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Here We Go Again! Body cam footage Dallas PD shoot mentally ill man

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posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 07:52 AM

People are called criminals for a reason.

Spoken like a true cop. Is it also safe to say that one off the books action by a police officer makes them a bent cop through and through? It's like you think if you call people criminals, you get to do what you want with them. It's way more complex than that, and if you only see people in a criminal or non-criminal light, you need to get another job.
edit on 18-3-2015 by IvanAstikov because: (no reason given)

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 07:56 AM
Ya really need to work on the camera placement for things like this. Needs to be in a location that keeps it from being blocked. Should also switch the lens to wide angle get a better view of what the police are really seeing.

I mean really one camera is pointed at another police good part of the time and the other was blocked by what I'm guessing was an arm maybe. Maybe we shoulder rigs, cause I don't think police would want to ware a head rig all the time. I'm still for mounting a camera on the lethal carry as well.

I'm not going to make judgement on the actions. It's a bad spot, car behind them, space smaller then 10' so can't use the taser, blocked on one side and people in the way of the other. All I can maybe ask was this the safest way to position them self when responding to this call. Which it could have been since we're not shown them walking up to the door.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 08:01 AM
Finally, some constructive criticism. They certainly didn't give themselves the best opportunity for ending this incident non-fatally, and any cop who says they did needs sacking immediately.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 08:47 AM
A few years ago Dallas police shot another mentally ill man, and claimed he rushed them with a knife.
Since whatever the cops say is taken for undisputed truth, the abusers got away with it, while the victim was charged with aggravated assault.

And then the video came out..

Expectedly, the video proved the victim stood up and did nothing more.
If it wasn't for the video, he'd still be in jail for a long time

Charges dropped. Mentally ill man shot by officer

Not that this is a cut and dry case either way. Cuz the left handed officer seems to intentionally cut the victim out of the camera shot, while keeping his gun hand to side. i.e. Facing east while his gun and the victim are to the north.

But I can't seem to think these cops wanted a different outcome, and have no training in anything other than using weapons and justifying it..

The mother called the police to help get her son to a hospital.. She should have known better
This is what happens when you call the police!

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 09:06 AM
So , most of the people on here think the police do the correct thing by using lethal force in what may be stated as a domestic dispute. Interesting.In the military you are trained in house-house fighting to assess the situation . The people in the home may be a frightened family . You just dont use lethal force as a knee-jerk reaction because your are in a hostile country , in a hot zone in a city or town somewhere. If in doubt and you think the situation warrants immediate action , you use a non-lethal shot to the leg , etc. to take them down. Strange it should be different in your own country , with your own people.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 09:12 AM
Hello again Xcathdra its been awhile, how are you.


The mother called the police and her son was armed..

If he had a pencil it would be just as lethal a weapon no? so ok armed with a lethal pencil like weapon yes. a small screwdriver. Ive seen Batman Dark knight and pencils are lethal.

If he is not going to listen to her and he is not going to listen o law enforcement what option is there

Well then the police should have already suspected that and explained that her son will be shot multiple times if they are to respond to her request to help because if he wont listen to her he will not listen to them either so he will be dead meat what other option was there?, sorry mum just doing our duty.

Oh well she will know better next time not to call the police I hope and call someone who actually wants to help.

But as you have said to us armchair experts there coulda been people in jeopardy inside the house (that the mother was so calm about), and there coulda been people next door that he coulda ran off and knocked their door down and woulda stabbed with his lethal weapon so the cops woulda done the only action they coulda done and were squeaky clean and by the book. (man I wish someone had a cool pic about coulda shoulda woulda that only applies to one side of the argument or are we not supposed to discuss these topics and give our own points of view? and discuss them)

Guns were already out and pointing at him or he woulda stabbed the cop to death as he was clearly aggressive and flipping his lid and was closer than 26 feet, but luckily his mum came running out screaming hysterically "he`s got a weapon he`s got a weapon oh my God save us all, this spawn of satan needs to die!! " , so if he didnt drop the pencil oops I mean lethal screwdriver he`s dead meat. Yep by the book, or make it seem as close to it as possible.

