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Torture Begins at the Top

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posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 01:32 PM
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Think George Dubya's in charge?
Think again, amigos. Rumsfeld and Cheney are running the show. If that weren't the case, Rumsfeld would've been forced to resign in shame long ago for his dispicable, wretched leadership. Our country is out of its collective mind putting up with this administration's absolute lack of accountability.



Torture Begins at the Top

By Joe Conason

12/17/04 "Salon.com" -- Renewed exposure of prisoner abuse, torture and even murder by American military personnel in Iraq and Afghanistan is widening already deep divisions between the Pentagon and the intelligence community - and creating an untenable situation for Donald Rumsfeld, the beleaguered secretary of defense. A recently disclosed FBI memo indicates that "marching orders" to abandon traditional interrogation methods came from the defense secretary himself.

In recent days, a coalition of human rights groups led by the American Civil Liberties Union and the Center for Constitutional Rights has brought new cases of abuse to public attention. Using the Freedom of Information Act, they have pried thousands of pages of previously secret documents from the Defense Department and other agencies.

Even after the shock of Abu Ghraib, these substantiated stories of cruelty, sadism and lawlessness are stunning. Files from the Navy's Criminal Investigative Service describe how U.S. Marines ordered four Iraqi teenagers to kneel while a gun was "discharged to conduct a mock execution"; how they inflicted severe burns on a detainee's hands with flaming alcohol; and how they tortured another detainee with an electric transformer, making him "dance." In June, a Navy investigator revealed in an e-mail that his caseload of "high visibility" cases of abuse was "exploding." As a result of such offenses, at least two Marines were convicted and sent to prison.

If justice has been done in a few cases, the ACLU documents show that abuses were more common - and more extreme - than the Bush administration had previously conceded. More important, however, the documents show that the impetus for abuse came from above, not below. The use of coercive and violent methods spread from Guantnamo Bay, where alleged Taliban and al-Qaida prisoners are incarcerated, to Iraq and Afghanistan.
www.informationclearinghouse.info...




posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 02:17 PM
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I have not doubt in my mind that our government officials knew very well what was going on with the abuses in Afghanistan and Iraq.

What they were never expecting was to be leak out to the media.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 02:26 PM
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I wouldn't be surprised if Bush, Cheney, and Rumsfeld participated in those activities themselves.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 05:01 PM
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Originally posted by sweatmonicaIdo
I wouldn't be surprised if Bush, Cheney, and Rumsfeld participated in those activities themselves.


Please I can not take a picture of them doing anything like the abuse, can you imagine all three of them engage in that type of conduct.

It makes me gag just to think about it.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 05:15 PM
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I think Bush, Cheney, and Rumsfeld did all know what was going
on.
It would probably still be going on, only a lot worse if the leak to
the media had'nt happened.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 05:28 PM
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EastCoastKid,

After reading a few of your posts, I'm convinced you're sitting in a psycho ward of a hospital somewhere, typing furiously on a computer, while babbling incoherently about a massive government conspiracy to put valium in our drinking water.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 05:37 PM
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Originally posted by elaine
It would probably still be going on, only a lot worse if the leak to
the media had'nt happened.



That's exactly my sentiments elaine, who knows what would have happened if nobody ever found out about all the dirty stuff they did.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 05:44 PM
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Originally posted by JimboE

EastCoastKid,

After reading a few of your posts, I'm convinced you're sitting in a psycho ward of a hospital somewhere, typing furiously on a computer, while babbling incoherently about a massive government conspiracy to put valium in our drinking water.
EastCoast is the man, he's very sane and knows exactly what he talks about. It is YOU who needs a dose of something to stabilize your brain.


Dont agree with us, so we're insane? huh???

I should call your ward.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 05:47 PM
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Originally posted by elaine
I think Bush, Cheney, and Rumsfeld did all know what was going
on.
It would probably still be going on, only a lot worse if the leak to
the media had'nt happened.

Elaine, of course they knew and presently know exactly what is going on...and these courtmarshalls you hear about are a few patsys just to cover up and make it look like we punish for such crimes.

I see we have a troll on this thread.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 05:55 PM
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I don't know what would happen to this country if we were all
so naive as to believe everything this administration is telling us
now.

