Christianity vs scientific advancement.

continued....

Yea, I've heard this before too. You aren't telling me anything I haven't heard here. It is a standard copout that Christians try to rebut with when they have failed their argument. You and I both know that if science truly aligned with the bible, your camp would be singing it from the rooftops, but because it doesn't we get this stupid analysis.

Hmmmm...you brought this point out about the Bible not being a scientific treatise and it is about Faith...not science...yet you have only science??

No you did not ..hence I offered it up to the readers here.
You come across like a politician or like the news media..not much difference today ..slanting the view by not including all the pertinent information's for the readers or viewers.

I knew this about your posts and I offered it not to you ..but to the readers out here for their consideration and education. I will continue to so do for the benefit of those who can see, hear, and understand.

Once again..you tell not the whole story and prefer readers and people without enough ability or knowledge to think for themselves. For if they knew the whole story ...they would have the ability to think for themselves.
What kind of government or people promote a system or deck with not all the cards in it for people to consider??? What kind of religion is this being promoted????

You are carrying on in your own way and manner...."The Ever War" and trying to so do with science. Astonishing.

All faith is, is belief without evidence. But here's the thing, science says that the bible is wrong. It's not like you don't have evidence for your beliefs, you have evidence that competes against your belief.

You have a very serious problem here...and one for which you and others of your persuasion do not want discussed.
Many scientists and technology types are Christians. Are you warring against freedom and individual liberty..including freedom of religion. Are you dividing and not uniting???

That is obviously what our current political leadership excels in doing..dividing a nation and people along any and everything they can identify for political lucre.

As I have tried to declare...science has put us in better homes, cars, products..et al..but it has not made us better people or improved the track record of history. Science will make for a horrible substitute for religion and a peoples religious beliefs.

The State is not god

Here again your religion falls short....right next to your holy faith of science.

I am? I'm just stating my opinion contrasted with the facts and evidence that we know. I can't make you actually use that evidence, that is on you. As for the rest of your post, just because you work in a nuclear power plant doesn't make you rational about all things in life. You just made an appeal to authority fallacy there. For instance, you don't need evolutionary theory to run a nuclear power plant. Therefore, it is conceivable that you could deny evolution is real and still run the plant just fine. Therefore, I take your resume with a grain of salt. Plus we are on the internet, your intelligence and rationale is judged by your words alone. You don't see me giving my resume to help substantiate my claims do you?

LOL LOL LOL...as I recall..this was posted with the understanding in mind that I was not against science..and also we are not that easily emoted..having certain disciplines. You are going off on a tangent here.

While we are speaking of nuclear principles...and going off on tangents..You know that dating by radioactive counts is not possible to accuracy unless you can guarantee that the sample being used has not had its radioactive count altered by leeching into or out of it over time ..yes???

To my limited knowledge the best material for preventing leeching into or out of a radioactive sample or material is black Obsidian glass. This is what I am given to understand the French discovered when researching for a solution to leeching.

This means that unless one can demonstrate that a sample being researched for dating can be shown not to have leeched into or out of...dating by that method is not accurate.

Free..no cover charge.

If you want to be rational for all your beliefs, then you first admit that you know nothing. So discard ALL belief systems, Christianity, science, spirituality, everything. THEN you apply the scientific method and gather objective evidence. Then you interpret that evidence and see what the evidence is saying. Unfortunately for you, the Bible is subjective evidence and there is no reasonable or rational explanation on why it would be true. There are too many holes in the logic to make the stories believable. People aren't trustworthy and people wrote the bible. That alone makes it doubtful, but it also defies physics and apparently is the only time in history that that has happened. Therefore it isn't consistent. And finally there is no evidence and even, at times, counter-evidence for the bible.

Now this last quote is pure politics. It is also textbook of todays intelligence, illumination, enlightenment and bias. Politicians are not trustworthy and not good keepers of the public felicity...faith.


This is really capital and not worthy of your intellect....in the face of the American way....the Constitution of the United States... but it is textbook of the Politics and religion of socialism.

