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Go Fund Me- Chemtrail testing?

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posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 11:15 AM
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a reply to: R3zn8D

Thanks for lots of text. this thread is about the idea to fund a flight to test trails to end the chemtrail debate. Do you have any thoughts or ideas about that?




posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 11:25 AM
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a reply to: network dude

References at bottom of page:
climateviewer.com...

They have already done that, plenty. ACCESS II flights, joint FAA/NASA testing biofuels for contrail control:
www.nasa.gov...


International Cirrus Experiment, 1987-1993
Participants: France, Germany, United Kingdom

Microphysical and Optical Properties of Cirrus and Contrails: Cloud Field Study on 13 October 1989

Lidar Network Observations of Cirrus Morphological and Scattering Properties during the International Cirrus Experiment 1989: The 18 October 1989 Case Study and Statistical Analysis

Influence of fuel sulfur on the composition of aircraft exhaust plumes: The experiments SULFUR 1–7, 1994-1998
elib.dlr.de...

SUbsonic aircraft: Contrail & Clouds Effects Special Study (SUCCESS) 1996
SUbsonic aircraft: Contrail & Cloud Effects Special Study SUCCESS“We plan to better determine the radiative properties of cirrus clouds and of contrails so that satellite observations can better determine their impact on Earth’s radiation budget. We hope to determine how cirrus clouds form, whether the exhaust from subsonic aircraft presently affects the formation of cirrus clouds, and if the exhaust does affect the clouds whether the changes induced are of climatological significance. We seek to pave the way for future studies by developing and testing several new instruments. We also plan to better determine the characteristics of gaseous and particulate exhaust products from subsonic aircraft and their evolution in the region near the aircraft.“

In Situ Observations of Particles in Jet Aircraft Exhausts and Contrails for Different Sulfur-containing Fuels, 1996

Global Warming and Ice Ages – Prospects for Physics-Based Modulation of Global Change, Edward Teller, Lowell Wood, Roderick Hyde. 1997

“We expect that introduction of scattering-optimized alumina particles into the stratosphere may well be overall competitive with use of sulfur oxides; alumina particles offer a distinctly different environmental impact profile.”

First Direct Sulfuric Acid Detection in the Exhaust Plume of a Jet Aircraft in Flight, 1998

Dilution of Aircraft Exhaust Plumes at Cruise Altitudes, 1998

Long-Range Weather Prediction And Prevention of Climate Catastrophes – A Status Report. Edward Teller, Lowell Wood, Roderick Hyde. 1999

Ultrafine Particle Size Distributions Measured in Aircraft Exhaust Plumes, 2000

In Vitro Toxicity of Aluminum Nanoparticles in Rat Alveolar Macrophages, 2001

Regional Variations in U.S. Diurnal Temperature Range for the 11–14 September 2001 Aircraft Groundings: Evidence of Jet Contrail Influence on Climate, 2004

Active Climate Stabilization – Practical Physics-Based Approaches to Prevention of Climate Change. Edward Teller, Lowell Wood, Roderick Hyde.

Particles and Cirrus Clouds (PAZI-2) Final Report, 2004

ATM Contrail Mitigation Options Environmental Study 2005


Of course your could do an independent study to test the trails, ground based LIDAR from any college should do the trick or rent a plane and try not to get jailed =)

edit on 4/9/2015 by R3zn8D because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 11:40 AM
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originally posted by: R3zn8D
Of course your could do an independent study to test the trails, ground based LIDAR from any college should do the trick or rent a plane and try not to get jailed =)


LOL, loosen up that tin foil hat. there are companies that rent planes to do just this type of testing.

Since all the previous testing was not enough to stop the claims of chemtrails, I thought a definitive test with the perimeters agreed upon by as many "leaders" as would be involved would end this debate. Just think, either all your fears would be substantiated and instead of bickering about it, we could all pressure the government (or whomever is doing this) to make it public and have oversight, or all your fears could be smashed and you could devote your time to other pressing issues.

I'd say it's a win/win for all. What do you think?



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 11:55 AM
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originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: R3zn8D
Of course your could do an independent study to test the trails, ground based LIDAR from any college should do the trick or rent a plane and try not to get jailed =)


LOL, loosen up that tin foil hat. there are companies that rent planes to do just this type of testing.

