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Getting tired from fighting the same BS every day ?

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posted on Mar, 8 2015 @ 02:54 PM
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a reply to: Seed76

I'd be all for that. I'm tired of subsidizing the European welfare states by letting them outsource their national security to the US and always blame us for everything that goes wrong in the world.

Bring our soldiers home, renegotiate NATO so that every party has to put in something of equal worth - men and material or money - and let them figure out how to pay all those bills for themselves.




posted on Mar, 8 2015 @ 05:47 PM
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a reply to: BornAgainAlien


So don`t feel too discouraged, it`s a necessity that certain information becomes as public as it can!


I agree! It is imperative that everyone understand that Putin, through "private" banks is financing the Front Nationale:


The National Front (FN) borrowed € 9 million from a Russian bank, revealed Mediapart on Saturday 22 November. "No bank wants to give us one penny" explained Wallerand de Saint-Just, the extreme right party treasurer after these revelations from France Info ...

[Edit for brevity. --DJW001]

It was the MEP Jean-Luc Schaffhauser, former consultant for Dassault Aviation, who served as an intermediary with the bank and allowed the agreement to be reached. According to Mediapart, this loan is indicative of the extent of the network that the far-right party is developing with Russia.


Le Monde. [Trans. --DJW001, emphasis mine.]

Un avis plus sympathétique.

But the Front Nationale is not the only far right or neo-Nazi group that Putin has been supporting in Europe. The group of "independent observers" summoned to rubber stamp the mock referendum in Crimea reads like a virtual rogue's gallery:


The list of observers included Béla Kovács from the Hungarian far-right Jobbik Party, noted for its anti-Semitic and homophobic views; far-right Spanish politician Enrique Ravello; three representatives of the Flemish right-wing party Vlaams Belang; as well as Belgian activist Luc Michel, who began in a neo-Nazi party and now espouses National Bolshevism.


iwpr.net...

Meanwhile, in Greece:


Golden Dawn is a neo-Nazi party that has risen from a marginal role in Greek politics to become the third-largest political force in Greece in the wake of the 2008-09 global financial crisis and the subsequent implementation of severe austerity measures in Greece. Golden Dawn does not limit its extremism to rhetoric, however—party members have been involved in hundreds of acts of violence against immigrants and leftists across Greece. Currently, the Greek government is cracking down on Golden Dawn by using criminal investigations and prosecutions of key party leaders to curtail the party’s activities and funding....

[Edit for brevity --DJW001]

Public funding originally constituted an important source of financing for Golden Dawn. For example in 2013, 873,000 euros in Greek state funding had been allocated to the party. However, following a vote in parliament in October 2013, state funding for Golden Dawn was cut off due to the ongoing investigation by state prosecutors as to whether Golden Dawn is a criminal organization. 27

Golden Dawn has declined to shed light on its funding sources, stating simply that it is funded by supporters. 28 Journalist Dimitris Psarras alleges that Golden Dawn has received financial support from like-minded groups in Europe and Russia.


www.counterextremism.com... [Emphasis mine. --DJW001]

Naturally, that is not the only side Russia is supporting in Greece:


The fact that the first foreign official Mr Tsipras invited to the Maximos Mansion in Athens on Monday was Andrey Maslov, Russia’s ambassador, speaks to their [European leaders'--DJW001] concerns...

[Edit --DJW001]

Other members of Greece’s new government harbour similar views. Nikos Kotzias, the foreign minister, and Panos Kammenos, defence minister, have both been cultivated by figures close to Russian president Vladimir Putin’s inner circle.
Mr Kotzias — a former Piraeus university professor — has espoused increasingly nationalist positions, developing a relationship with Alexander Dugin, the Russian nationalist philosopher, during several visits to Moscow, according to a colleague who declined to be identified.

Mr Dugin, who is close to several figures in the Moscow security establishment and last August called for a “genocide” of Ukrainians, was invited by Mr Kotzias to speak at an event in the Piraeus campus in 2013, where he extolled the role of Orthodox Christianity in uniting Greeks and Russians.


www.ft.com... [Emphasis mine. --DJW001]

Why is Putin's Russia so found of European Fascists? It is easy to see why Fascists admire Putin's Russia: a strong, centralized State ruled by a charismatic leader wielding absolute power; military adventurism; ultra-nationalism. But why is Putin supporting groups like the FN, and even groups as apparently dissimilar as Golden Dawn and Syriza in the same country?

Putin has inadvertently explained it with his continual accusation that the West is trying to "destabilize" Russia. He cannot possibly believe this. Russia has institutions that have been functioning, with changes only in name and personnel, for hundreds of years! It has a homogeneous, if diverse, culture spanning two continents. It cannot plausibly be "destabilized."

Not so the European Union! The EU is less than 50 years old, lacks a common language and incorporates states that are traditional enemies. Unlike the Russian Federation, which will use military force against any region which tries to secede, as the tragedy of Chechniya demonstrates, European states are free to withdraw from the Union any time they please.