People aren't trustworthy and people wrote the bible.

If people are not trustworthy..why would one ever trust them with arms...why would anyone ever trust them with a vote...trust them with their own opinions, beliefs, and thoughts????

I can tell you this answer...It is that people in this system which has been Hijacked by a socialist authoritarian system in its core...does not in fact trust its people. This is why they must constantly be monitored, controlled by fear mongering by government, the voting process rigged against them. And it starts very young in public schools before they are able to develop the tools to think for themselves.

This is the danger of the Bible...thinking for ones self...value judgments and thoughts which go against the socialist template. Independent thinking not controlled and regulated by this socialist system.

This is why in certain nations ...the Bible is not wanted and greatly feared if it circulates commonly among the people.

Such people who can think for themselves are considered a threat this system ...competitors ..not citizens.

You really have some gall posting such a ignorant statement and thinking people do not see through it. Only social thinking can dumb people down so far they don't catch it themselves and think no one else will catch it as well.

That people are not trustworthy..and only science is trustworthy. You have to go to public schools to buy into such nonsense and try to pass it off as scientific..when thinking people know it is pure politics..the religion of politics..social engineering.

If people are not trustworthy...why would a government ever trust them with private property?? With gun ownership...with their own money...with a vote.

The answer is that government does not trust people with any of these. By logic by reason and also by history.

You need some serious practice Krazysh0t.

Thanks,
Orangetom

a reply to: Krazysh0t

well then...

show us some hardcore philosophical content music that isn't Metal

dude... I like Ice Cube and Eazy E, don't even go there cause they don't make them like that no more... all that died with Tupac.

originally posted by: orangetom1999
Hmmmm...you brought this point out about the Bible not being a scientific treatise and it is about Faith...not science...yet you have only science??

No you did not ..hence I offered it up to the readers here.
You come across like a politician or like the news media..not much difference today ..slanting the view by not including all the pertinent information's for the readers or viewers.

I did include all the pertinent information... I gave you a valid reason why that argument is copout, the definition of faith, and an explanation why analyzing the bible with science is a valid thing to do. You have provided ZERO pertinent information here. Instead you go on and on about leaving out information without actually qualifying what that information is. This makes your post just empty rhetoric. YOU sound like a politician, not me.

You have a very serious problem here...and one for which you and others of your persuasion do not want discussed.
Many scientists and technology types are Christians. Are you warring against freedom and individual liberty..including freedom of religion. Are you dividing and not uniting???

Debating the legitimacy of a belief is NOT infringing on someone's rights to practice religion freely. That is a fallacy promoted by Christians with a persecution complex. I AM, however, exercising my freedom of speech to question the religions.

Here again your religion falls short....right next to your holy faith of science.

I don't have a religion...

This means that unless one can demonstrate that a sample being researched for dating can be shown not to have leeched into or out of...dating by that method is not accurate.

Free..no cover charge.

What's your point? Why did you tell me this? You provide a bunch of reasoning here, but no conclusion. Do I have to pay to get the conclusion or something?

Now this last quote is pure politics. It is also textbook of todays intelligence, illumination, enlightenment and bias. Politicians are not trustworthy and not good keepers of the public felicity...faith.

More like philosophy, but nice try. Not everything is politics there buddy.

If people are not trustworthy..why would one ever trust them with arms...why would anyone ever trust them with a vote...trust them with their own opinions, beliefs, and thoughts????

Good question. Why indeed? The only people I trust are the ones that have earned their trust.

I can tell you this answer...It is that people in this system which has been Hijacked by a socialist authoritarian system in its core...does not in fact trust its people. This is why they must constantly be monitored, controlled by fear mongering by government, the voting process rigged against them. And it starts very young in public schools before they are able to develop the tools to think for themselves.

Seriously get off the Socialism kick. I get it, you think Socialism is the bane of existence. Go start a thread about it and you can whine all day about it, but this isn't a thread about political ideologies so STOP BRINGING IT UP!

