Students Surprised to Find Noah's Ark Feasible

a reply to: Shadow Herder

Not really. For one, there is only so many places that water comes from in the world. Naturally some stories around the world are going to repeat at times. For two, the bible account places the water level above the highest mountains. Everest is the highest mountain and its elevation is so high that water freezes. A world wide flood covering Everest would be an ice adventure (not to mention people would have trouble breathing).

originally posted by: r0xor
a reply to: r0xor
If what I just wrote is even halfway close to the real truth, it has implications for the Old Testament, because it means the flood didn't occur out of God's wrath, or if it did, it was at least a "controlled demolition" if you will over time and not in all areas at once.

If that is true, it also calls into question whether there were truly giant men and other abominations of creation caused by "fallen angels" interbreeding with human beings. As retarded as that really sounds, it's the main line of reasoning as to why the flood even happened. The other being that men's hearts were evil continually, so I guess everyone was acting like ISIS does, lol.

A world full of pre-historic ISIS and giants. Scary thought though!

Yeah. If flood myths are based in reality, they are either through exaggeration of catastrophic LOCAL floods, or far-ancient tales from the end of the Ice Age. In either case, they are explainable by KNOWN phenomena, and do not need supernatural tales attached to them.

Here's a few possible sources for very large, very real, and possibly-inhabited areas that were inundated by the meltwaters of the end of the Ice Age:

Black Sea Flood (hypothetical)

The Doggerland Land Bridge

a reply to: Krazysh0t

The great god Tupi warned a medicine man named Tamanduare of a coming great flood that would cover the earth, and he told Tamanduare to seek refuge on a lofty peak with a palm tree at its top. Tamanduare and his family went there immediately, and when they arrived, it began to rain. It continued to rain until the whole earth was flooded. The water covered even the summit of the mountain, and Tamanduare and his family climbed into the palm tree and live there, eating its fruit, until the water subsided. Then they descended and repopulated the devastated world. [Frazer, pp. 255-256]

This next story is quite a detailed explanation to the flood

Yamana (Tierra del Fuego):
Léxuwakipa, the rusty brown spectacled ibis, felt offended by the people, so she let it snow so much that ice came to cover the entire earth. This happened at the time of Yáiaasága, when men seized power from the women. When the ice melted, it rapidly flooded all the earth. People hurried to their canoes, but many didn't make it, and more perished when they couldn't find sheltered places. Some people reached the five mountaintops which stayed above the flood. These mountains were Usláka, Wémarwaia, Auwáratuléra, Welalánux, and Piatuléra. The water stayed at its high mark for two days and then rapidly lowered. Signs of the floodwaters still show up on those mountains. The few families which survived rebuilt their huts on the shore. Men have ruled women since then. [Wilbert, pp. 27-28]

The moon-woman Hánuxa caused the flood because she was full of hatred against the people, especially the men, who had taken over the women's secret kina ceremony and made it their own. A few people survived on five mountaintops. [Wilbert, p. 29]

The sun sank into the sea, causing its waters to rise tumultuously and to cover all the earth except the summit of a single mountain. A few people survived there.
www.talkorigins.org...


in the middle east, no mountain there, Assyrian:
The gods, led by Enlil, agreed to cleanse the earth of an overpopulated humanity, but Utnapishtim was warned by the god Ea in a dream. He and some craftsmen built a large boat (one acre in area, seven decks) in a week. He then loaded it with his family, the craftsmen, and "the seed of all living creatures." The waters of the abyss rose up, and it stormed for six days. Even the gods were frightened by the flood's fury. Upon seeing all the people killed, the gods repented and wept. The waters covered everything but the top of the mountain Nisur, where the boat landed. Seven days later, Utnapishtim released a dove, but it returned finding nowhere else to land. He next returned a sparrow, which also returned, and then a raven, which did not return. Thus he knew the waters had receded enough for the people to emerge. Utnapishtim made a sacrifice to the gods. He and his wife were given immortality and lived at the end of the earth. [Sandars, chpt. 5]



Notice the last one is the Noah story but it is not Noah

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Why are you still focused on the stories of old? Stories mean jack when the objective evidence says they are wrong.

A story of old is what the thread is about. I think we are supposed
to stay focused. And further more you postulate that the absence
of evidence is evidence of absence. A true fallacy. Especially when
we're referencing an event that happened a whole world ago.
It stands to reason there would be no evidence that you would look
for. To add even further, you can't convince anyone of any such
impossibility who believes God exists. Because as the story goes,
God got involved. Hello! your impossible story is negated by the story
itself, if you can stay focused?

originally posted by: randyvs
And further more you postulate that the absence of evidence is evidence of absence.
A true fallacy.

