The lie of Muslims not evolving out of the Dark Ages

I'm getting tired of people accusing fundamentalist Muslims of not having evolved out of the Dark Ages. It isn't true. First off, the Dark Ages are a derogatory name coined during the Renaissance because those egotistical people thought they were smarter and better than the people living before them. This isn't true and historians like to refer to it as the Middle Ages. The Dark Ages myth allows people to perpetuate the lie about Muslim fundamentlism since it allows people to believe that no art, knowledge and morality thrived during those times. Except no, they did. In the MUSLIM regions of the world knowledge, art, literature, music, and even morality flourished for hundreds of years.

This time period is also referred to as the Islamic Golden Age for the Muslim world. This time period also marked the time of the Crusades from a largely fundamentalist Catholic Europe. Why are we projecting the sins of our Catholic forefathers onto the Muslims who were the pillars of morality during these times? True these days, Muslim fundamentalism is bad and going out of control, but to liken them to their Middle Ages is days is incorrect, they aren't acting like Muslims were then. They are acting like Catholics did.

In truth, Muslim fundamentalism is a recent thing. Only popping up within the last century. You know what other type of religious fundamentalism is new? Modern Christian fundamentalism. These literalist religion interpretations are actually NEW religious ideals, not old ones. Granted the Europe of old was fundamentalist, but not to the degree that the Christian fundamentalists are in the Bible Belt. Flat Earth belief wasn't really as wide spread as taught (Columbus wasn't diving controversy that he'd sail off the edge of the world for instance). I imagine that old earth theory was also believed to be true in the Middle Ages.

Therefore I reason that fundamentalism is a NEW religious scourge on humanity. True it builds on prior religious justification for bloodshed and violence, but its beliefs allow for it to do FAR more damage than just physical damage. Damage of the minds of our youth.

It was corrupted long time ago; The Spirit (under the name "Jabreel") appeared to Muhammad in 610 A.D. and taught him the "Qur'an" (Arabic: "Recital"). The purpose was to educate the ignorant Arabs in the Law of God, but, again, after Muhammad died the Muslims rejected any further communication with the Spirit, and Islam, as Christianity had done, became fragmented, and uninspired men re-interpreted the Qur'an according to their own ignorance and superstitions.

Yet, there have been some very holy Muslim men over the centuries that have been in communication with the Spirit of the Truth; such as The Brethren of Purity and the Sufis . Only a small percentage of Muslims have been guided by the Spirit of Truth over the centuries.

Most Muslims today are guided by the Spirit of Error, otherwise known as the "Over-soul". Our egos are all part of the Oversoul. Most Christians are similar guided by the Oversoul (i.e. uninspired men who are religious leaders).

a reply to: Shadow Herder

I didn't make this thread to discuss Muslim beliefs here. I made it to point out that the Muslim world didn't used to be so backwards and was even the pillar of morality when the Christian world was going through its darkest days of immorality.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

I think you are right on point.

Looking at the bigger picture, it's generally a complete waste of time to listen to operatives of religion "A", critique behavior by operatives of religion "B".

a reply to: Krazysh0t

In truth, Muslim fundamentalism is a recent thing.

In truth, you do not know what you are talking about.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

www.be-ready.org...

Since shortly after its beginning in 622 AD, Islam has effectively been at war with every other religion. Any Muslim who says, as some do, that "Islam has respect for other religions", is ignorant of the true history of it, or he is lying.

What Muslims in general say and what they sometimes do in practice; and what the Koran really says, are often two different things. Islamic doctrine not only justifies the use of force to stop evil, it mandates the use of force. The Koran clearly says that any religion that does not acknowledge Allah as the one true god, and Mohammed as his unique prophet, is evil. By the Koran, Islam is the only true religion, and it teaches Muslims not to tolerate other religions. So, when Islam has the upper hand, you usually convert or you die.

There is no real religious tolerance in Islam. It must be noted, though, that historically, Muslims have tolerated Christian and Jewish communities for the sake of material gain, in the form of tribute, and in some cases they have enslaved Christians and Jews. In Muslim-dominated countries they still do. Christians are second-class citizens at best.

originally posted by: greencmp
a reply to: Krazysh0t

In truth, Muslim fundamentalism is a recent thing.

In truth, you do not know what you are talking about.

Were you planning on backing that statement up or anything? Or are you just going for a rude driveby posting?

a reply to: infolurker

I'm not trying to paint the Muslims as benevolent here. I'm just trying to show that Muslims have held the torch of morality and wisdom in their history just like the Christian world. Do you deny this?

a reply to: Krazysh0t

I have presented as much evidence supporting my claim as you have.

originally posted by: greencmp
a reply to: Krazysh0t

I have presented as much evidence supporting my claim as you have.

Really? I don't recall seeing two links in your post, because I certainly posted two links to my claims. In fact one of those links appears in the sentence directly following the one you quote mined. But then again I also posted this topic in the rant section so there is that as well.