This is the danger of the Bible...thinking for ones self...value judgments and thoughts which go against the socialist template. Independent thinking not controlled and regulated by this socialist system.

What are you talking about? The Bible doesn't promote independent thinking. It demands that you adhere to what it is saying with no questions asked. In fact, it gets offended when you DO ask questions (see: Christian persecution complex). Christianity is the antithesis of independent thought.

This is why in certain nations ...the Bible is not wanted and greatly feared if it circulates commonly among the people.

You do know that Christianity is traditionally the group of people that hold book burnings right?

That people are not trustworthy..and only science is trustworthy. You have to go to public schools to buy into such nonsense and try to pass it off as scientific..when thinking people know it is pure politics..the religion of politics..social engineering.

They aren't trustworthy. Science backs that up. People remember things wrong and their brain lies to them. Many times they can't help it, but because of this occurrence we cannot trust anything that is subjective evidence (anything said to have happened by a human).

If people are not trustworthy...why would a government ever trust them with private property?? With gun ownership...with their own money...with a vote.

False equivocation. This isn't what I'm talking about.

The answer is that government does not trust people with any of these. By logic by reason and also by history.

You need some serious practice Krazysh0t.

Practice with what? Rambling posts with little substance and no backing links to corroborate your outlandish claims? Because I'd rather pass at that.

a reply to: AinElohim

No. This isn't a thread to discuss philosophical music. It is a thread to discuss Christianity and Science.

ETA: Here is Robert Hunter explaining the meaning behind Franklin's Tower. Franklin's Tower Explained

a reply to: Krazysh0t

I don't have a religion...

This only looks well to people who are anti religious...in particular..anti Christian. NO problem


but to those who are versed in religious morality it stands out..for you have been doing nothing but promoting a religion...the religion of men...logic and reason.

Those well versed in certain aspects of religion/religions are also versed in the patterns of Occult religions ..in addition to Christianity.

And occult religions are heavy on logic, reason, illumination, enlightenment..in order to push belief systems which are a moral. Socialism SJW are just such occult amoral systems. Wealth Redistribution...without work or without risk taking.

This is a devout religious belief system. Someone is attempting to bring it out into the open and to replace much of our present form of government.



You wrote.....

People aren't trustworthy and people wrote the bible.

and I wrote back..in it's entirety..

If people are not trustworthy..why would one ever trust them with arms...why would anyone ever trust them with a vote...trust them with their own opinions, beliefs, and thoughts????

I can tell you this answer...It is that people in this system which has been Hijacked by a socialist authoritarian system in its core...does not in fact trust its people. This is why they must constantly be monitored, controlled by fear mongering by government, the voting process rigged against them. And it starts very young in public schools before they are able to develop the tools to think for themselves.

This is the danger of the Bible...thinking for ones self...value judgments and thoughts which go against the socialist template. Independent thinking not controlled and regulated by this socialist system.

This is why in certain nations ...the Bible is not wanted and greatly feared if it circulates commonly among the people.

Such people who can think for themselves are considered a threat this system ...competitors ..not citizens.

You really have some gall posting such a ignorant statement and thinking people do not see through it. Only social thinking can dumb people down so far they don't catch it themselves and think no one else will catch it as well.

That people are not trustworthy..and only science is trustworthy. You have to go to public schools to buy into such nonsense and try to pass it off as scientific..when thinking people know it is pure politics..the religion of politics..social engineering.

If people are not trustworthy...why would a government ever trust them with private property?? With gun ownership...with their own money...with a vote.

The answer is that government does not trust people with any of these. By logic by reason and also by history.

You need some serious practice Krazysh0t.

Seriously get off the Socialism kick. I get it, you think Socialism is the bane of existence. Go start a thread about it and you can whine all day about it, but this isn't a thread about political ideologies so STOP BRINGING IT UP!

I don't think I will get off the Socialism Kick. This because it is a religion in competition to the form of government originally set up by the founders here. Socialism is a devout religious beliefs among many willing to enslave some for the benefit of others. Wealth Redistribution without work and without Risk Taking entailed by work...and this all for votes.