That's the thing Xcathdra I doubt anyone is arguing they didn't react by the book its just that your book sucks if this is a show of it yet again and that there are other options in these type of circumstances.

Oh and just a side note for anyone who may think otherwise..

People sometimes think mental illness and violence always go together. This is not the case, the vast majority of people with mental illness are not violent.

Are people with a mental illness violent?
Having a mental illness does not mean someone will be violent. People receiving treatment for a mental illness are no more violent or dangerous than anyone else. To make this clear, it has been calculated that the lifetime risk of someone with an illness such as schizophrenia seriously harming or killing another person is just .005%. It is much more likely that someone with a mental illness will hurt themselves, or be hurt by someone else.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 09:15 AM

originally posted by: LoveSolMoonDeath
a reply to: twiztedjester

I don't know if you ever been in shooting or close to a leathal situation but I can assure you that just afterward, when the threat is gone, the is a great rush of adrenaline and you need to catch your breath. So yes you can say stuff like that afterward. Nobody wants to be involve in stuff like that.

well i can agreen but call me ignorant if you would like. 1 they chose to be cops nobody made that choice but them. 2 they are trained im not and first thing i would have done is back away as far as i could manage because as said nobody wants to be in this position.Sorry but they choose to put their lives on the line of their own free will and the man though he may have lunged or made for the cops should have been handled dif on that fact alone, i think cops should clearly understand defending themselves is not priority number one, its a risk that comes with the job. I wont say i like cops but i do thank them for trying if they dont abuse the power. Its just you choose this you put your life on tge line understand that things may and will happen to you you wish wouldnt and if it does its your fault so do not think your life is worth more than his as an officer your supposed to help him or others not just yourselves. I know the mentality i have may be harsh but we all take risk and knowing the risk makes it our fault not others.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 09:20 AM
a reply to: here4this

The report has already given the all clear to both police if I read it all right. (this is not me saying I'm ok with how this was handled)

I do think it could have been handle better. but seems like they are new to the job or at least new to calls like this. Since one police kept talking his head off at the end. He most likely needs a mental review after this, just to check if he's ok if they already haven't done one.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 09:32 AM
sounds like people are not going to be happy until officers allow themselves to be stabbed before nuetralizing a threat. I come from a time when I was taught from an early age to not attack people and charge them with weapons. all you LE out there are welcome to move into my neighborhood anytime. we will take all we can get. Not everyone hates you guys. I have said before I have neibors that are LE. 4 of them in fact. One of them is even Black! Oh the horror! all of them are great guys with nice respectful children and our sheriff is top of the line In my book. I like having them around.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 09:39 AM
a reply to: agenda51

Ya seems like it. I still think it could have been handled better and would have liked better video footage. I'm also not 100% or even 90% sure they handle the tail end of the call right. The attacker was on the ground bleeding, one police even said he was still alive but not restrained.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 09:40 AM
a reply to: HighFive

A weapon is a weapon is a weapon.

Screwdrivers can do damage, just like a knife can.

Mental illness has now become what shouting racist used to be.

Neither are defenses for attacking anyone, even LEOs.

Don't want to be shot?? Don't lunge at someone while holding something that can be used as a weapon.

Has anyone here ever been stabbed with a screwdriver??? Or seen what happens or can happen??

I do love the ATS armchair quarterbacks here.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 09:41 AM
a reply to: here4this

Are you telling us that you received training in the US military for shooting people in the leg???

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 09:42 AM

Link to Pic and News story

In the picture, you can see the man not in the doorway, rather approaching the officer with no body cam.

