It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

What's wrong with Conservatives?

page: 6
9
<< 3  4  5    7 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 10:41 AM
link   
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Great observations as usual!

Oh yes, as far as the two threads, one of these things is NOT like the other.


Personally, I look forward to all political parties splintering into a thousand fragments. Then perhaps we could 1) have the government get back to the Peoples' business rather than getting themselves re-elected and 2) we as voters would stop having to choose the lesser of two evils and might, might, get to vote our true conscience once in a while.




posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 10:54 AM
link   
hehe president obama should become a singer when he retires



people would buy his music, hand over fist, and then he wouldn't have to piss people off to make money


he can sing!

see, rock star in or out of the white house.

edit on 9-4-2015 by undo because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 11:00 AM
link   
a reply to: Gryphon66

they look the same to me. there's like 3 conservatives, 1 or so moderates (such as yours truly), 10 liberals and a couple independents (like the op, for example) . the conversation is pretty much the same.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 11:12 AM
link   
a reply to: STTesc One thing wrong with conservatives: They made up the non-existent 'gay agenda'. It simply doesn't exist. They are somehow oddly obsessed with people in general and what gay people in specific, do in their bedrooms. I am not gay, but by stating that, and normally expecting to receive all the rights that everyone else has am I pushing a 'Straight Agenda'?



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 12:07 PM
link   

edit on 12Thu, 09 Apr 2015 12:07:39 -050015p122015466 by Gryphon66 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 12:17 PM
link   

originally posted by: STTesc
First, I'm a registered Republican, though I view my stance more Libertarian than Conservative. And since I made a "what's wrong with Liberals" thread, why not make this one too?

As a Republican, we have no Presidential candidates that can beat Hillary. As much as I like Ron Paul, he's not running. His son is. And his son is very different from his father. Now that might be just Rand playing their game or he truly might be far more Conservative than I'd like. Either way, I still don't see the man beating Hillary. And who does that leave?

Jeb Bush is not going to win. Even Conservatives don't want another Bush elected. We've had enough of the stupidity with 2 Presidents already. Dear God PLEASE no Jeb Bush. Honestly, do you think he's going to win? Mr. amnesty that pretends to represent you? Jeb Bush, just as Romney, are unelectable.

The infighting within the GOP needs to stop. Conservatives need to understand that the only way Republicans are ever going to see the white house again is with the younger vote. And if Conservatives refuse to adapt a more Libertarian approach, Hillary will run away with this election. Again, nobody wants a dynasty in America. We are not a monarchy. But 2 Clintons vs a 3rd Bush? No.

You need to stop fawning over Israel like it's the 51st state. Israel is an "ally". And a pretty garbage ally at that. As an American, it's your priority to put America first. And that includes over Israel. And while we're at it, Israel will be more respected when it stops treating Palestinians like dogs.

Prohibition doesn't work. I don't care if it's alcohol, marijuana or prostitution. All prohibition does is drive it underground and create monsters like Al Capone and Mexican drug cartels. Grown adults are capable of deciding what goes in their body.

Speaking of which, who really gives a damn what homosexuals do? Again, live and let live. It's none of your damn business. The only time I have an issue with this is when this "gay agenda" is being shoved down our throats. I don't want it in my media, on programs that children watch. Just because it's tolerated doesn't mean people want their kids exposed to it.

War. Enough. Seriously. Our military needs to be stationed on our own damn border, not Afghanistan's. Our troops aren't defending America stationed halfway across the world growing opium. You don't need to build a wall, but you do need to stop the damn cartels from beheading people.

The GOP needs to reform itself and stop the infighting. We have no viable candidates. Stop allowing old money to dictate your political life. Iran isn't the biggest threat to America. Israel isn't more important than Detroit. A little bit of common sense would go a long way here.


Even though the Liberal MSM Machine will come out gunning I believe Hillary and her cascade of lies will tarnish her likelihood of winning. Expect to see the shift from Race wars to gender wars as the msm will attempt to cast all republicans as anti women. Its already started with the interview with Savannah Guthrie of Rand.

