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Christianity : Ask and you shall be given.

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posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 09:41 AM
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We live in material World. We use money to buy things ( even virtual things ) which makes us happy for a while and when the novelty of the object is gone we are looking for an updated version of it. Materialism and greed walk hand in hand, more you have, more you want.
Jesus said " Ask and you will be given" this is the most misused verse from the Bible. Jesus never talked about seeking for material things, only material thing he talked about was a bread in "father of ours" prayer " Give us this day our daily bread" He also said that" I am the bread of life, whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me shall never thirst", when you see what he means, you probably also see that our daily bread is not about our physical needs, instead it´s about our needs in spirit.

"Ask and you shall be given" verse of Jesus is not about material needs either, it is also about our spiritual needs. With this verse misused, we see the ugly side of Christianity.

Minister Creflo Dollar asks for $60 million in donations for a new jet
CNN

Megachurces a modern Golden Calf asking for donations, more you feed it bigger it grows. It´s a business in disguise and honestly not very good disguise.
israelites worshipping Golden calf

Modern World even uglier, ugly picture ( i hope i would have found a bit nicer tho)


How good is the material world ? Does it make us really happy?

This is not a thread against Christianity as OP herself is also a Lutheran christian. This is about misusing the scripture for own benefits and definition of the church and does today´s church follow the message Jesus gave to us.




posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 09:50 AM
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a reply to: dollukka
Luke's version is "How much more will the heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask him" (ch11 v13).
Again,not about money.



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 10:02 AM
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a reply to: dollukka

Jesus said " Ask and you will be FORgiven"


almost right..



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 10:06 AM
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a reply to: dollukka

It is certainly a misconception to see that what was spoken of by Christ as a worldly thing.

But I think that anyone who reads the gospel understands that Christ aims to convey that spiritual gifts are meant.

I believe that it is the aim of those who oppose Christ to make it seem that the idea of monetary riches is correct as opposed to the Spirit. That way, Christianity is seen in an entirely different way than it should be.

So many people think that the gospel is a tool made by those in power for wealth and a weakening of the common people. That ultimately makes the common person suspect Christ of evil.



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 10:07 AM
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a reply to: acackohfcc

Jesus did not say only one thing.



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 10:16 AM
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a reply to: backcase

no, he didn't

...but I'm pretty sure the OP misquoted Jeses



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 10:21 AM
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a reply to: acackohfcc
No, the OP is not at fault here.
The gospels do include statements like ""Whatever you ask in prayer you will receive, if you have faith" (Matthew ch21 v22).
The exact wording of the title is Matthew ch7 v7.
So the question is how best to treat that kind of statement.


edit on 27-3-2015 by DISRAELI because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 10:24 AM
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a reply to: backcase
The problem is that some are not seeing the bigger picture, instead reading without thinking and having their fingers pointing verses on Bible in manner " so it is ".
This gives them justification for material needs.
Also there is misunderstanding in definition of church.
Church comes from translation of greek word ekkiesia which means calling out, he talks about building his church
"Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church"; Matthew 16:18.
This was not to be taken literally instead he pointed out that Peter is strong in his faith and is a good example for rest of us.
It was never about the institution and buildings called as church

Matthew 24:5 "Many shall come in my name and shall deceive many."


edit on 27-3-2015 by dollukka because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 10:29 AM
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a reply to: dollukka

I disagree with you.

I believe that the church has carried on Christ's teachings quite well. The church has often acted as Peter acted.

Christ remains at the head of the Church. Peter is the visible head and Christ is the mystical head. Good acts through his church.

It is not an error of interpretation for the true believer knows within his heart what is the truth. The sacraments foster all manner of spiritual life and are proof that God is still with the Church.

Christ lives on in the Eucharist.
edit on 103131p://555 by backcase because: (no reason given)

edit on 103131p://555 by backcase because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 10:30 AM
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originally posted by: dollukka
Ask and you will be given" this is the most misused verse from the Bible


I don't think this pastor ever used that verse to justify his request. I don't think I have ever heard of a Christian using this verse to justify asking for material things.

