Post Millennial Marriage Strike

Census Bureau data shows that 70% of men aged 20-34 are unmarried. The trend is unmistakable, and predates the current recessionary unpleasantness. More men are dropping out of the marriage market, and this gradually escalating abandonment has been going on since the 1960s. I have been unable to link the article so here is a summarisation the commentary and some lifted quotes, the contents of which caught my eye and sent me scurrying off to check out what I now believe is called the "Manosphere".

The various causes for the marriage strike have been discussed ad infinitum (hint: it’s not just men avoiding the altar). Sometimes, theory isn’t enough to wake people up. You need to hear the pained words echoing from the charnel house known as the modern secular dating market. A commenter to the census article writes,

"This isn’t an article about maturity, its about conformity. Society is upset that men aren’t conforming to some crazy imaginary standard being set for them. This isn’t the 1950’s, the economy has entered permanent contraction, so it’s pretty simple, we can’t afford to marry the princess and give her the castle she wants. I don’t want want to be a cog in the machine, I want to see the machine grind to a stop!

What was it? 80% of women list shopping as their number one hobby? But you want to attack men for playing video games? Pretty selective. I want to live a life of minimalism, where I have enough money to cover the basics, I don’t need a 2000 square foot McMansion in burbs to get by, I don’t want to commute to a soul crushing job and end up like the age 50+ man drones I see drowning themselves in alcohol, fast food and TV just to numb their existential pain.

Modern culture to me is spiritually dead, I don’t feel like using my one shot at life running on the never ending treadmill of materialism just because my overweight, greedy wife wants me to, what kind of man would I be then? Definitely not my own".

Essentially what is alluded to, if it is lightly skimmed over is, "video gaming and the ready availability of pornography for men" is the cause of marriage dissolution. This however neglects to include what is often discussed on the burgeoning "sites for men". Materialistic shopping, social media whoring, overweight women are becoming less and less attractive as a marriage prospect. Technology has contributed to divorce, but technology cuts both ways and it enables the worst instincts of both men and women.

The point is that continually raised on the various "man sites" was , overweight classless, promiscuous women aren’t high grade commitment prospects. Why would any man want to slave away to buy a 2,000sq ft mcmansion and commit to an overweight/expensive/needy/nagging/high partner count wife. When they could have cheap, thin, readily available online porn stars who demand nothing and do not have a runaway entitlement complex. Female obesity is, it seems, as much a cause, perhaps a bigger cause, for the retreat of men from marriage as any other socio-economic factor.

The conclusion I drew after thoroughly sounding out The Manosphere is inescapable. Modern culture appears to be soulless and empty to many men today, and women are no longer an attractive enough prospect for a man to feel any sense of connection or duty toward. Expecting the modern single man to aspire to a dead an empty concept that was ruled outdated and oppressively patriarchal in the nineteen sixties is today, is just too much of an ask.

I present these opinions of others for discussion as I found them sufficiently thought provoking and worthy of exploration. I very much hope that the ATS sorority will provide the female prospective to all of this and help to determine if this modern state of affairs is to the good or detriment of life. This seems to be far from clear as of now, but do we ignore it at our peril?

I have had to work very hard to sanitise the thoughts and opinions expressed to suit ATS T&Cs and I do not post this lightly. I gave much thought as to wether to post or not and, have carried out several very thorough proof readings. Apologies in advance for any failures on my part that cause offence or violate terms.

a reply to: hotel1

From my perspective this seems like a no brainer.

Why would somebody voluntarily engage in a contract that involves a woman, money, lawyers and government?

a reply to: greencmp

The point you make is widely held so do you think the west need be alarmed by it?

a reply to: hotel1

Personally speaking, I empathise entirely.

Although I still hope that at some point a woman will come into my life who is incapable of the sort of nonsense that I have been exposed to before, I doubt that it will happen, and worse, I am certain that when it does, I will find myself utterly fiscally incapable of considering marriage, or even moving out of home to live with said woman.