How you doing, ma'am?” An officer is heard saying on the video as he arrives to the front door.
“What's going on?”
Harrison's mother: “He's just off the chain...incoherent.”
Officer: “Who is that?”
Mother: “…Talking about chopping up people. My son. Bipolar, schizo.”
Harrison is seen standing at the front door with a screwdriver, all less than three feet from the officers. “What's going on?” Harrison asks.
Officer: “Will you drop that for me? Drop that for me, guy.”
Harrison: “Nah, I ain't.”
Then, police and Harrison's mother raise their voices. Harrison doesn't follow commands and continues to hold the screwdriver.
Mother: “J!” Officer: “Drop it! Drop it!” Mother: “J!”
Both officers then open fire, hitting Harrison five times.
“Does he make some movement toward the officer?” FOX 4's Shaun Rabb asked attorney Geoff Henley, who is representing Harrison's family.
“What you cannot see is him assaulting either officer. You do not see that,” Henley said, lunging forward.
“Does he move toward the officer?” said Rabb.
“Well you can see there's movement from the…I mean, he is in the threshold in the beginning, and then toward the end, he's on the porch,” said Henley.


The LiveLeak source above has a much longer video that gives more context to the situation. Take from it what you will. Don't judge until you have the whole story. Someone mentioned earlier in this thread that the officers told the mother they could not talk about it. Dallas PD has a new policy that does not allow them to be interviewed By IA, or anyone else for 72 hours. Whether it was in place at this time, I'm not sure.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 09:57 AM
a reply to: retiredTxn

Finally some better footage. Ok ya looks like they did all they could. It's too bad that they had to and that someone died, but what I've seen he wasn't going to comply and talk things out. Dispatch might have done a better job by sending the officer that responded to the call be for. But there is no telling he wouldn't have done the same anyways.

Stupid media cutting clips, this why I'm stuck saying "from what I've seen" so much.

I still think my camera placement should be improved. I'll have to find a local department willing to test my idea on.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 10:04 AM
a reply to: macman
Uhh no. To asses the situation first and not rush to action. I stated that to recommend what COULD have been the outcome. This was not a military operation in an aggressor situation , this was police officers responding to a domestic dispute. I know that officers are trained now to handle these calls more aggressively due to the risk involved.Why all ? To have someone in a home , barricaded say with an assault rifle.Yes , in certain cases you do not want to play around . However , what crime did this person commit to make him a criminal ? Brandishing a screwdriver ? On any given day , I may have a screwdriver in my hand as well. Does that make me a criminal? What happens if a bystander mistakes my actions for something other than what I am really doing ? It has already been stated this person had mental problems and was on meds. A screwdriver , under normal circumstances , is non-lethal as a ranged weapon . These officers had at least 4-5 seconds to assess and respond. In a case like this , you would be surprised how long that is due to adrenalin rush. I am not faulting the officers for their actions , I was not there. Merely questioning the lethal action.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 10:09 AM
Much better video yet i still believe backing up when they seen the screwdriver would have possibly changes the outcome there was room to back between the car and garage door but it is much more apparent as to him going for the cop

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 10:11 AM
a reply to: here4this

Having been in the Military and LE, I can tell you that it takes 21 steps typically, for an armed person to be on someone before they can draw a weapon from a Level II holster.

Now, what was this persons crime?? Nothing ..........before he was given the order to drop a weapon, and lunged at LEOs.

ANYTHING can be turned into a weapon. Someone off medication is not thinking clearly. It is not the fault of the officers. The person made the decision to not take meds.

The officers have every right to not be harmed as the next person, regardless of their chosen profession.

And, what happens if someone mistakes your actions to be threatening and they shoot you?? Depends.....

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 10:12 AM

originally posted by: twiztedjester
Much better video yet i still believe backing up when they seen the screwdriver would have possibly changes the outcome there was room to back between the car and garage door but it is much more apparent as to him going for the cop

Couldn't do that, you can't take your eyes off the person in question. He would have had to look bad or step back with out looking, both are count as no no's.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 10:18 AM
I'm surprised at it still took them this long to give them the ok. I mean I know the legal bull$hit list is long and all, but I thought the video would speed this up more. Seems just as slow as ever. Guessing the review board wanted a few extra hours of overtime on this one.

Make me happy I no longer work in the security field.

posted on Mar, 18 2015 @ 10:26 AM
I think the Police in The States are just really really badly trained.
They get frightened and shoot without thinking about any other alternatives.
Isnt it the States that blocked high IQ people from joining the police?
This is what happens.

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