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The Babilonian Talmud was not written until the 3rd to 6th century CE, 300 to 600 years after the death of Jesus. So once again (see my previous post) non-Bible accounts of Jesus are not contemporary but have been written after the gospels had been created and circulated. This is hearsay and not real evidence, they have no credibility. Also, there were two Jesus that appeared in rabbinic literature: Jesus Pandira (son of Pandira, which is in the Talmud and appeared around 50 years Before CE) and Jesus Ben Stada who was a political figure who practiced the forbidden arts of magic and was hanged with his 5 disciples (2 CE). 'The' Jesus (Yeshua) never appeared in rabbinic writings until aprox. 600 / 700 years after the anno domini.
You have it backwards. According to the rules of logic it is the positive that begs proof not the negative. I can say there was no Jesus Christ. It is up to you to prove their was and you will have a hard time doing as there is no roman record of him at all. In fact there is no mention of him in written history for a couple hundred years after he supposedly lived.
originally posted by: Seede
- You make the same mistake as many others of your class.
- I do not believe you have the faintest conception in that field.
- I understand the hatred of many towards the Yahusha Notzeri Hamashyiach and that is your prerogative as well but facts are facts regardless of your dislikes of those facts.
- I will not argue this with you simply because you have your mind set against any evidence that could be presented
originally posted by: Seede
By the way, are you privy to the ancient records of Rome? Perhaps you should tell us exactly how many Jews were crucified? Did you know that any Roman slave or free man which had received the penalty of death was required to have a court order by Rome in order to be put to death? Did you also know that Jesus was put to death without that Roman court order? And did you know that Pilate was recalled from his appointment because of that and was punished for sedition and five years hence was tried and convicted for attempted murder of Caesar?
The research includes three new tests, two chemical ones and one mechanical one. The first two were carried out with an FT-IR system, one using infra-red light and the other using Raman spectroscopy. The third was a multi-parametric mechanical test based on five different mechanical parameters linked to the voltage of the wire. The machine used to examine the Shroud's fibres and test traction, allowed researchers to examine tiny fibres alongside about twenty samples of cloth dated between 3000 BC and 2000 AD.
The Shroud of Turin Research Project (often abbreviated as STURP) refers to a team of scientists which performed a set of experiments and analyses on the Shroud of Turin during the late 1970s and early 1980s. STURP issued its final report in 1981.
The origins of the group go back to the experiments of physicist John P. Jackson, thermodynamicist Eric Jumper and photographer William Mottern in 1976. Using the ideas invented in aerospace science for building three dimensional models from images of Mars, Eric Jumper built initial devices to test the photographs of the Shroud of Turin. These were the first experiments relating to the shroud performed by scientists.
In March 1977, Jackson, Jumper and Mottern invited a few other scientists to join them to form a team for the analysis of the Shroud. The first meeting took place in Albuquerque, New Mexico. The group had no official sponsorship and the scientists funded their own activities. They also managed to arrange gifts and loans of technical equipment whose value was estimated at over $2 million.
Nuclear physicist Tom D'Muhala headed STURP. Apart from Jackson, Jumper and Motten the team included thermal chemist Raymond N. Rogers, and Ron London and Roger Morris, all from Los Alamos National Laboratory. Other team members included Don Lynn of the Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, biophysicist John Heller, photographers Vern Miller and Barrie Schwortz, optical physicist Sam Pellicori and electric power experts John D. German and Rudy Dichtl, as well as forensic pathologist Robert Bucklin. STURP included no experts on medieval art, archaeology or textiles.
"We can conclude for now that the Shroud image is that of a real human form of a scourged, crucified man. It is not the product of an artist. The blood stains are composed of hemoglobin and also give a positive test for serum albumin. The image is an ongoing mystery and until further chemical studies are made, perhaps by this group of scientists, or perhaps by some scientists in the future, the problem remains unsolved."
Do you have proof of all this? And by proof, I want actual primary sources that state that Pilate was recalled for not issuing a Roman court order for Jesus' death.
Why would you feel bad for me?