popped up.

We all talk about how evil the CIA is or the KGB was, BUT, if you had the skills, physical capability, intelligence, willpower, strength of mind, and ability to do anything necessary regardless of your own morality, instinctual repulse, and whatever it is that you think a spook must build up inside and compose himself of.....Would you be a spook?

There are several types of intelligence personnel. If you think you would be a better handler after paying your dues, or would be better geared for combat and intelligence, or whatever, I dont even know to tell you the truth. What ever you feel that you would be good as, analyst whatever, would you?

So if you think you COULD say so, if you think you COULD, but wouldnt say why. If you WOULD for whatever reason say so as well.

I have a gut feeling that most who criticise these people would be them in a heart beat. You wouldnt be untouchable and would have to face some pretty nasty things coming your way....but over all, domestically, you would be king. I think that would make most people throw their past thoughts aside and join the hell up. Honestly, I would.

I know those of you who have actually had interactions with spooks would probably say HELL NO, and mean it. Thats fine. You probably have better reasons than ANY of us, myself included. I am more curious if people who have never even heard of these people and their world outside of movies and such have ever really asked themselves if they would or could be that person.

Me? I want to think I COULD, though I am being less than realistic. I would probably not even make the cut. As far as WOULD? I think I would. I am ever changing my reality and what was true for me before is not necessarily so now. Maybe its from defending a moderate position and getting blasted for it that I have seen the virtue of peace through might. Maybe I have just seen that peace through acquiescence is a lie.

I dont know. Its not even something you would know. Either you could do horrible things and be horrible to get things done no matter what, or you couldnt. I and most would probably shut down and die. There are a few though, that would meet the challenge and for better or worse would excell in this world.

So, um, thoughts?

Been dere, done dat:

a reply to: intrepid
Watch out, my avvy is geared up to catch the likes of you!

a reply to: tadaman

Hell no.

I have self respect, a moral compass, a conscious AND I see the the illusion of nations for what the are.

I'd rather help people that actually need the help than do the bidding of political (corporate) overlords.

originally posted by: tadaman
a reply to: intrepid
Watch out, my avvy is geared up to catch the likes of you!

Don't cross the streams.

Only if I can do things like the milk tray man.
Hell yes.

a reply to: intrepid

Nope, not even when you pee. Unless.....you answer the following question incorrectly. Then all bets are off.

a reply to: tadaman

No way in hell! Wouldn't want to live always wondering when I'm gonna get stabbed in the back.

a reply to: boymonkey74

I would rather be MI6 than CIA or other american intelligence. You guys seem to be the epitome of all things spy and bad ass as far as intelligence services.


I dont know. Its like your MI6 is more professional and has more of a justifiable purpose.

a reply to: tadaman

A response:





My savior/destroyer.

As to your question up to about 10 years ago, hell yeah. I just don't have the energy now.

a part of me says yes. no matter how many years go by, the romance and excitement of all those spy novels and movies makes one's trigger finger rather itchy. family, mortgage, job... doesn't make sense. but why is bourne so cool? why does bond and mission impossible make us dream a little inside? for god and country. maybe. kill bad guys, blow stuff up, get some action on the side, and never have to explain yourself to the authorities. if I was 22, and if they recruited me, yeah, i'd do it.

I would only do it if I could be involved with UFOs and didn't have to kill anyone.

I'd probably say yes to any offer of a more interesting life than the one I have, good or evil. Why not at this point?

"f you could be a spook, would you?" I thought that you meant to be a 'dead man' walking? Well, I thought also that maybe one doesn't have a choice in the matter. Just sayin'. Good luck, spooks!

a reply to: pikypiky

LOL, I saw that coming. I just didnt want to make a long ass title writing out "intelligence" operative.

Plus I always liked the name "spook". Its spooky,

I would set aside my morals in an attempt to climb ranks - only to try make a difference from the inside out.

a reply to: tadaman

I'd help out if called to save peoples lives but spying really isn't remotely like that.

Nope.

That sort of life isn't a lot like what you see on 24 or whatever. It's not like you're skulking around Beirut cutting children's throats for kicks or something. I'm not sure why you'd be morally repulsed by most of what goes on. I suspect you'd agree that data collection is necessary. Most of that is gotten with signal intercept, but you have a number of "spooks" who got their data by acting like they're a Canadian tourist who's a photography nut, so sorry didn't know I wasn't supposed to be here sort of thing. Or you hire on to a company under false ID and merrily copy things for later transmission, or get a nice government placement and do likewise.

Most of it's as mundane as can be with the exception of the occasional photo or dropping a signal intercept device, or ferrying some data from here to there, and you don't know what, or from whom. A lot of it is sitting around and noticing who comes and goes and when, or what comes and goes and when, and drinking a lot of coffee.

The sneaking around and killing people thing is generally confined to a very exclusive subset of spookdom. By far, most are lab geeks who never see the field, and most of the field people are in jobs that are dull as dirt. With the proviso that if you get caught things tend to be bad. So it's exciting for the field guy, in a sort of "if I screw up I get the soldering iron in the bum" way, but not so much what he's doing at the time, for the most part.

Being a handler requires years of field work first, and then you have to be a used car salesman with no soul, because you are selling locals on the wonders of snooping around with insufficient training, knowing they'll likely get the soldering iron.

Personally, I was offered a shot at selection for SCS coming out of school, and turned it down. I did think about it overnight. But it's a lot more fun to be able to fart around here than to be stuck in some backwater European hellhole planting bugs in embassies. Screw that. The death rate for SCS is way too high. I like not being dead, and I intend my rump to be soldering iron free for another 30-40 years.

a reply to: chr0naut

Unless you are really smart then no, you would probably be a dime a dozen hired gun. Smart enough to scare and convince powerful people to do what other powerful people want.

If you are smart enough you could end up sitting pretty, doing analyst work. When they are done with you move into the private sector and live richly...

LOL. MOST arent that smart, and when they are they dont need to follow others.

Most would be used and tossed away like an empty soda can. Some people know that and still roll the dice.

live....quickly

originally posted by: tadaman
a reply to: chr0naut

Unless you are really smart then no, you would probably be a dime a dozen hired gun. Smart enough to scare and convince powerful people to do what other powerful people want.

If you are smart enough you could end up sitting pretty, doing analyst work. When they are done with you move into the private sector and live richly...

LOL. MOST arent that smart, and when they are they dont need to follow others.

Most would be used and tossed away like an empty soda can. Some people know that and still roll the dice.

live....quickly

... disavow all knowledge.

What a way to see the world!

The problem is not the requirement for some extra mental muscle, it's more related to human nature. What do think your job would be like if your boss was unrestrained by ethics or governance?

Look at what they are doing to Snowden & others. It is a system where anything humane is weakness. Unless you got to the top, life would end up being hell, guaranteed.

Even cryptanalysis (something I could probably do) ends up with no-one trusting anyone (read a little about what they did to Turing).

Ultranope.