Since all the previous testing was not enough to stop the claims of chemtrails, I thought a definitive test with the perimeters agreed upon by as many "leaders" as would be involved would end this debate. Just think, either all your fears would be substantiated and instead of bickering about it, we could all pressure the government (or whomever is doing this) to make it public and have oversight, or all your fears could be smashed and you could devote your time to other pressing issues.

I'd say it's a win/win for all. What do you think?


1. The jail comment was referring to sky jockeys hopping in a private jet and appearing unannounced behind a commercial flight. I'm sure that would raise some heads to say the least.

2. Define "leaders." Leaders matter little, they are talk boxes set atop corporate money piles.

3. Parameters for testing are simple, give me a full breakdown of particulates for each type of fuel/additive package:
Jet A, A1, B, JP-8, JP-8+100, FT, HEFA, and the rest of the GMO biofuels pile. Then you will realize that no two planes are burning the same crap, and very little of these "trade secret" ingrediants are tested by the EPA etal, so which "leaders" would you like to poll for your parameters?

4. I have zero fears.... I only fear that which I do not understand.

I think people should probably start by reading things, like, actually reading them. 99% of the facts are known:
climateviewer.com...





edit on 4/9/2015 by R3zn8D because: to be less of a jerk =)



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 12:40 PM
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originally posted by: R3zn8D

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: R3zn8D
Of course your could do an independent study to test the trails, ground based LIDAR from any college should do the trick or rent a plane and try not to get jailed =)


LOL, loosen up that tin foil hat. there are companies that rent planes to do just this type of testing.

Since all the previous testing was not enough to stop the claims of chemtrails, I thought a definitive test with the perimeters agreed upon by as many "leaders" as would be involved would end this debate. Just think, either all your fears would be substantiated and instead of bickering about it, we could all pressure the government (or whomever is doing this) to make it public and have oversight, or all your fears could be smashed and you could devote your time to other pressing issues.

I'd say it's a win/win for all. What do you think?


1. The jail comment was referring to sky jockeys hopping in a private jet and appearing unannounced behind a commercial flight. I'm sure that would raise some heads to say the least.

Just as in the air tests your site mentions, they are very possible. Otherwise, you would not have data from previous tests.


2. Define "leaders." Leaders matter little, they are talk boxes set atop corporate money piles.

This is for the one's who will claim it's lies, or done wrong, or the wrong trails were tested. I need the ones who squawk the loudest. Like Wigington, Carnicom, Jones, and any other promoter of chemtrails.


3. Parameters for testing are simple, give me a full breakdown of particulates for each type of fuel/additive package:
Jet A, A1, B, JP-8, JP-8+100, FT, HEFA, and the rest of the GMO biofuels pile. Then you will realize that no two planes are burning the same crap, and very little of these "trade secret" ingrediants are tested by the EPA etal, so which "leaders" would you like to poll for your parameters?

4. I have zero fears.... I only fear that which I do not understand.

I think people should probably start by reading things, like, actually reading them. 99% of the facts are known:
climateviewer.com...






To be honest, I kind of dismissed your site due to the confusion you seem to have with cloud seeding being associated with contrails. that level of misunderstanding is rare. (or perhaps I am missing something)

My one and only reason for trying to debunk this for good is the misidentification of contrails. I am fully aware of cloud seeding, and Geo-engineering ideas. My problem is when someone points to a contrail and claims it's a chemtrail because......insert whatever unproven idea here.

Contrails are those white puffy lines in the sky left behind planes. They are my only concern in this arena. I am aware that airplane exhaust is just like any other engine that burns fuel, and it will contain pollution. But, since those white lines are mostly water in the frozen state, I intend to prove just that. Or, I will be hugely surprised and have to explain to everyone that chemtrails are real. But unlike all others, I will have proof that cannot be denied.

I just want to be sure that before this is done, all the parameters are explained, understood, and agreed upon. By folks just like you.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 12:47 PM
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a reply to: R3zn8D




or rent a plane and try not to get jailed =)

tell me about it...

amazing what some "special" types are allowed to get away with on this site:
calling on members to assist in a conspiracy to commit federal crimes.

probably cackling in some dark, damp basement: "that'll get rid of them chemmies...MUAHAHAHAHA!"

if chemtrails weren't real, why the constant use by naysayers of such despicable, underhanded tactics among others?