Between ill treatment by the females I have thus far encountered (cheating, character assassination, and so on), and my financial situation, I am worried that this, the life I am living now, is all there is left for me. I am the sort of fellow who holds doors open for ladies, will walk miles in rain, hail, blizzards, or high winds just to be there for people close to me, will do anything I have to in order to be the best I can for people, but I really have trouble some days, believing that the world in which I live, has any need for guys like me any more, not really.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: hotel1

Personally speaking, I empathise entirely.

Although I still hope that at some point a woman will come into my life who is incapable of the sort of nonsense that I have been exposed to before, I doubt that it will happen, and worse, I am certain that when it does, I will find myself utterly fiscally incapable of considering marriage, or even moving out of home to live with said woman.

Between ill treatment by the females I have thus far encountered (cheating, character assassination, and so on), and my financial situation, I am worried that this, the life I am living now, is all there is left for me. I am the sort of fellow who holds doors open for ladies, will walk miles in rain, hail, blizzards, or high winds just to be there for people close to me, will do anything I have to in order to be the best I can for people, but I really have trouble some days, believing that the world in which I live, has any need for guys like me any more, not really.

Maybe you should be more of a jerkwad bad boy. Women waiting for Prince Charming tend to spend the mean time in the beds of black knights. A cynical view? Possibly but after all it was women who bought, and got off on all those millions of copies of Fifty Shades of Grey.

originally posted by: hotel1
a reply to: greencmp

The point you make is widely held so do you think the west need be alarmed by it?

No, I think equality between the sexes requires the complete abolishment of publicly officiated private social contracts that effectively considers a person the property of another individual person.

On the other hand, I am a huge fan of the non legally binding commitment to fidelity that ceremonial marriage represents.

A "2000 square foot McMansion" is kind of a minimalist concept in itself.

a reply to: hotel1

Thats because women are becoming more and more crazy by the day.

But seriously who signs a bad contract anyways? People in general suck and if you get a divorce, the wife is gonna get the kids and half my stuff. The judge the majority of the time leans towards the female.

originally posted by: greencmp

originally posted by: hotel1
a reply to: greencmp

The point you make is widely held so do you think the west need be alarmed by it?

No, I think equality between the sexes requires the complete abolishment of publicly officiated private social contracts that effectively considers a person the property of another individual person.

On the other hand, I am a huge fan of the non legally binding commitment to fidelity that ceremonial marriage represents.[/quote



Am I understanding correctly that you favour monogamy over open relationships?

edit on 3-4-2015 by hotel1 because: (no reason given)

originally posted by: hotel1

The point you make is widely held so do you think the west need be alarmed by it?

No, I think equality between the sexes requires the complete abolishment of publicly officiated private social contracts that effectively considers a person the property of another individual person.

On the other hand, I am a huge fan of the non legally binding commitment to fidelity that ceremonial marriage represents.[/quote



Am I understanding correctly that you favour monogamy over open relationships?

When voluntarily but unofficially and mutually agreed, yes.

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: hotel1

Thats because women are becoming more and more crazy by the day.

But seriously who signs a bad contract anyways? People in general suck and if you get a divorce, the wife is gonna get the kids and half my stuff. The judge the majority of the time leans towards the female.

Yes indeed the Divorce/Theft/Industrial complex and its lawyerscum mercenaries shamelessly profiting from human misery. Whip them naked throughout the streets and hang them on a gibbet etc etc.

a reply to: hotel1

I believe that the feminist movement is further pushing males away from marriage. I agree with equal opportunity for the sexes which makes me feminist just the movement is horribly represented imo.

I've had 2 super feminazi girlfriends and they both treated me like and entitled white male trying to keep them down due to the patriarchal system.... The arguments were ridiculous.

That alone makes me terrified of marriage and that I was raised by all women

I've lost half my 'stuff' twice

I'm old and have little, but I'd like to keep what I do have.

originally posted by: hotel1
a reply to: greencmp

The point you make is widely held so do you think the west need be alarmed by it?