Socialism is a faith...a religion....just as is SJW and Wealth Redistribution...without RISK Redistribution. It is slavery...Royalty...class separation...and division...until it reaches it's final goal...equality at the poverty level...where equality is found when everyone is at the poverty level...except the rulers that is...then it is merely feudalism...and again we are back to royalty..the very system the founders here tried to prevent.

They aren't trustworthy. Science backs that up. People remember things wrong and their brain lies to them. Many times they can't help it, but because of this occurrence we cannot trust anything that is subjective evidence (anything said to have happened by a human).

LOL..LOL...LOL...I keep telling you that science is your religion ..used and misused to justify SJW and Social Engineering...Socialism.

As I said...you cannot trust a human with anything...even their private property..they must needs be constantly monitored..spied upon. And this is in fact what is happening to people in this country today...by a very very insecure government which has stolen our form of government from us with a phony fiat money system.

You are a piece of work Krazysh0t.

I posted..

If people are not trustworthy...why would a government ever trust them with private property?? With gun ownership...with their own money...with a vote.

And to which you replied...

The answer is that government does not trust people with any of these. By logic by reason and also by history.

I keep telling you how ridiculously ignorant you are about so many things and here you are confirming my very point.
for all of those things I posted are Private Property...not public property..but private.

And here you are by logic and reason...trying to illustrate that these are controlled by government trust or mistrust.and by this not private property. This is Socialism..is Marxism..is Communism...It is by your own admission..SJW..Wealth Redistribution by slight of hand..by promoting another religion.

For I can tell you this Krazysh0t ..there are examples in the Bible of private ownership of property..if one knows how to read.

Under Wealth Redistribution everything belongs to Caesar. No rocket material needed.

You definitely have a religion here. And so too by association with Science under this reasoning.

Orangetom

a reply to: orangetom1999

Whelp. I'm tired of being offtopic and talking about Socialism with you. You can't get it through your head that Socialism is a political ideology not a religion and you keep going on and on about it. So I bid you adieu. I will respond to you no further. We are getting nowhere and I'm tired of being laughed at by you and your faux intellectual superiority.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

If you cannot trust people with even their private property....then evolution is not happening.

Common sense.


The state is god. G.F. W Hegel.

Thanks,
Orangetom

originally posted by: orangetom1999
a reply to: Krazysh0t

If you cannot trust people with even their private property....then evolution is not happening.

Common sense.


The state is god. G.F. W Hegel.

Thanks,
Orangetom

Evolution has zero to do with private property. That had to be the dumbest statement I've ever read about evolution on these forums.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: orangetom1999
a reply to: Krazysh0t

If you cannot trust people with even their private property....then evolution is not happening.

Common sense.


The state is god. G.F. W Hegel.

Thanks,
Orangetom

Evolution has zero to do with private property. That had to be the dumbest statement I've ever read about evolution on these forums.

LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL.....!!!!!!! Textbook predictable....just textbook.


LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL!!!!!


The operative word here is "trust"...not evolution. Are you that easily emoted and distracted???

Here...you posted...


They aren't trustworthy. Science backs that up. People remember things wrong and their brain lies to them. Many times they can't help it, but because of this occurrence we cannot trust anything that is subjective evidence (anything said to have happened by a human).

And to which I replied.....

a reply to: Krazysh0t

If you cannot trust people with even their private property....then evolution is not happening.

Common sense.


The state is god. G.F. W Hegel.

Thanks,
Orangetom



I just watched this video the other day and thought of you when I watched this woman speak...about 11 minurtes 45 seconds into the video.

She stated she was more about winning the argument than being correct...that so reminded me of you.

louderwithcrowder.com...

Now..I've never heard of this Crowder fellow..but the woman I have. Nonetheless...her description fits you quite well.

The State is god.


Thanks,
Orangetom

LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL!!!

Thanks Obama!

Amaright?....

Tom you try too hard with this type of rhetoric (if you can call it that...).