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 01:28 PM
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originally posted by: AdamuBureido
a reply to: R3zn8D




or rent a plane and try not to get jailed =)

tell me about it...

amazing what some "special" types are allowed to get away with on this site:
calling on members to assist in a conspiracy to commit federal crimes.

Um, I am willing to do this all on my own. While your online persona may be arrested and exiled, your physical person will remain safe and intact.


probably cackling in some dark, damp basement: "that'll get rid of them chemmies...MUAHAHAHAHA!"

to which I reply, "Muhahahahah!"


if chemtrails weren't real, why the constant use by naysayers of such despicable, underhanded tactics among others?




Good Lord, I am offering a way to find the truth, and not cost you any money in doing so, and my tactics are underhanded? I am not sure how that works. It the thought of having the chemtrail conspiracy busted to much for some to take? I promise, even after it's proven that contrails are made of ice crystals, you will still be free to believe whatever you wish. (permitting you live in a free country)



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 01:29 PM
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originally posted by: AdamuBureido
a reply to: R3zn8D




or rent a plane and try not to get jailed =)

tell me about it...

amazing what some "special" types are allowed to get away with on this site:
calling on members to assist in a conspiracy to commit federal crimes.

probably cackling in some dark, damp basement: "that'll get rid of them chemmies...MUAHAHAHAHA!"

if chemtrails weren't real, why the constant use by naysayers of such despicable, underhanded tactics among others?




It was a joke and your response, as well as the OPs, is a distraction from the facts.

Contrails are not just water, they hurt the environment, probably are causing more heating than CO2, acid rain is a bitch, and oh, by the way, scientists are trying to regulate fuel contents to turn contrails into "COOLING CONTRAILS" therefore it IS a geoengineering SRM experiment.

Do you guys understand these terms?

Chemtrails and cloud seeding
www.youtube.com...

edit on 4/9/2015 by R3zn8D because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 01:33 PM
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originally posted by: R3zn8D

originally posted by: AdamuBureido
a reply to: R3zn8D




or rent a plane and try not to get jailed =)

tell me about it...

amazing what some "special" types are allowed to get away with on this site:
calling on members to assist in a conspiracy to commit federal crimes.

probably cackling in some dark, damp basement: "that'll get rid of them chemmies...MUAHAHAHAHA!"

if chemtrails weren't real, why the constant use by naysayers of such despicable, underhanded tactics among others?




It was a joke and your response, as well as the OPs, is a distraction from the facts.

Contrails are not just water, they hurt the environment, probably are causing more heating than CO2, acid rain is a bitch, and oh, by the way, scientists are trying to regulate fuel contents to turn contrails into "COOLING CONTRAILS" therefore it IS a geoengineering SRM experiment.

Do you guys understand these terms?


I fully understand those things. But, how does the term "chemtrail" come into play here? You seem to be discussing contrails. I think everyone of the debunkers here has a very firm grasp on that subject.

Are you aware that NASA is pretty sure that contrails have a net warming effect? (I used effect instead of affect even though I feel better the other way.)

Exactly what is your point?



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 01:53 PM
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a reply to: R3zn8D

I just watched the video you linked and you have a lot of facts that are true. It seems you just have some confusion on a few things, or I do.

First off, cloud seeding, it's done by small planes or rockets and it involves putting silver iodide or dry ice into an existing cloud that has potential to cause rain. Calling contrails cloud seeing is incorrect. I get that you have some official source for that, but (in my understanding) it's not at all the same thing.

Carbon suit, yet, it's one of the things that comes out of the plane exhaust. I wonder, have you looked at the amount that comes from a plane as opposed to the amount that comes from a car, or a truck? I just want you to understand which battle needs more attention. If you are against pollution (which I think everyone is) then, focusing on the biggest producers and working your way down, may be a better use of resources. (IMHO)



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 02:47 PM
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a reply to: network dude




I propose having some of the leaders of the chemtrail meme on board. Dane Wiggington, Cliff Carnicon, Alex Jones.