I think it may have been a better idea for god to have kept his mouth shut altogether and never said a word to any humans about anything. Life would be much simpler.

a reply to: Krazysh0t


Yeah, our founders kind of mentioned this as well:

www.apologeticspress.org...

The Founders were forthright in their assessment of the nature and teachings of Islam and the Quran. Americans and their political leaders would do well to take a sober look at history. To fail to do so will be catastrophic.

John Quincy Adams on Islam:

After his presidency, but before his election to Congress in 1830, John Quincy penned several essays dealing with one of the many Russo-Turkish Wars. In these essays, we see a cogent, informed portrait of the threat that Islam has posed throughout world history:

In the seventh century of the Christian era, a wandering Arab of the lineage of Hagar, the Egyptian, combining the powers of transcendent genius, with the preternatural energy of a fanatic, and the fraudulent spirit of an impostor, proclaimed himself as a messenger from Heaven, and spread desolation and delusion over an extensive portion of the earth. Adopting from the sublime conception of the Mosaic law, the doctrine of one omnipotent God; he connected indissolubly with it, the audacious falsehood, that he was himself his prophet and apostle. Adopting from the new Revelation of Jesus, the faith and hope of immortal life, and of future retribution, he humbled it to the dust, by adapting all the rewards and sanctions of his religion to the gratification of the sexual passion. He poisoned the sources of human felicity at the fountain, by degrading the condition of the female sex, and the allowance of polygamy; and he declared undistinguishing and exterminating war, as a part of his religion, against all the rest of mankind. THE ESSENCE OF HIS DOCTRINE WAS VIOLENCE AND LUST: TO EXALT THE BRUTAL OVER THE SPIRITUAL PART OF HUMAN NATURE.

Between these two religions, thus contrasted in their characters, a war of twelve hundred years has already raged. That war is yet flagrant; nor can it cease but by the extinction of that imposture, which has been permitted by Providence to prolong the degeneracy of man. While the merciless and dissolute dogmas of the false prophet shall furnish motives to human action, there can never be peace upon earth, and good will towards men. The hand of Ishmael will be against every man, and every man’s hand against him. It is, indeed, amongst the mysterious dealings of God, that this delusion should have been suffered for so many ages, and during so many generations of human kind, to prevail over the doctrines of the meek and peaceful and benevolent Jesus (Blunt, 1830, 29:269, capitals in orig.).



The precept of the koran is, perpetual war against all who deny, that Mahomet is the prophet of God. The vanquished may purchase their lives, by the payment of tribute; the victorious may be appeased by a false and delusive promise of peace; and the faithful follower of the prophet, may submit to the imperious necessities of defeat: but the command to propagate the Moslem creed by the sword is always obligatory, when it can be made effective. The commands of the prophet may be performed alike, by fraud, or by force (Blunt, 29:274).

a reply to: Shadow Herder

There's a hadith that predicted 72 out of 73 sects/people would be misguided. Take a look at today. You've got wahhabis, Shiites, Ahmadis and so on, who are misguided through their method of interpretations. That's a lot of misguided people.

Although every religion has its flaws, it is important for whoever the head of that religion and its subjugation to openly denounce thge voilent acts being committed. Which I have not seen enough of.

It is not the religion hasn't evolved. It is the region that religion is in that has not evovled.

The majority of the middle east doesn't even have an education beyond the 10th grade. The ones who incite the violence are well educated and are able to use religion as a reason to murder to push their personal beliefs.

It is like a neo-nazi desguised as a pope and chanting death to islamists as it is written in the bible. Now it may be true that a religious book may have comments condoning violence. It truely is left up to interpretation of the individual. Unfortunately for the Koran-they read it and apply it literally.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Two wikipedia links and a polemic do not constitute 'evidence'.

a reply to: infolurker

How is that any different than the perpetual wars that Christians engage in? You DO know that America hasn't been at peace for any length of time right? We've pretty much been fighting wars non stop since we've become a country and Europe is no better. Christians have just as much blood shed on their religion. To put the racist writings of our forefathers on display does not mean that my points are incorrect. The Muslim world truly DID advance knowledge during those times.

a reply to: Krazysh0t


What perpetual wars are you referring to? Dont say the Israel/Palestine wars. That doesn't count.

originally posted by: greencmp
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Two wikipedia links and a polemic do not constitute 'evidence'.

More evidence than YOU provided.

So do you disagree? Muslims WERE living in the Dark Ages while Europe was also living in Dark Ages? Or are you just here to troll me because I'm not painting Muslims in a nasty light?

originally posted by: 4N0M4LY
a reply to: Krazysh0t


What perpetual wars are you referring to? Dont say the Israel/Palestine wars. That doesn't count.

“We’re at War!” — And We Have Been Since 1776: 214 Years of American War-Making

a reply to: Krazysh0t

And that has to do with what exactly. I mean are you really going to compare religious violence with no purpose vs The wars the US fought for a reason