I don't know where you got this feeling from. I'm not defending the guy, he's an asshole. But it's not true that he misused the verse or that "this is the most misused verse from the Bible"


Personally if you ask me the most misused verses from the Bible, it would be Genesis and Revelation being misused by fundamentalists.



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 10:35 AM
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a reply to: dollukka

Well, Jesus said that "The Kingdom of God is within", and "asking" is an action of looking for some aid from outside. So, I would interpret it as "the gifts of the spirit", also known as the bread and water of life, reflected through a sense of peace and acceptance, wisdom, patience, longsuffering, etc., all are found within us, through prayer or introspection and meditation.

But, when it comes to actual hunger, disease and the whims and quarrels we confront that hinder the enjoyment of daily life and our ability to survive and thrive, I do think that the teachings of Jesus DO actually address gifts of the material world that are, supposedly, bestowed on those who "believe".


Matthew 17:20
He replied, "Because you have so little faith. Truly I tell you, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there,' and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you."


"This Mountain" represents a real, solid obstacle, that exists outside of oneself. Whether it be a person, a law, a lack of something or whatever, it is something that is outside of oneself that must be physically moved aside. Jesus promises believers this ability to affect outside influences.


Matthew 6:26
Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they?


Jesus said we shouldn't worry about food, shelter or clothing, because God takes care of birds, so we should have faith that those outside needs will be taken care of. So, what if they're NOT being met? We're suppose to pray and ask for help and have faith that Jesus heard and will answer the prayer, right?

And, finally, there doesn't seem to be a limit on what or how much believers can ask Jesus for stuff that's outside of the "Kingdom" which is within.


John 14:12
Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.


This means that believers should be able to physically heal the sick, raise the dead, manifest food from almost nothing, and turn water to wine. All things that are outside of the "Kingdom that is within", and are material and worldly in nature


13 And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it.


"Whatever" and "anything" certainly give way, and pave the road for the "Gospel of Prosperity and Materialism".

It's all in there!


edit on 27-3-2015 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 11:07 AM
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a reply to: backcase
Church is not a material thing, what he said in Luke 12:15
Then he said to them, "Watch out! Be on your guard against all kinds of greed; life does not consist in an abundance of possessions." same should also be the truth considering church. In Bible there is no description of existence of church as a material institution its not about gathering riches, selling alms or profiting from it.
Church as i see it is about people who have faith, not about the church as an institution. Church as a building should be considered as a tool which makes approaching to God easier.
There is nothing in the Bible, which says that the Eucharist needs a church.



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 12:24 PM
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originally posted by: dollukka
a reply to: backcase
Church is not a material thing, what he said in Luke 12:15
Then he said to them, "Watch out! Be on your guard against all kinds of greed; life does not consist in an abundance of possessions." same should also be the truth considering church. In Bible there is no description of existence of church as a material institution its not about gathering riches, selling alms or profiting from it.
Church as i see it is about people who have faith, not about the church as an institution. Church as a building should be considered as a tool which makes approaching to God easier.
There is nothing in the Bible, which says that the Eucharist needs a church.


You can't have one without the other. The church is good although there are people in it that aim to corrupt it and give it a bad name.

It is made up of a good congregation of believers and produces saints out of simple people.

Your perception of the Church is not correct, you suspect it and seek all the bad in it.



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 01:53 PM
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originally posted by: backcase

You can't have one without the other. The church is good although there are people in it that aim to corrupt it and give it a bad name.

It is made up of a good congregation of believers and produces saints out of simple people.

Your perception of the Church is not correct, you suspect it and seek all the bad in it.


I guess you are catholic and your words seem so offset to me. Early Christians didn´t worship wrong idolatry and their only focus was to reach God through Jesus and in it´s simplest form. There were no worshipping of Virgin Mary, Apostles or other "saints", that all came along with catholism. You may ask why the idolatry was needed and what was it´s purpose ? Virgin Mary ( even chosen one ) and others who are worshipped were only people.Why all the trinkets, gold and fortune needed ? Was the purpose of idolatry to show people that doing good deeds to others and for church you can buy a status.

This is where we see the corruption and misguiding institution. A church which should give a good example and guide to salvation.
When it´s ok for the church to gain prosperity and power, sends a message to people that materialism is ok.