If we could get Dane Wigington to go we would have to get Mick West to go up with them and film the testing as it is done.

The look on Mr. Wigington's face would be priceless.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 03:02 PM
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originally posted by: tsurfer2000h
a reply to: network dude




I propose having some of the leaders of the chemtrail meme on board. Dane Wiggington, Cliff Carnicon, Alex Jones.


If we could get Dane Wigington to go we would have to get Mick West to go up with them and film the testing as it is done.

The look on Mr. Wigington's face would be priceless.


I would love to find what pitfalls might be thrown at us if this was tried. I would think the chemtrail community would be behind something like this, but their silence for the most part leads me to believe they have no desire for truth, only confirmation of biased ideas. I do agree and admit that making Mr. Wiggington accept that he is full of crap is the driving force for this idea.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 03:06 PM
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a reply to: R3zn8D




Do you guys understand these terms?


I have to ask why you are not explaining what this additive is for, and why it is used?


How it works
As jet uel is routed around turbine engines it is exposed to extremely high temperatures. Resulting chemical reactions cause color change, gum ormation and carbon or coke deposits on metal suraces that can disrupt the ow and efcient combustion o the jet uel.



Our unique, proprietary additive, SPEC-Aid 8Q462, interrupts the various chemical mechanisms that take place in the uel. In dirty systems, SPEC-Aid 8Q462 frst shuts down reactions that cause carbon and coke buildup as the uel is thermally stressed. Next, the detergent in the additive begins binding to existing carbon-on-metal suraces. In the highly turbulent environments o a turbine engine, a cleaning action is created as the additive ows through the system.


www.scribd.com...

Well if you made this blatant an error what makes you think the rest of your video is any different...which btw it isn't.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 03:09 PM
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a reply to: network dude




I do agree and admit that making Mr. Wiggington accept that he is full of crap is the driving force for this idea.


You sly mason you....



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 04:05 PM
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originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: network dude


But what does any of that have to do with the chemtrail theory?

Chemtrail theory is a distraction from pollution, designed to reduce any real discussion into argument and derailment away from the environmental issues. You could try and see if a discussion about real jet exhaust goes anywhere…


Good point. The Chemtrail slingfest reminds me of the great climate change debate. Both sides are clamoring for their own, meanwhile there is seemingly no stopping the coporations in their apparent quest of utterly destroying/polluting every bit of our land, water, and sky.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 04:20 PM
link   

originally posted by: tsurfer2000h
a reply to: R3zn8D




Do you guys understand these terms?


I have to ask why you are not explaining what this additive is for, and why it is used?


How it works
As jet uel is routed around turbine engines it is exposed to extremely high temperatures. Resulting chemical reactions cause color change, gum ormation and carbon or coke deposits on metal suraces that can disrupt the ow and efcient combustion o the jet uel.



Our unique, proprietary additive, SPEC-Aid 8Q462, interrupts the various chemical mechanisms that take place in the uel. In dirty systems, SPEC-Aid 8Q462 frst shuts down reactions that cause carbon and coke buildup as the uel is thermally stressed. Next, the detergent in the additive begins binding to existing carbon-on-metal suraces. In the highly turbulent environments o a turbine engine, a cleaning action is created as the additive ows through the system.


www.scribd.com...

Well if you made this blatant an error what makes you think the rest of your video is any different...which btw it isn't.


that brochure is on MY scribd... tell me something new bro
www.scribd.com...



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 04:29 PM
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originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: R3zn8D

I just watched the video you linked and you have a lot of facts that are true. It seems you just have some confusion on a few things, or I do.

First off, cloud seeding, it's done by small planes or rockets and it involves putting silver iodide or dry ice into an existing cloud that has potential to cause rain. Calling contrails cloud seeing is incorrect. I get that you have some official source for that, but (in my understanding) it's not at all the same thing.

