This is the issue I have with the suposed religious people.

originally posted by: Logarock

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: theCheddar

See? Right behind what you quoted... It literally says I can exercise whatever religion/faith/spirituality/atheism/agnosticism/scientology/anything else or none of the above I want.

Oh course you can.

There is no law denying anyone of belief, any belief.

Acting on that belief - - well, that's different.

Making the owner of a private enterprise do business as others see fit is acting on a belief. The idea that a private owners religious beliefs are neutralized and negated simply because they are engaged in commerce is very constitutionally challengeable.

So, you're saying the Cigil Rights Act is unconstitutional?

a reply to: chr0naut

The Bible, however, is not repetitive in that way.

The Bible is an inanimate object. Its repetitiveness is conducted through people espousing it through churches and other avenues. Obviously. If you followed my critique to your post you'd see how that's the pertinent idea..

Again, per your own post 'brainwashing' entails such action.

It's no surprise religious instruction starts with young children for this purpose. It's inline with your own link. This is 'brainwashing'. You indoctrinate children with belief systems through repetitiveness. Just as your link described. It's very effective.

a reply to: Lucid Lunacy

and the public school system does the same thing. they get to keep people's kids for nice big swaths of time (enforced by law), to indoctrinate and brainwash them to believe in a non religious world view. so we're evenly brainwashed. by the time we're adults, we make a decision on that regard.

a reply to: Annee

agreed. people just need to come to grips with the fact that gay people are born gay, and since we no longer have a harem system where they can live out their lives as eunuchs, we need to accept them as equally protected members of society

a reply to: undo

Sure. As I said in my initial post we are all biased as to what constitutes 'brainwashing'. I didn't mean to say 'brainwashing' was unique to religion. I was merely critiquing his post and also his refutation and how his link itself supported the notion religious people are 'brainwashed'.

Do children get indoctrinated with beliefs that are non-religous in nature? Yes. Of course.

Some beliefs are more healthy than others though.

scenario:


gay person decides to live celibate, opens a public business but decides not to cater gay events - to eliminate temptation. can you hear a judge telling him he 's not allowed to be prejudiced against himself? hehe

this WILL happen. i hope it's reported cause that would be one heckuva story

originally posted by: Lucid Lunacy
a reply to: chr0naut

The Bible, however, is not repetitive in that way.

The Bible is an inanimate object. Its repetitiveness is conducted through people espousing it through churches and other avenues. Obviously. If you followed my critique to your post you'd see how that's the pertinent idea..

Again, per your own post 'brainwashing' entails such action.

It's no surprise religious instruction starts with young children for this purpose. It's inline with your own link. This is 'brainwashing'. You indoctrinate children with belief systems through repetitiveness. Just as your link described. It's very effective.

I know of many Christian religious groups that are far less repetitive than the average pop song. Repetition, by itself, is not brainwashing and most (not all) Christian groups shy away from anything like brainwashing techniques.

The usual Christian method of evangelism is to point out that human nature is selfish most of the time and that this prevents us from attaining to God's high standards (usually referenced to the 10 commandment laws). Then, it is explained that Jesus Christ substituted Himself for our sin and offers absolution and forgiveness, not by some particular ritual or work on our part, but merely by acknowledging our need and being repentant (truly wanting to be better). An additional step is to ask God to give us guidance through His Spirit, which will speak to our inner being, allowing us to really see actual changes in our behavior.

By contrast, the military and our school systems both use enforced repetition (among other techniques) as a control mechanism.

Bunk together same sex groups when they are at the peak of their sexuality, tell them gay is evil, drill them until they have no will to question orders from "authority" and wait for the tension levels to rise until they can be commanded to kill total strangers. That IS brainwashing.

originally posted by: Lucid Lunacy
a reply to: chr0naut

The Bible, however, is not repetitive in that way.

The Bible is an inanimate object. Its repetitiveness is conducted through people espousing it through churches and other avenues. Obviously. If you followed my critique to your post you'd see how that's the pertinent idea..

Again, per your own post 'brainwashing' entails such action.

It's no surprise religious instruction starts with young children for this purpose. It's inline with your own link. This is 'brainwashing'. You indoctrinate children with belief systems through repetitiveness. Just as your link described. It's very effective.

So basically, the only way NOT to "brainwash" a child is to turn them out into the wild from the day they are born and never have any contact with them?

That's absurd.

Look, my child is totally brainwashed ... when we go out into the parking lot, he puts his hands on the car. Why? Because we play a game after we grocery shop. I'm the "Evil Overmom" and I push the cart with the groceries while my husband holds his hand and they "run" through the lot with me "chasing" them. In order not to get dumped in the trunk, he has to "beat" me back to the car and put his hands on it before I get there.

By now, he just puts his hands on the car in every parking lot we're in or we just have to say "hands" for him to do it. It keeps him safe so we can work around the car without him running off. Any car that gets close enough to run him over was going to get him no matter what and we watch for that of course.

But yeah, he's brainwashed. How dare we try to raise our kid?

originally posted by: undo
scenario:


gay person decides to live celibate, opens a public business but decides not to cater gay events - to eliminate temptation. can you hear a judge telling him he 's not allowed to be prejudiced against himself? hehe

this WILL happen. i hope it's reported cause that would be one heckuva story

But, its not about the individual.

Not all blacks supported the Civil Rights Act (for whatever personal reason).

We're talking about minorities that would never have equal rights if it wasn't for "majorities" (straights. whites, etc)

The gay guy can't refuse other gays, anymore then a black business owner can refuse other blacks.

NOW we're gonna get the poster that says whites can't go into black neighborhoods yada yada. There have always been dense cultural areas. There are white ghettos I wouldn't go in.

a reply to: Annee

No but there are programs that are designed around helping people of specific ethnicities or minority groups that wind up helping people who might not actually need the aid because they are well off enough not to need it whereas a person of the groups not in that ethnic group might be better deserving of the spirit of that groups attempts.

For example, the African-American child of a doctor and lawyer would be better positioned to take advantage of things than a poor white child of working class parents, but the African American still has access to all the programs that will look only at race and not at means which will far advantage that child over the poor white kid who doesn't have the same programs.

Is that the norm? No, but it does happen.