I think you will see a little known dem step up much like Obama to take the democratic nomination.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 02:57 PM
link   
I've always wondered why we disagree so vehemently in this country (and most other places) over concepts that are pretty basic.

Why can't we have a baseline government support for folks in a bad spot... and for the folks who are able to fend for themselves, then a hands off approach from the govt... until needed... in other words, a truly benevolent, non intrusive, helpful govt like some have been attempting to build in the latter 20th century (and forever).

'Free' basic housing, food, clothing, transport and education just seems like something a society would aspire to... and thrive from... with the nod to the conservative where spending more private money might bring private sector excellence (and might not) and provide incentive to work harder.

A capitalistic system with a socialistic base... compromise.

I just don't see why people are so analog... either-or...

and why are many far right Christians so darned greedy that they dislike giving anything at all to others?

I know people are limited by their line of sight and personal experience... and can walk over someone in distress if they don't "know" them, and tell themselves the person is somehow "different" and "undeserving"... but that's pretty ugly.

After a number of decades having these debates, I still don't like, or completely understand, that cold outlook some have... and what happens when the self sufficient are not one day?

Benevolence is truly wise and self serving, in actuality.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 03:20 PM
link   
a reply to: Baddogma

What you describe (capitalist system with a socialistic base) reminds me of what I saw in Europe. I keep saying it, but we're slowly moving that direction, with religious fundamentalists and conservatives kicking and screaming. It'll happen, but we still have more growing to do -- more debates to be had, and more issues to hash out.

America may also be to diverse and big for its own good. America may be better off becoming several independent countries, and having mutual defense and economic pacts like the Eurozone.

Someone in New England really doesn't have the same issues that someone in Texas does. I think governments that are closer to the people they serve do better.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 03:28 PM
link   

originally posted by: reldra
a reply to: STTesc One thing wrong with conservatives: They made up the non-existent 'gay agenda'. It simply doesn't exist. They are somehow oddly obsessed with people in general and what gay people in specific, do in their bedrooms. I am not gay, but by stating that, and normally expecting to receive all the rights that everyone else has am I pushing a 'Straight Agenda'?



Is it anything like Hilary's vast right-wing conspiracy? Or anything like the so-called James-O'Keefe-Mystic Pizza Conspiracy?



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 03:31 PM
link   
a reply to: Baddogma

Because I don't think anyone who espouses that idea has really thought it through.

Who pays for it and how? Keep in mind that the government does not make its own money or generate it's own wealth and nothing is ever free.

So if you are going to give out "free" basic housing, food, clothing, etc., those things have to be paid for at their points of origin because otherwise you are using slave labor to produce them.

Where does that money come from?



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 03:40 PM
link   
a reply to: MystikMushroom

And I've told you before that you should read the original COTUS. We are supposed to be a Constitutional Republic where the states are supposed to more prominent in our day to day lives than the Federal Government. What you think needs to happen? That is supposed to be the natural order of things. The Fed was only supposed to make sure no one state took advantage of another and to present a united front to foreign powers. It wasn't supposed to rule us with the bureaucracy.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 04:39 PM
link   
a reply to: ketsuko

You ... I expect all the money to come from your bank account.

sigh...

I've spent some years on this ... and even have some economic theory under my belt... taxes... it's all there and then some, already, with reapportionment, but we could even *gasp* raise taxes on the truly well off...

but I've heard it all... ad nauseum... bluntly, it's there... let's share.




posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 04:47 PM
link   
a reply to: MystikMushroom

Someday... right...

but maybe all people will all of a sudden see the light of reason and kindness... and relinquish their tight grip on stuff they see as "theirs."

We've been slicing up portions of our terrarium, Earth... bigger slices to him... less to her... none for them... based on what? Bigger clubs, fangs and team jerseys.