The lack of evidence is the least of the story's troubles. The physical impossibility of the events depicted is the knockout punch.

God exists. Because as the story goes, God got involved. Hello! your impossible story
is negated by the story itself, if you can stay focused?

The "because I said so" defence is not a fan favorite for winning people round.

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: Krazysh0t
And further more you postulate that the absence of evidence is evidence of absence.
A true fallacy. Especially when we're referencing an event that happened a whole
world ago. It stands to reason there would be no evidence that you would look for.

Well isn't that mighty convenient? Now the Noah flood wasn't just a global flood, it remade the entire Earth so that no evidence of it remains. Let's try and cram that into the whole "dinosaurs existed before Noah's flood but God didn't want Noah to save them for some reason" timeline, shall we?

a reply to: IndependentOpinion

Noah's ark could drop smack on top of some people's house, and they still would deny it's possible.

a reply to: randyvs

Actually the absence of evidence IS evidence of absence in this case because floods leave very CLEAR markers in the geologic record to the point that if one doesn't exist, it didn't happen.

Claiming that God made the flood happen then wiped away all the evidence is the most ridiculous cop out I've ever heard.

a reply to: Shadow Herder

I already agreed with you that flood stories were stolen from other civilizations' flood stories, but I refuse to believe that a South American flood story and a Southwestern Asian flood story are talking about the same flood. That is ridiculous.

a reply to: AshOnMyTomatoes

Well isn't that mighty convenient?

When is the truth not convenient?

a reply to: Krazysh0t

You forget god coulda sloshed the world and it's water, around... and shoved down Everest with his thumb before popping it back up to height... being god and all.

Now as far as how many angels can dance on a pin... THAT is a far more interesting experiment... anyone know any angels?

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Claiming that God made the flood happen then wiped away all the evidence is the most ridiculous cop out I've ever heard.

Really? You only make yourself look ridiculous with this kind
of reading comprehension. And to think I've relocated you with
intelligence in the past. I redact.

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: AshOnMyTomatoes

Well isn't that mighty convenient?

When is the truth not convenient?

Apparently when you make up rationalizations to explain a lack of evidence for your claims.

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Claiming that God made the flood happen then wiped away all the evidence is the most ridiculous cop out I've ever heard.

Really? You only make yourself look ridiculous with this kind
of reading comprehension. and to think I've relocaed you with
intelligence in the past. I redact.

Do I? Because it TOTALLY makes sense when a god is making an example out of the wrong doings of the populace of earth to destroy all evidence of this example after it has been completed.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Shadow Herder

Not really. For one, there is only so many places that water comes from in the world. Naturally some stories around the world are going to repeat at times. For two, the bible account places the water level above the highest mountains. Everest is the highest mountain and its elevation is so high that water freezes. A world wide flood covering Everest would be an ice adventure (not to mention people would have trouble breathing).

Assuming you are assuming the bible writers had knowledge of the worlds highest mountains which they couldnt have. The bible is a middle eastern, north African account. About breathing up a mountain if a theoretical flood would rise up to , you would technically be at close to sea level.

originally posted by: IndependentOpinion
It's sad to see how many ATS users does not take the time to investigate both sides of the argument.

Which side? That a loving God became so angry with everyone on the planet that he decided to murder them? This aspect of the reason for the ark is important to consider.

Another side to consider -- from someone who is very familiar with the Biblical story and has researched many aspects -- is construction. How was Noah suddenly able to construct a massively large wooden barge with such a small crew? Additionally, how did he construct a wooden barge that could withstand the stormy high-seas for 40 days without breaking apart? The stresses on big boats (especially flat-bottom) from waves are enormous, serious engineering goes in to modern steel ship construction because of this.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Do I?

Yep, because that isn't what I said Einstien.

a reply to: Shadow Herder

Well now you are making concessions for the story. If we are to assume that the writers didn't know what the tallest mountain was, then how can we assume that their tale of the flood covering the earth was true?

a reply to: randyvs

Then where is the evidence? What did god do with it, and why is it hidden?

a reply to: Krazysh0t

You ask for evidence from a world we know is
eroding everyday? I'm sorry Shot but, how in
the hell can you do that? I mean honestly?
How do you know we haven't destroyed perfect
evidence building cities on top of it? You don't!
The earth changes everday. So much for geo
evidence.