White privilege is real, evolution is real, Obama is real!

And everything is a religion!

LOL LOL LOL LOL!!!!!!

originally posted by: Prezbo369
LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL!!!

Thanks Obama!

Amaright?....

Tom you try too hard with this type of rhetoric (if you can call it that...).

White privilege is real, evolution is real, Obama is real!

And everything is a religion!

LOL LOL LOL LOL!!!!!!

Krazysh0t,

Hmmmmm..It appears that I owe you and apology. I thought you were the one heavily on this religious drug of yours. It appears by the above poster that I was a bit off the mark. My apologies for this mix up.

Thanks,
Orangetom

originally posted by: [post=19159799]Prezbo369



White privilege is real, evolution is real, Obama is real!

Ok Krazyshot and others,

I've not been to this thread in awhile but though since I had it in my favorites section I would today...check it out.

I have for some years now been examining the nature of Politics and also certain sectors of Science and how it is used or misused by many governments to solidify their tyrannical control over their people. Even to supplant the peoples religion with another religion..the religion of government..and by proxy ..science...the new religion.
The religion of Herd mentality. The religion of "Emoting " and not thinking...but going along with the herd.

I knew that leadership in this country was going down the drain and trespassing on the beliefs and religion of the people when I saw that the Obama religion declared that they can make people do what is against their religion.

This some years back....and it verifies to me what was declared so many years back by GFW Hegel with his "The State is god.


What I did not know was that government ...the government of science...of logic and reason...illumination, enlightenment would openly show itself to be luciferian in its inside nature..not once..but three times.

That the government religion was luciferian in it's intrinsic nature...luciferianism is the true religion of the United States Government.

I am searching for more examples of the government involved and declaring to the people who know and can see ...their luciferian religion.



The first example is what was posted by someone else and I quoted it in here...about the trend in public schools and the military to teach and preach their devout religious and zealous dogma of "White Privilege and White Guilt.

Though it has been many years ...back when I first joined ATS that someone tried to pull one over on me with White Guilt and White Privilege. I knew instinctively back then that it was a phony and disguised racism...I just did not know it was also an example of a luciferian religion at work. It was only in the last couple of months that it came to me that it told of the luciferian nature of this government....its real intrinsic nature.


White Privilege begans with an assumption ..that if one is white ..one is born into privilege and is also therefore a racist....and also guilty by this.

The American principle is innocent until proven guilty. Guilty and you have to prove your innocence is a European principle ..not American.

The luciferian operation and side of "White Privilege and White Guilt...works like this once you recognize it for the counterfeit and phony scam that it is.


For many years and all across this land....the teaching and preaching even in the news media and across politics and in public schools was from Dr. Martin Luther King's...I have a dream speech wherein he stated... people should be judged...

By the content of their character...not by the colour of their skin.


What the religion of Politics has done is reverse this teaching and substitute "White Guilt and White Privilege."
What they are doing is....judging people ..by the content of their skin..not by the content of their character."

A 180 degree reversal..which is one of the signs of a luciferian religion at work.

The other sign of luciferianism is that they work to subvert and sacrifice the most vulnerable among us into their counterfeit belief system.

What is more ..and what is also worse ..the government in it's luciferian wisdom is teaching this counterfeit, phony, subversive position of confusion to our children..in public schools through colleges and even in the military among young recruits before they have had sufficient years and development enough to produce good character traits..to be able to think for themselves.

This is devilishness of the first magnitude...and it is open undisguised racism by leadership in this country.

It is also totally contrary to the Bible position of "By their Fruits shall ye know them" as well as Dr. King's position of.."By the content of their character...not the colour of their skin.


One has to be educated in public schools to take a bite out of this apple..because thinking people will reason this out on their own for the phony and counterfeit that it is. This must be done in a cloistered/ protected environment because it will not sell to people who have developed good character traits sufficient to think for themselves.
One can only get away with this if they have sufficiently dumbed people down that they no longer think for themselves.

White Privilege and White Guilt is a phony and a counterfeit....of not only the Bible position but also Dr, King's position once taught all across this land.