Be alarmed, yes and no.

Argument for yes: Human extinction to begin in the next 50 years after a final pffft rise in population.

This is what happened in Japan.

Now it is pretty clear that the Japanese will be going extinct.
www.foxnews.com...

Why all the "free" immigration to the US?
Because second generation Americans are like the young man above
www.washingtontimes.com...

It is happening in Europe
www.nytimes.com...

It will soon be happening world wide (see my other posts and threads)
www.slate.com...


Argument for no: Humans are becoming unnecessary in the modern world.

We are becoming so robotized that we don't need nearly as many people as before, With the rise of AI humans may not be needed at all or very little.
So maybe getting rid of all the male and female humans who sit blankly staring at screens rather than enriching their minds and bodies might be a good thing.
Getting out of the gene pool men who prefer to fantasize while eating pizza on the couch and complain about women would probably be a good thing.



Aside to the problem:
Fat lazy out of shape men sitting on couches enjoying themselves
over images of women that don't exist in real life
without lots of plastic surgery
make real appealing husbands too.

You are angry, but look at yourself,
do you look like the men in the video games
in the porn movies
Then don't rag on the women.

You want a princess, you can have one
just chose someone who is decent looking
spend thousands upon thousands
on plastic surgery for her
and voila! Your princess.
Can't vouch for her character or
how easy she will be to live with
once she looks like a porn star.
But any man who wants one can
have it if they want to create her.

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: hotel1

I believe that the feminist movement is further pushing males away from marriage. I agree with equal opportunity for the sexes which makes me feminist just the movement is horribly represented imo.

I've had 2 super feminazi girlfriends and they both treated me like and entitled white male trying to keep them down due to the patriarchal system.... The arguments were ridiculous.

That alone makes me terrified of marriage and that I was raised by all women

Thank you for bringing your personal experience to the topic and does seem to bare out the point. So I would ask you the same question. Do we ignore this trend to personal and societal detriment.

a reply to: hotel1

80 % of women shop as a hobby? And (no percentage on this) are fat, expensive, needy, nagging, promiscuous, materialistic, social media whores, classless...
or are porn stars who are thin


I think as a woman (120 lbs), who lives in a 1000 sq ft fixer upper, married to a wonderful man (a truck driver), and shops mostly for food (again, not fat), the perception of how women are terrifies me.

If my husband meets his maker before I do, I had better just restrict myself to my dog for companionship.
Clearly I do not want to run into anyone from this "manosphere"...

originally posted by: grandmakdw

originally posted by: hotel1
a reply to: greencmp

The point you make is widely held so do you think the west need be alarmed by it?

Be alarmed, yes and no.

Argument for yes: Human extinction to begin in the next 50 years after a final pffft rise in population.

This is what happened in Japan.

Now it is pretty clear that the Japanese will be going extinct.
www.foxnews.com...

Why all the "free" immigration to the US?
Because second generation Americans are like the young man above
www.washingtontimes.com...

It is happening in Europe
www.nytimes.com...

It will soon be happening world wide (see my other posts and threads)
www.slate.com...


Argument for no: Humans are becoming unnecessary in the modern world. ]/b]

We are becoming so robotized that we don't need nearly as many people as before, With the rise of AI humans may not be needed at all or very little.
So maybe getting rid of all the male and female humans who sit blankly staring at screens rather than enriching their minds and bodies might be a good thing.
Getting out of the gene pool men who prefer to fantasize while eating pizza on the couch and complain about women would probably be a good thing.



Aside to the problem:
Fat lazy out of shape men sitting on couches enjoying themselves
over images of women that don't exist in real life
without lots of plastic surgery
make real appealing husbands too.

You are angry, but look at yourself,
do you look like the men in the video games
in the porn movies
Then don't rag on the women.

You want a princess, you can have one
just chose someone who is decent looking
spend thousands upon thousands
on plastic surgery for her
and voila! Your princess.
Can't vouch for her character or
how easy she will be to live with
once she looks like a porn star.
But any man who wants one can
have it if they want to create her.