By financing and encouraging European ultra-Nationalist parties, Putin is creating political pressure within the member states for exiting the EU. Putin is trying to destabilize the EU. He knows that Russia can better compete economically with Germany, France and England separately than it can against them as a unified bloc.

In other words, Vladimir Putin is already fighting a covert war aimed at the destruction of the European Union.

Are you with him, or against him?

edit on 8-3-2015 by DJW001 because: (no reason given)

edit on 8-3-2015 by DJW001 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 8 2015 @ 09:39 PM
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originally posted by: noeltrotsky

originally posted by: grandmakdw
Excellent point. From the Russian point of view, Ukraine is the equivalent of a state in the US.


Well this Russian 'point of view' is wrong. Ukraine is a fully independent country.

Your policy of MYOB clearly doesn't work by the way. You might want to pull your head out of the sand one day. Or not.


What business does the US have in interfering in the Russia/Ukraine dispute. None, nothing, nada. There is no US interest involved and it is really none of the US business. The surrounding states and former soviet union independent countries, it is their business. It is in no way the business of the US.

My head is not in the sand, I just don't think US should behave as an imperialist / police the world state. It should MYOB and let the people involved work it out themselves and not try and tell anyone else what the US thinks is the "right thing to do". There are always two sides to every issue, in this case it is my wide awake opinion that the US should not get involved in business across the pond that doesn't affect the US directly.

When it comes to the ME, my head is also not in the sand. The terrorist religious Jihad has been ongoing for thousands of years if one takes an honest look at history. It is absolutely and positively a religious war that can only be made worse with the interference of infidels. Infidels (the US) getting involved will only make martyrs out of those they kill and create even more religious hatred toward the secular US, which is seen as a product of the Devil that must be stamped out. Interfering is not the way to go.

Let the ME nations take care of their own. Imperialist / police state US has no business interfering there. Harshly dealing with terrorists on our own soil, yes. Interfering with a religious war that is basically thousands of years old? That is extremely foolish.

It is high time the US mind its own business. I am also for stopping all foreign aid to countries who speak ill of the US after getting the aid. If giving foreign aid harms the US, through being verbally attacked by the leadership receiving the aid, then it is stupid to keep giving it.


edit on 9Sun, 08 Mar 2015 21:41:08 -0500pm30803pmk080 by grandmakdw because: grammar



posted on Mar, 9 2015 @ 05:26 AM
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a reply to: grandmakdw


What business does the US have in interfering in the Russia/Ukraine dispute. None, nothing, nada.


The United States actually has more at stake in Eastern Europe than in the "Middle East." American corporations have been investing in former Soviet states, like Ukraine. American citizens live and work there. Therefore, setting aside the legal necessity of enforcing the Budapest Memorandum, which Putin has flagrantly broken, the United States has assets there it must protect.


There is no US interest involved and it is really none of the US business.


In addition to the interests outlined above, the United States is a member of NATO. Should Putin continue his war of aggression against Europe by open means, the United States will be obliged to engage Russia militarily. It would be better for everyone if the United States and Russia fought a smaller, contained proxy war in Eastern Ukraine than an unlimited war across the European continent.


The surrounding states and former soviet union independent countries, it is their business.


And they have made it clear they object to Putin's imperialism; that is why they have joined NATO.


It is in no way the business of the US.


Wrong. If Putin should attack a member of NATO, the United States is obliged to defend them.


My head is not in the sand, I just don't think US should behave as an imperialist / police the world state.


I agree the United States should not act as an imperialist power, and it should not seek out situations in which it can serve as a "policeman." Nevertheless, the United States is already obliged by both the Budapest Memorandum and the North Atlantic Treaty to put an end to Putin's illegal activities in Ukraine.


It should MYOB and let the people involved work it out themselves and not try and tell anyone else what the US thinks is the "right thing to do".


But Russia is not minding its own business! Putin is attempting to impose his will on his neighbors. It is clear that the people who are being imposed upon want and need America's help. Not responding to their pleas would be immoral.


There are always two sides to every issue, in this case it is my wide awake opinion that the US should not get involved in business across the pond that doesn't affect the US directly.


Would you prefer to wait until Putin tries the same thing with the Baltic states or Poland? That would automatically trigger a nuclear confrontation. Would that be better?

Edit to add: I agree with you about not getting involved in West Asia; Islam has to clean up its own act.

By the way, why is this in "Education and Media?"
edit on 9-3-2015 by DJW001 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 9 2015 @ 08:15 AM
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a reply to: grandmakdw

You should read the Budapest Memorandum that the United States signed.

en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Mar, 9 2015 @ 08:25 AM
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a reply to: DJW001

Excellent post on Russian financing for several nationalist parties in the EU. Personally I accept this kind of activity as long as it is done in the open and according to the political financing laws in each country. Of course each country should have laws to limit outside influence in politics.




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