When and why did the US Government switch gods and not tell anyone they had so done??


Thanks,
Orangetom

Second Luciferian principle in government...

In our coinage ...it used to be when we had copper pennies..also silver and gold coinage that the money was the metal in the coins.

This means that two half dollars in silver weighed, what a dollar of silver by weight...weighed. Four silver quarters the same as a dollar of silver...ten dimes and also twenty half dimes weighed what a dollar of silver weighed.

For you see...though it became known as a Silver dollar..it was a dollar of silver by weight ...a half dollar of silver by weight..a quarter dollar of silver by weight.

This meant that when you line these coins up and examined them..there was a sensibility ..a radionale to them. They made sense as a system of weights and measures...or as it says in the coinage acts..."To the dollar weight."

The gold coins were similar. Two ten dollar coins weighed what a 20 dollar coin weighed...four five dollar gold coins weighted what a 20 dollar coin weighed and on down to the one dollar gold coin...where twenty of them weighed what a 20 dollar gold coin weighed...
Again you had a rational system of weights and measures.

Not a measure great or a measure small..but perfect weights and measures.

It was the same with the pennys...to the penny weight..in copper.


What you have in circulation today..is a Susan B. Anthony dollar coin which is about 2/3rds the size and weight of a 50 cent coin and made out of the same metal. Yet it claims to be worth twice as much.

This is a clear indicator that the copper nickel is not the money.

This is a system of "Unjust weights and measures" in our coinage. It is a clear example of a counterfeit system in operation...with the US Governmnent as the chief counterfeiter.

The coins say on them...."In God We Trust."

When and why did the US Government switch gods to the counterfeiter...Lucifer..and not tell anyone they have done this thing???

Right out there in front of us they do this thing..and do it to all of us.

You have to be educated to do something this dumb and get away with it only by dumbing people down even further than leadership.


Thanks,
Orangetom

Third luciferian principle at work in government.


By their sex, sexuality, sexual orientation shall ye know them. Not by the content of their character.


Once again we return back to Dr. King and his "I have a dream " speech.


People have always and historically defined themselves by....


Their lineage..their family name if you like...
Their occupation.....
Or some great work they have done and left to posterity...

They do not define themselves by their sex or sexuality or sexual orientation.

That fingerprint by government is just plain dumb...stupid.


For....a thinking knowledgeable educated people are more ...much much more than this. Much much more than sex, sexuality, and sexual orientation.

But politicians and leadership look at this and see the votes they can get by forcing it off on people ..against their will and against their beliefs.

Politics will sell a whole nation down the drain and hold them hostage to these groups and their bullying ..and become bullies themselves to get more power and control


Government does not belong in our bedrooms or in our Belief systems.

Whenever Government bullies people into accepting a sexual position against their beliefs and or to be silent in their approval or disapproval...what is it called???

What is it called when someone forces their sexual beliefs on an unwilling people??? To hold them hostage to something in which they do not believe or approve.

The last time I checked it was called..."Rape."

Is government teaching this to a people against their will and over their objections....and or forcing/bullying them into silence ...just as they are so doing with "White Privilege and White Guilt??"

This is a thing or dogma ..an ideology which is beging again ..forced upon and taught in cloistered environments wherein it can be protected from public scrutiny for it would not survive in the arena of free thought and ideas.

It is confusion ....and a counterfeit of the idea/knowledge that people/human beings are much much more than sex and sexuality.

This is what makes it in the arena and religion of luciferianism. Not by the content of their character..but by their sex, sexuality, and sexual orientation.


It has now become so much in the arena of Confusion that it has become a struggle and chaos down to what bathroom one is to be using.

And in this fingerprint ...it is also not leadership..but confusion.

One has to be educated today to spread such confusion amongst a people and call this "leadership."

To hold a whole nation "Hostage" to such confusion and think this is leadership. It is not ..it is confusion..which is one of the marks or indexes of a luciferian religion.


Thanks,
Orangetom