UK Elections

a reply to: Soloprotocol

Haha you could be right, we'll have to wait and see.

I think we can both be fairly certain that English and Scottish relations will only decline further. I just wish that when you all had the chance to vote for independence you didn't get scared at the last moment.

You all could have been free now, and dealing with your own problems realising that still only half the population were being seen to by the SNP. Politics can't keep everyone happy I'm afraid, but the nationalists will always look to blame the south.

Now we face a real threat from Salmond and Co. tearing the union apart anyway, and when he does and Scotland is falling into disrepute, you'll all realise that you actually had a good deal after all.

a reply to: crazyewok

Agreed on all fronts there. Forget party allegiances and go for the MP who actaully does their job - if everyone in the country did that we'd actually have a respectable parlaiment instead of the playground 'he said/she said' waste of time that is PMQs/General Parliament. I'm not blanket anti-tory, just for 99% of them, for instance I have insane respect for the Tory MPs who stood up in court and announced their government were lying in order to free innocent people from jail - that's true courage and putting constituent interests ahead of personal ones.

However the Tories regularly use the three line whip to stop their MPs being allowed a free vote and are forced to confer with the PM. Though I imagine Labour do exactly the same (especially now they have even more career politicians who'll do anything not to rock the boat, just less often (take this part with a pinch of salt as it's going on rusty memories from pre-Brown era and haven't looked it up since) Brown was too weak to organise a three-liner and hopefully Milliband will be to so at least one party will be acting vaguely like a democacy - even though Milliband and Balls are clearly going to be the laughing stock of all other countries and (as painful as it is to admit) lack the backbone of Dave so will be complete walkovers internationally.

The nearest Tory MP Ben Wallace was parachuted in from the other side of the country, never attends meetings, assemblies etc.. and I think he gave up going to the HoC a few weeks after getting the job but still realseses cringe wothy brown nosed reads - couldn't have really had a worse candidate.

The ex Lib Dem was a true gent called Alan Hackett, would argue politics at length with him most weeks and never agree but he always put his constituents first. Sadluy he's been replaced by a wet behind the ears doorstop called Mike Onion who knows nothing and never achieves anything (he makes the tory look good). Plus Clegg is Judan who sold out all the parties ideology to get 15 of fame as a lapdog in a made up government position with little/no power.

Labour have Mark Hendrick here who again I disagree with a lot of the time but he always responds to letters withing 24 -48 hours and managed to ban UK arms shipments to Bahrain (after I bollocked him for not calling for it earlier).

The other option in Michael Lavelette the local SWP chap - the SWP are a disgrace following the rape cover up but this guy is a uni professor, has written 30+ books on politics and austerity and leads nearly all the vaguely left wing protests in the north west. He was the only candidate who actually did doorstepping, is an amazing public speaker and never gives up a fight - sadly he's even less chance of winning than the BNP.

There's some UKIP nutter but unsurprisingly she's under police investigation for racial abuse and extremist links.

If you made it this far well done (It's hardly the most interesting post) but considering I have no options - the only vote I can make is a tactical one to make sure the Tories don't gain seats.

TL;DR - All parties are rubbish and have rubbish members, listen to ewok and vote for one who actually holds surgeries. attends the HoC, isn't milking expenses and represents constituents - they're a nugget of gold in a sea of sh*t regardless of what party they belong to (UKIP/BNP types aside obviously).

originally posted by: DAZ21
I can see if things play out in a certain way, the English will be rioting on the streets.

Please could you provide any source or rational for this? Not trying to say you're wrong as I honestly have no idea but its a very interesting and important area I'd not considered. From my experiencethe general sense north of Manchester is 'lets all go to Scotland to escape the london-centric posh kids from Lib/Lab/Con who hate anything north of Birmingham'. From my perspective the Westminster bubble are complertely cluess about the north of uk and the SNP seem like nice, freindly people from what I've seen.

Do labour or the tories think we're really that thick to huy HS2 and HS3 when internet video conferencing and 3d models can be sent and made over the internet for a cheaper price than a return journey. It's an obvious scam.

a reply to: bastion

Same in my country empty chambers for vitally important topics but by God they'll pack the joint to the rafters when its time to vote for a pay rise.

a reply to: khnum

It's be fun to set up an international comparison set of pics.