Thank goodness we have the people who aren't scared to
question the activities of our government. Otherwise, things
like the torture in those prisons, would run rampant. This
country would be a whole lot worse off, I'm sure.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 05:57 PM
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DGTempe,

EastCoast is the man ?? HA, thats a laugh, and if you agree with him, you must be a patient in the same psycho ward.

Here's a tip,-----that kool-aid they give you in the hospital has the valium in it.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 06:06 PM
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Originally posted by JimboE
DGTempe,

EastCoast is the man ?? HA, thats a laugh, and if you agree with him, you must be a patient in the same psycho ward.

Here's a tip,-----that kool-aid they give you in the hospital has the valium in it.


JimboE, bashing established members of these boards is not going to make you any popular around here, is nice to add some inside to the boards and to post your views but you have done none so far.

Just do a nice post disagreeing or agreeing with the thread and that is all you have to do. But trashing the thread is not going to work.

Just a nice reminder from a fellow member.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 06:12 PM
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Originally posted by JimboE
DGTempe,

EastCoast is the man ?? HA, thats a laugh, and if you agree with him, you must be a patient in the same psycho ward.

Here's a tip,-----that kool-aid they give you in the hospital has the valium in it.
Listen to Marg's words of wisdom. This fixation you seem to have with mental institutions lead me to think that you are a guest. YOU drink the coolaid.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 06:14 PM
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Originally posted by JimboE
DGTempe,

EastCoast is the man ?? HA, thats a laugh, and if you agree with him, you must be a patient in the same psycho ward.

Here's a tip,-----that kool-aid they give you in the hospital has the valium in it.


JimBO, you have'nt contributed anything to this thread but insults.
Why have'nt you said why you disagree? You'd rather hurl personal
insults than admit you can't think of any good arguments for whatever
you think?
(sighs)....that's so typical.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 06:26 PM
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Typical ?? of what ?? If someone wants to talk intelligently on a subject, if I'm interested, I'll offer an intelligent remark. But when someone like EastCoast only offers these moronic ravings, then he's fair game.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 06:32 PM
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Originally posted by JimboE

Typical ?? of what ?? If someone wants to talk intelligently on a subject, if I'm interested, I'll offer an intelligent remark. But when someone like EastCoast only offers these moronic ravings, then he's fair game.


JimboE, I suggest you read the terms and conditions in ATS, that will ensured a nice and pleasant experience in these boards.

Now back to the thread.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 06:38 PM
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Well ECK, its old news that rummy and Dick have been pulling the strings theyve had so much practice since the Nixon days, and just like the Nixon days these crooks will slip away when, and if the heat does get turned on them.

JimboE: do you have a point that you wish to add to the discussion of Torture Begins at the Top, Do you have proof that what ECK has brought to us is wrong if so post it!

I have just finished reading all of you twelve post here on ATS; three about some Doctor telling you of frozen EBEs. The other nine of you posts are you criticizing the information / Poster made available to the members here, you post no information just insults, might I suggest if you want to be a critic then you had better have proof. A word to the wise you will gain no respect with one-line insults to a members character on this board.

And if I didn't no better I would call you a Troll
Sauron

you call ECK fair game well he can look after himself, and I believe he is being the Gentleman so far, but be warned it will not last



[edit on 19/12/2004 by Sauron]



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 06:53 PM
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Here we go again. ECK is a pretty good guy. A little obsessed with dumb dubya, but basically a cool dude. BUT, make no mistake W runs the show. He and I agree with what Rummy has done. The ACLU is pure evil. So is Salon. The definition of Torture is so diluted that a harsh "look" gets you burnt-brownie-points. The war on terror is for survival of the species. The right to have things like ATS. What ever it takes.........

Trolls Unite....eat those evil libs.......



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 06:54 PM
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Well Sauron,

Sorry if you don't like my postings, but when I read these left-wing, radical BS rantings against everyone in government, my answers won't be any nicer. You should move to Canada, you'll fit right in.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 07:00 PM
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Originally posted by JimboE

Well Sauron,

Sorry if you don't like my postings, but when I read these left-wing, radical BS rantings against everyone in government, my answers won't be any nicer. You should move to Canada, you'll fit right in.


Move to Canada well thank you for the advice I will take it under consideration also where it came from.

Now do you have some thing constructive to ad to this thread?
I would rather hear your answers than you trashing people

[edit on 19/12/2004 by Sauron]




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