Carbon suit, yet, it's one of the things that comes out of the plane exhaust. I wonder, have you looked at the amount that comes from a plane as opposed to the amount that comes from a car, or a truck? I just want you to understand which battle needs more attention. If you are against pollution (which I think everyone is) then, focusing on the biggest producers and working your way down, may be a better use of resources. (IMHO)



Carbon black soot is a cloud condensation nuclei, water sticks to the soot and makes clouds. Clouds are persisting likely due to exotic microemulsions attaching to the soot, or nanoparticle additives are acting as CCN.

I've written extensively on commercial clouds seeding using silver iodide, lead iodide, urea (fertilizer), CO2 (dry ice), and all the rest:
TOC: climateviewer.com...

Weather Modification Corporations, Universities, and Derivative Traders
climateviewer.com...

The History of Cloud Seeding: From Pluviculture to Hurricane Hacking
climateviewer.com...

Hurricane Hacking: The Department of Homeland Security enters the weather modification business
climateviewer.com...

"Calling contrails cloud seeing is incorrect."
Inadvertant cloud seeding is what the weather modification association and the american meteorological society call it:

Stratocumulus Decks – labs for inadvertent & planned cloud seeding (contrails, ship tracks)
www.youtube.com...

Simulation results of unintentional aircraft-induced cloud clearing
www.youtube.com...

Inadvertent Cloud Seeding – Hole Punch and Canal Clouds
www.youtube.com...

Aircraft-induced Hole Punch and Canal clouds – Inadvertent Cloud Seeding
journals.ametsoc.org...

Observations of a glaciating hole-punch cloud
arxiv.org...

Of course, contrails are modifying the weather and climate, likely MORE than commercial seeding:

On The Climate response to Cirrus Cloud Seeding (2015)
ams.confex.com...

ON THE POSSIBILITY OF WEATHER MODIFICATION BY AIRCRAFT CONTRAILS 1970
docs.lib.noaa.gov...

Weather Modification by Carbon Dust Absorption of Solar Energy 1974 (CARBON BLACK) digitool.library.colostate.edu...


I wonder, have you looked at the amount that comes from a plane as opposed to the amount that comes from a car, or a truck?

Trucks aren't making clouds that trap heat and make acid rain, among other things.

If you are against pollution (which I think everyone is) then, focusing on the biggest producers and working your way down, may be a better use of resources.

I have, in fact, I mapped the world's largest polluters in 3D (Google Earth):
climateviewer.com...

Click Pollution


edit on 4/9/2015 by R3zn8D because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 04:55 PM
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I say raising the funds for testing on a public Go Fund Me platform is a great idea.

Raise the funds then go to the prominent figures out there on the subject that perpetuate it and pose the question to them of why they don't test.

If the answer is money then "Voila, we have the money sirs when can you be ready?" Make sure this is all video recorded as well.

Hell make a documentary on it. Name it afterwards depending on the results. If the prominent figures weasel out of it then document that as well.

I would watch that documentary either way it went because I like watching things that are evidenced. If it proves there are chems then I would want to know as much as possible if it proves there isn't or that those that push that there are to be dishonest and not take part I will like to see them busted.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 05:50 PM
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a reply to: R3zn8D

You do have documents that call it cloud seeding, so I will have to give you that one. But, if you know what actual (make it rain) cloud seeding is, and you are discussing chemtrails and geo-enginseering, then you muddy the waters like the idiotic claim that all clouds have H20 which is a chemical, so they are all chemtrails.

If you are going to put as much effort into this as you seem to be doing, you may want to listen to some other folks instead of thinking you hold all the knowledge. Even your worst enemy may have something to offer you.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 07:11 PM
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originally posted by: intrptr

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: network dude


What would it take to prove chemtrails are either real, or a paranoid delusion? From all I have seen here, the only real way to do this is to fly up and test a trail that everyone agrees fits the narrative of a chemtrail.

Jet exhaust can be measured in static tests on the ground… if the rotors are turning the fuel is burning.


if you want to measure exhaust, that would be a fine way to do it. In fact, you could start with your car, move on to buses, then 18 Wheelers, and finish up with Jumbo Jets. Then you could find which one pollutes more per capita.

Don't forget coal fired power plants, oil and steel refineries, Industrial mining, shipping and manufacturing facilities. Much bigger polluters than the family car, which I don't own by the way. I don't fly either.



Mmm, that's right, And Earthbound ships are one of the tops.



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