The Creationist Myth - 500,000-Year-Old Stone Tools, Butchered Elephant Bones Found in Israel

a reply to: Develo

sure they can. i use to think the earth was 6k years old. i don't think that anymore.

originally posted by: undo
a reply to: Answer

actually, it's worse than that. he's trying to establish a precedent for accusing protestant christians (Evangelicals / Fundies) of being terrorists. his posts on these topics are almost entirely political.

Lol, I wasn't even thinking about this.


Fundamentalism, Muslim, Jewish or Christian, does promote segregation, dogma and intolerance though. There is no denying this.

originally posted by: undo
a reply to: Develo

sure they can. i use to think the earth was 6k years old. i don't think that anymore.

Good.

Next thing maybe stop believing the bible is about cloning and aliens


e: anyway sorry for the derail, you may continue discussing proofs the earth is older than 6000 years old

a reply to: Develo

nah, i've been in debates with you before.

originally posted by: Develo

originally posted by: Answer
What you've actually done is turned the thread from a debate between young-earthers and others about the accuracy of scientific dating methods into a debate about the number of young-earth Christians.

Personally I find it more interesting because I have yet to see a single young-earther change opinion based on scientific data, so debates like this are sterile.

Believe in a young earth is a delusion (because contradicting proofs exist) and as such, people who believe in it cannot be reasoned.

Now on that we definitely agree.

a reply to: Develo

tell ya what, you believe what you want, and i'll believe what i want, and we'll be fine. but you keep insisting on being my brain for me, and we're gonna have problems. your brain is separate from mine for a reason.

a reply to: Answer

i just said, three posts up, that i used to be a young earther and i'm not anymore. so he's wrong.

Humans must surely be the most gullible liveform on planet earth, of course humans have been here on the earth for who knows how long exactly? could be 500,000 years could be 10,000,000 years, what the hell is the difference, all humans are here for not much more than 5 minutes, of time, in relation to the expanse around them.
Why doesn't everyone grow up and move on, and accept the evidence.
Instead of looking for what makes us special. Special my a22. we are humans and one of the cruellest of all lifeforms on the earth. so we found a few tools belonging to earlier human kind, how much of that is out there, most likely tonnes of all kinds of tools and bones and artifacts from a million years past.
We are all here waiting for the metamorphis to free us of the chains that bind us to this planet. just go do something good for someone, stop moaning, stop judging. and move on towards your ultimate destiny. simples! and above all accept the evidence that is in front of you.

originally posted by: undo
a reply to: Answer

i just said, three posts up, that i used to be a young earther and i'm not anymore. so he's wrong.

There's an exception to every rule, obviously.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
I was a little annoyed at the OP making this into a YEC debate when we could have just as easily talked about the find instead. To hell with stupid beliefs. Entertaining them as ideas only allows idiots to maintain the rationalizations that their reasoning is valid.

These bait threads are useless anyways.

So much agree.

a reply to: Develo

To be honest, if the OP had presented just the evidence instead of his own personal opinion on YEC, the YECers would have shown up anyways to lay down their standard "radiometric dating is inaccurate" fallacy (well they usually say C-14 dating is inaccurate).

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
Entertaining them as ideas only allows idiots to maintain the rationalizations that their reasoning is valid.

These bait threads are useless anyways.

i don't think i'm an idiot. at least, last time i checked i wasn't. and i have rationalizations for it, but my rationalizations are that people are assuming the text says things, that it doesn't.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Develo

To be honest, if the OP had presented just the evidence instead of his own personal opinion on YEC, the YECers would have shown up anyways to lay down their standard "radiometric dating is inaccurate" fallacy (well they usually say C-14 dating is inaccurate).

The most fascinating to me is that all of the cognitive dissonances the YEC suffer from would simply vanish if they accepted Genesis is a creation story like you have in all culture.

The basis for the Christian religion would not suddenly crumble if Genesis (especially early chapters) was a myth. Even the whole OT doesn't really matter to a Christian. A true Christian would simply follow the teaching of Jesus.

Actually it even enriches the Christian tradition to read genesis symbolically since myths can have more meaning than meet the eyes (and that's why scholars do it too). I learned many things studying the symbolism in genesis.

a reply to: Develo

Actually it even enriches the Christian tradition to read genesis symbolically since myths can have more meaning than meet the eyes (and that's why scholars do it too). I learned many things studying the symbolism in genesis.

that would make a good thread.

originally posted by: undo
that would make a good thread.

I think so too.

I really enjoyed thinking about how many things in the first steps of biblical creation are similar to what you find in most culture (differentiation, polarization, combination and movement, creation, life) and which can be related to most/all creative processes in the universe.

Or how Adam and Eve getting the knowledge of good and evil and becoming ashamed of being naked is so similar to what happens to us when we grow up.

If it's something children go though, it probably means it's something mankind as a whole went through too, to become different from other animals.



Truly, it's never as easy as "the bible is wrong" or "the bible is right".

The bible is a peek into the minds of another time, and to get most of it you have to put yourself in the shoes of people in the antiquity without assuming they were stupid.

The language of symbols and stories is widespread, it's what the first culture were based on. It's logical to find such forms in a book like the bible, a compendium of the ancient jewish belief and culture. It's logical to read the bible through the lens of symbols, stories and allegories.

Just for clarification...

The point of my thread was to prove man was not created 6000 years ago or even 40,000 years ago as other parts of the Bible would suggest (a thousand generations).

The scripture certainly hints at a time line of 40,000 years. It's one of the more accurate interpretations considering an average biblical generation is 40 years.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Develo

The reason I joined this thread so late was because I was a little annoyed at the OP making this into a YEC debate when we could have just as easily talked about the find instead. To hell with stupid beliefs. Entertaining them as ideas only allows idiots to maintain the rationalizations that their reasoning is valid.

These bait threads are useless anyways. I've already made the mistake of trying to bait YECers into a Creationism debate. These threads always end up with a bunch of OECers coming in and getting offended at the shorthand "Creationists" being applied solely to YECers while barely any YECers actually show up to debate anything. This is mostly because a YECer needs to craft an argument around his fallacies to be correct, if their fallacies start off unraveled then they don't have an argument. Thus even if they do enter they quickly leave the thread after a page or two.

Fine, poo poo on you.

The less young earth creationists on ATS the better. With every "bait" thread we make, if done correctly to which I will leave that open to interpretation, we have the ability to educate when that evidence is hard to dismiss. The very reason I or some come here. And I am not known for being politically correct, hand holding or to sprinkle sugar all over my thoughts.

With that said, I respect your opinion. They are always respectable.

a reply to: eisegesis

It's a free forum. You are free to make such threads regardless of my opinion on them. Just saying that I've traveled this route and found it does more harm than good.

a reply to: undo

Sorry, I refuse to call the belief that the earth isn't billions of years old anything but idiotic, because it is. There is more than enough definitive proof to say that is the case. Refusing to believe that humans are anything but hundreds of thousands of years old and arrived here through evolution is idiotic.

Denial of either of these two points requires denial of all sorts of valid evidence as well as denial of multiple topics across many different scientific disciplines. It is just willful ignorance at play.

Sigh.

Leave it to ATS to take a scientific discovery and just use it as ammunition against Christians, as if it has no real, intrinsic value. It would be amusing, if it wasn't so sad, how far some folks will go to get a dig in against Christians, using scientific discovery as a weapon against them rather than recognizing it's real value.

Gives a whole new interpretation to the notion that science is a tool for understanding - now it has been demoted as just a tool of attack, to hell with the understanding.

Isaac Newton would be so proud...