Thank you for bringing the female perspective and adding considerably to the topic. Your points are well made. I would like to ask what you change too improve things if you could?

originally posted by: hotel1

originally posted by: JDmOKI
a reply to: hotel1

I believe that the feminist movement is further pushing males away from marriage. I agree with equal opportunity for the sexes which makes me feminist just the movement is horribly represented imo.

I've had 2 super feminazi girlfriends and they both treated me like and entitled white male trying to keep them down due to the patriarchal system.... The arguments were ridiculous.

That alone makes me terrified of marriage and that I was raised by all women

Thank you for bringing your personal experience to the topic and does seem to bare out the point. So I would ask you the same question. Do we ignore this trend to personal and societal detriment.

Yes, we ignore this trend.

Humanity nearing extinction is necessary with the rise of robotics

and once we create AI, it will be imperative that humans become

close to extinct because there won't be anything useful for them

to do.

Getting rid of undesirable men who sit on couches for hours on end
who don't get out and enrich their minds and bodies
will be good for humanity and genetics in general.

Same for the women. It is an equal opportunity much needed
extinction of the lazy, as the world of AI emerges.

As an aside: Men and women who don't wish to marry should NOT. They should also NOT have children, if they can't commit to another adult, children are much more time intensive and difficult, they also should not breed!

What should be done about the trend, absolutely nothing.
It is the most natural and kindest and easiest way to bring down the numbers of humans on earth.

originally posted by: grandmakdw

originally posted by: hotel1
a reply to: greencmp

The point you make is widely held so do you think the west need be alarmed by it?

Be alarmed, yes and no.

Argument for yes: Human extinction to begin in the next 50 years after a final pffft rise in population.

This is what happened in Japan.

Now it is pretty clear that the Japanese will be going extinct.
www.foxnews.com...

Why all the "free" immigration to the US?
Because second generation Americans are like the young man above
www.washingtontimes.com...

It is happening in Europe
www.nytimes.com...

It will soon be happening world wide (see my other posts and threads)
www.slate.com...


Argument for no: Humans are becoming unnecessary in the modern world.

We are becoming so robotized that we don't need nearly as many people as before, With the rise of AI humans may not be needed at all or very little.
So maybe getting rid of all the male and female humans who sit blankly staring at screens rather than enriching their minds and bodies might be a good thing.
Getting out of the gene pool men who prefer to fantasize while eating pizza on the couch and complain about women would probably be a good thing.



Aside to the problem:
Fat lazy out of shape men sitting on couches enjoying themselves
over images of women that don't exist in real life
without lots of plastic surgery
make real appealing husbands too.

You are angry, but look at yourself,
do you look like the men in the video games
in the porn movies
Then don't rag on the women.

You want a princess, you can have one
just chose someone who is decent looking
spend thousands upon thousands
on plastic surgery for her
and voila! Your princess.
Can't vouch for her character or
how easy she will be to live with
once she looks like a porn star.
But any man who wants one can
have it if they want to create her.

Yes, it is yet another example of the unintended negative consequences of well intentioned legislation.

It is what it is but, I definitely don't get the impression that it is dramatically affecting the birth rate.

You don't have to be married to have offspring.

originally posted by: snowspirit
a reply to: hotel1

80 % of women shop as a hobby? And (no percentage on this) are fat, expensive, needy, nagging, promiscuous, materialistic, social media whores, classless...
or are porn stars who are thin

I think as a woman (120 lbs), who lives in a 1000 sq ft fixer upper, married to a wonderful man (a truck driver), and shops mostly for food (again, not fat), the perception of how women are terrifies me.

If my husband meets his maker before I do, I had better just restrict myself to my dog for companionship.
Clearly I do not want to run into anyone from this "manosphere"...

Fair enough, so I would take from your comment that you consider the opinions to be inaccurate, would you however agree or disagree that they exist?