There's an infamous one n the UK where only 15 -20 Mps turned up to have the first mental health/war on welfare debate in 10 years, with most falling asleep during. But low and behold the full 648 (techincally 650) were able to attend to vote for their pay rise. Funny that.

No idea how to embedd this image comparing the two. samedifference1.com...

EDIT: Maybe they could introduce a system where MPs were docked pay for missing votes/debates without valid reason and remove all expenses if they miss three in a row or 30 per year without proof they were doing something worthwhile while neglecting duties (with sickness and personal matters non-attendance immune from this count of course). I have a sneaky suspicion they may actually start working for us then, though may be being far too naive.

a reply to: bastion
here ya go.

a reply to: bastion

Very telling two pictures,we have the ABC as our equivalent to the BBC where they broadcast every day both upper and lower houses our only saving grace is a few Senators on the cross benches who are independant they seem to be the only ones that read or debate legislation the rest vote purely along party lines -even still 2 or 3 items get passed each week, If I assume that is the average then 205920 laws or so have been introduced since federation,now that they have legislated from birth till death my countries Government seems to be working on the final coup de gras-raiding bank accounts and superannuation savings the system needs an enema the two party system has reached critical morass.

a reply to: bastion

Yeah its one of the reasons Il vote for my mp she has gone against her party a few times like on syria and is against some of mays more extreme policys or at least will if may puts them to vote after the GE.

I cant stand yes men so that would be a vote loser for me.

As I said if I lived a few miles down the road Id be voteing labour or lib dem as the Mp is a typical tory twat there.

a reply to: Soloprotocol

Nice one you're an absolute legend, that pic has finally taught me how to upload them now after checking code - major thumbs up.

a reply to: crazyewok

Glad to hear it, she sounds a very good MP and one of the perfectly acceptable tories, if not even on the left of most of Labour who are racing to be Dave or are pure 'yes men' who no no life outside politics.

At the risk of sounding patronising or sacarstic (I honestly don't mean to) you have exactly the right attitude to voting and democracy, something the country is sorely lacking. I imagine most of the population won't even now who is their MP, let alone their voting records so it's great stuff to hear. While I disagree with the party you're voting for, you're clearly making the correct, informed choice -which few sadly bother to research outside places like here that are politically active so full credit to you and hope she wins her constituency.

originally posted by: bastion
a reply to: crazyewok

Glad to hear it, she sounds a very good MP and one of the perfectly acceptable tories, if not even on the left of most of Labour who are racing to be Dave or are pure 'yes men' who no no life outside politics.

At the risk of sounding patronising or sacarstic (I honestly don't mean to) you have exactly the right attitude to voting and democracy, something the country is sorely lacking. I imagine most of the population won't even now who is their MP, let alone their voting records so it's great stuff to hear. While I disagree with the party you're voting for, you're clearly making the correct, informed choice -which few sadly bother to research outside places like here that are politically active so full credit to you and hope she wins her constituency.

No its fine.
I think our democracy is only broke as long as we let it be broke.

If everyone voted for the mp that best represents there area or at least get rid of really rubbish ones the quality ofboth partys would benifit.

There are many labour mp I repect I just dont live in there constitancy. And I wont complain over the SNP if thats what the scot think best represent them.

People complain about the IDS,mays the Ed balls and the harreit harmons but we can sack them.

a reply to: bastion

Il also add I have travelled alot round the UK.

Its clear every area has diffrent needs.

Im from chatham. Its mostly a white lower middle class area were I live in my part of the medway towns. So we naturaly have voted in a white women who has a lower middle class background who concerns hereself with lower middle class issues.

From when I have been in the north I know that is completly the wrong person to represent them.
Even I get depressed at the sight of abandoned mines and factorys and can see they have there own problems that need representation.

Even in my own county you can see the diffrence. Down in folkstone and dover you can see the heavy toll unchecked immigration has caused in those communitys under both tory and labours watch and you can understand why UKIP may make a rise there.

On the otherside in birmingham which is very multicultural you can see again a diffrent need.

This is why I don't vote. I want no part in putting corruption in power.

An interesting take on the current political system and the failure of the modern day party political system and some historical context.

www.bbc.co.uk...