I fear we Americans are to be the retarded cousins for awhile longer.

eta and true, local govts are usually more attuned to the local issues... but America is far more the same than different in ideals... and the trouble is we live in a world that is not portioned off.. .what one sector does can now affect other continents (like Chinese pollution... Japan's little radioactivity dribble) and we have to grow up.

Govt could be the good guy... it's us... we have to stop ceding leadership to the folks who shouldn't be leading and stop shutting up when nonsense is spewed.

Dunno Mystik, maybe we can get some like minded folks and set up shop elsewhere... feel like hollowing out an asteroid? Sounds familiar... RK anyone? Heh...

edit on 4/9/2015 by Baddogma because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 04:54 PM
link   

originally posted by: Baddogma
a reply to: ketsuko

You ... I expect all the money to come from your bank account.

sigh...

I've spent some years on this ... and even have some economic theory under my belt... taxes... it's all there and then some, already, with reapportionment, but we could even *gasp* raise taxes on the truly well off...

but I've heard it all... ad nauseum... bluntly, it's there... let's share.



OK, how much money for a basic housing unit? How much do you expect to spend per meal per day per person? How much do expect to spend on basic clothing and how do you define that?

Then add that together and multiply it by the population. Then you have to break that number down and divide it out to all the entities that actually DO produce in their daily lives.

You can't stop there though. You also have to take into account the administrating bureaucracies and all their non-basic needs. After all, every bureau and agency involved must be run like a business with all the overhead that entails.

In short, I don't think it's nearly so cheap as you seem to think it is. Not to mention, what happens when you wind up with more consuming basic commodities than there are working to produce said commodities for the consumers? Indications are that we may already be at that tipping point with slightly more than 50% of the population living on subsidy than are working to provide it.
edit on 9-4-2015 by ketsuko because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 05:04 PM
link   
a reply to: ketsuko

What you're failing to realize is that just about every other 1st world nation on the planet is already living in the type of scenario Baddogma just described.

But for whatever reason, you're unable to recognize that fact.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 05:13 PM
link   
a reply to: CranialSponge

Oh I do recognize it. I also recognize that most of them rely on us for their national security to. Or do you fail to recognize that?

They are also much, much smaller as nations than we are. Find me another first world nation with 350 million people. And most of them are also living on a deficit, so even without the defense spending ... they aren't making it work out fiscally.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 05:13 PM
link   
a reply to: ketsuko

Yeah, sorta complex... and people use that to stop the idea cold... where do we draw the line? What sort of food... caviar? Designer clothes for the urban hoodlums? Housing? They better not get a better layout or location than the house I worked for... EEEK.

And there's the "The scammers will laugh at us while they lounge in their one room splendor... eating their govt mush... where's their incentive to work? No way..."

I know what you're saying and you have a large number of backers who think the same way... but I still insist that of course it is possible and it's the only answer if you're not willing to let some people die of want.

I'm not willing to let people die from want... but I'll have to watch that happen, as usual, along with everyone else... and just do what I can when I can... as usual.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 05:15 PM
link   
a reply to: Baddogma

And if you make them eat government mush, it won't be long before they'll be voting for the first people to promise them more and better who will work to give them more and better. After all, as we see when lawmakers try to tell them they can't use foodstamps to buy certain things that are considered luxury ... it's considered cruel and unusual.

But explain to me why someone who pays taxes and them supports themselves should live worse than someone who lives exclusively off the government?



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 05:19 PM
link   
a reply to: ketsuko

It has absolutely nothing to do with the number of people living in a country and everything to do with how and where your tax revenues are being alloted.

Other countries focus their tax revenues on things like business incentive programs, job programs, education programs, housing programs, etc.

The USA has more than enough tax revenues to do the same thing, but for whatever reason, your government choses to put their priorities elsewhere.



posted on Apr, 9 2015 @ 05:26 PM
link   
a reply to: CranialSponge

Because our govt is made of the same selfish folks hiding behind that skirt of bad ol, selfish' govt.

Gov'ment... the Selfish Scapegoat is going to be my children's book... heh.




top topics



 
9
<< 3  4  5    7 >>

log in

join