My perception of the Church is quite Lutheran, we value modesty and simplicity not all that shines. Purpose of the church is not an attraction, its a place among other places where you can talk to God.
edit on 27-3-2015 by dollukka because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 02:27 PM
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a reply to: dollukka



Originally posted by dollukak
Jesus said " Ask and you will be given" this is the most misused verse from the Bible. Jesus never talked about seeking for material things, only material thing he talked about was a bread in "father of ours" prayer " Give us this day our daily bread" He also said that" I am the bread of life, whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me shall never thirst", when you see what he means, you probably also see that our daily bread is not about our physical needs, instead it´s about our needs in spirit.

"Ask and you shall be given" verse of Jesus is not about material needs either, it is also about our spiritual needs. With this verse misused, we see the ugly side of Christianity.


I agree with your OP…

Too many people are just building up material things for themselves, instead of building fruit that will last…




John 14:13
And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son.



Praying in Jesus name is the key important part, because his name represents all the things that Jesus lived and died for…

So for example, you can’t pray for your neighbour to be struck be lightning, etc... because that wouldn’t be praying in the NAME of Jesus…

Praying in the name of Jesus, means to pray in the character and the things that Jesus represents and stands for etc…if people aren’t praying for things along those lines, then they are not praying in Jesus name, regardless of whatever name they use…


Praying for guidance in your life and praying for the fruits of the Holy Spirit, are the things that Jesus had in mind…IMO


- JC



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 03:03 PM
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I've always heard the teaching as "Ask and all things are given" and it's generally linked with the idea that God answers all prayers in His own time, in His own way. And sometimes, the answer is also No. Generally, you should conclude that it's not a good idea to ask God for greedy things, but you can certainly do so and He will answer. The implication of the teachings I've heard are that you may not like the results of the prayer or that He may simply say no.



posted on Mar, 27 2015 @ 03:14 PM
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a reply to: ketsuko

That is an usual explanation parents often tell to their children or what is taught in Sunday schools. Easy explanation to what they do not understand or have misunderstood.
Cute anyway.



posted on Mar, 28 2015 @ 03:11 PM
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a reply to: dollukka

God ALLOWS violence knowing that it will make us unhappy and eventually we will want His Spirit of Peace even more. God ALLOWS materialism knowing that we will discover that fulfillment comes from Spirit.

John says that God is Love and he who knows Love knows God. This means Love is the only true fulfillment and everything else is its own punishment - darkness - absence of God - weeping, moaning and gnashing of teeth.



posted on Mar, 28 2015 @ 03:50 PM
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Your perceptions of The Catholic Church are, like millions of others, completely wrong.

We do not worship idols, statues, etc.
We do not worship Mary, the saints or the apostles.
We are not overflowing with gold, trinkets, etc.
We cannot "buy status".
We are not misguided.(The Holy Spirit guides The Church.
A Guide for salvation? In the church Jesus started, The Catholic Church, of course, yes it's the best place, it's why He started His Church.
The Catholic Church is not about prosperity and power. It's about Jesus.
The Catholic Church is not buildings. It's people...doing exactly as Jesus taught.

You're wrong about Catholicism. Jesus' church is the fullness of Truth.





a reply to: dollukka



posted on Mar, 28 2015 @ 06:04 PM
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a reply to: Ignatian

Catholism is fascinating, it does please the eye. You say you don´t but maybe you don´t see it.

Definition of ALTAR
a usually raised structure or place on which sacrifices are offered or incense is burned in worship —often used figuratively to describe a thing given great or undue precedence or value especially at the cost of something else.

There are altars for Virgin Mother and saints, people do give sacrifices to them and pray for them whatever they feel needed.

Still catholic church is the richest institution in this planet. 2000 years of wealth.

But remember, it's not the peoples fault when their churches seek riches, at the end, we all make personal choices do we go along with it.

I have visited many catholic churches and monasteries in Europe, when churches are beautiful inside the monastery life is more beautiful in its simple form. Vanity vs Modesty.

After all, its all about personal choices and how we see and read the scripture.


a reply to: arpgme
You have very good points, it is up to us how we live our lives.
edit on 28-3-2015 by dollukka because: (no reason given)




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