The article's author seems to support what many in this thread have stated.

Some quotes from the article;

But it is depressing because the debate is focused on such minute differences of policy.
The campaign consists of insults thrown with passionate force across the distance of a pinhead.

Aware of voters' real concerns and attitudes (especially resentment at immigration and hatred of politicians), they nevertheless blandly pretend that theirs is the national conversation.
They imagine that what they talk about on The Daily Politics is what people talk about with their families and friends.

We have another form of corruption - not merely that some parliamentarians are blatantly in the pockets of corporate lobbyists, but the condition that makes this possible.
We have lost any compelling moral narrative in our national life, any sense of purpose about what political activity is for.

Whilst I don't agree with some of the arguments and conclusions I do however feel that many valid points are raised and it quite reasonably sums up why party politics is currently failing this country and is in reality actively hindering us.

"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it" Joseph Goebbels

"A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on"
- Winston Churchill

Finally! Exposed! The Deficit Myth! So, David Cameron When Are You Going to Apologise?

Were coming to get ye...

UK productivity growth is weakest since second world war, says ONS

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: teapot

originally posted by: uncommitted
a reply to: teapot

Sorry, the only answer I can dignify you with is being a 'slave' earning £250,000 a week is an interesting concept. You are talking about some very specific examples, not the one I plucked out as an example.

Historically, the high wages culture is because of the slavery element.

If you want to use Russel Brand (I plucked him as an example), then his latest publication is neither here nor there, it just goes to show he doesn't need the money (ETA) from this particular publication.

He (or any other popular commentator) could have chosen to do something more selfish with the money! Attempting to use these type figures to prove a point about how it was not only the banking industry working with sitting politicians to rip us all off was a diversion that I somehow could not ignore!

Gordon brown didn't introduce Gift Aid though, you might want to check. Last time I looked it was John Major (ETA it was John Major, Brown made a change, but certainly didn't introduce it).

I stand corrected, thank you for the info! Of course it was the Tories that devised this further intrusion into peoples' finances! I had wondered why it was that under the 'austerity' regime they have imposed upon the poorest in society, no savings have been made by abolishing Gift Aid. Not that I know exactly how it works or if it can be used to further reduce taxes paid by certain individuals.

What on Earth are you on about? You were all for gift aid but now you see the Tories devised it you are against it??? (ETA) and it hasn't been abolished, I gave last month and pledged gift aid, the same as I do when I donate clothes/books just like I did 20 years ago. Sheesh, you might want to keep digging to find something that actually has merit.

I am on about government intrusion into people's personal finances. I was not for Gift Aid when I thought Brown had introduced it and learning my mistake, I am still not for Gift Aid!

Of course Gift Aid has some merit but to assume the policy was ever just about charitable giving and had nothing to do with further incursion and intrusion is, IMO, naïve. Donating used goods, meaning the charity receives additional funding from the taxman is all well and good but that funding is only made possible because you are a UK taxpayer and must give this information relating to your tax status to the charity you make the original donation to. I know it all seems innocuous, but is it?

As to the GE, my view is that any vote is a vote for continuation of the historic, current and ongoing extremely corrupt system that was established long before any of us had two brain cells to rub together.

The problem with using high earning non government or corporate people to make a point to challenge perceived imbalance and unfairness in wealth distribution is that footballers and entertainers do not make policies that destroy peoples lives. I am a Christian Anarchist and in no sense support any 'system' that has ever existed and I say the only way to achieve electoral reform in this country, is for people to register to vote, attend the polling station on the day and deface the voting paper with a common, agreed by consensus slogan, demanding electoral reform and abolishment of the party system. A sort of ballot paper revolution. People won't though, it takes courage to go against the norm and rock the boat.

But I do think all politicians underestimate and misunderstand the population. People are aware of corruption in high places and are sick and tired of being patronised by those that have fewer scruples than themselves. There needs to be a new narrative, a moral narrative that people can easily identify with because it take account of the fundamental decency of the common people of this land.

originally posted by: Soloprotocol
Were coming to get ye...

Did you see the part where they ask how many of the delegates are there for the first time and a sea of hands are raised?
Regardless of anyone's views on independence I think the increased participation in politics post referendum is a truly wonderful thing.