What You Should Know About Net Neutrality

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
I think when you use up the bandwidth for 1/3 of the internet and they asked you to pay to compensate that because its THEIR pipes youre running through , that they have full right to ask you to do that..

You've got it wrong.

First, since the extortion of Netflix, it has come out that broadband providers have a profit margin of over 90% on consumer services.

Second, content providers like Netflix pay for premium access to the Internet backbone and the associated peering agreements. Those agreements trickle money to the offramp providers like Comcast.

Using ATS as an example (which I've done before, but anti-net neutrality people don't like to hear it).

1) We pay for the most-expensive and fastest pipe to the Internet backbone available… a premium to deliver our content

2) The backbone provider (Level3 and others) gets some of that money.

3) Through peering agreements, some of that money then goes to the access provider.

So Comcast was already getting compensated for Netflix traffic. They were trying to force a precedent that would enable broader tiered speeds.

So, sticking with ATS in that scenario, even through we pay a premium and you pay Comcast a premium for fast Internet, they would still slow-down your access to ATS.

It was a strategic power-play, not a profit or compensation play.

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

I think when you use up the bandwidth for 1/3 of the internet and they asked you to pay to compensate that because its THEIR pipes youre running through , that they have full right to ask you to do that......

I think you're looking at this wrong. Netfilx is just offering their content to people who want it. They aren't forcing it on everyone or pushing out network traffic that isn't requested. It's not their fault that people want their content so much that 1/3 of traffic is their content going to people who request it. Those very same 1/3 of people using netflix could just as easily be using YouTube and taking up the same amount of data flow. Would that then mean it's YouTubes fault that people request their data???

You see, ISP's provide customers with access to data at certain speeds for a price. If those people then use what they are paying for it shouldn't matter what it is that they are using it for be it all Netflix all day or Netflix half of the day and porn the other half. It doesn't matter and it certainly not the job of Netflix to pay for the ISP's delivery. If the ISP's need more Cable or whatever that is their job to provide it. They are the Provider for the connection to the content available. Doesn't matter what that content is, they agreed and take payment to provide it at such and such speed for such and such price, period.

a reply to: Sremmos80

I understand that. I do use Google for commercial sites.

a reply to: nwtrucker

So what was your point then if you already understood the results would be different?

a reply to: Sremmos80

I've already made my points.

What's your point?

a reply to: SkepticOverlord

You've got it wrong.

First, since the extortion of Netflix, it has come out that broadband providers have a profit margin of over 90% on consumer services.

i like your terminology, they werent extorted........they were asked to pay more to compensate for how much bandwidth they were using .........full stop......

You guys love throwing around buzzwords when you know it isnt true.......

They were using 1/3 of the bandwidth ON PIPES OWNED BY THE PROVIDER........

You can try and dice this up any way you want SKeptic.....

but the fact of the matter is, MEGA CORPS helped write this bill that they wouldnt let ANYONE see.......

And people like YOU and others sat around talking about how this was all about getting rid of monopolies and fairness and all these other catch phrases and key words.....

WHILE THEY WROTE THE DAMN THING , that they wouldnt let ANYONE see......

Full stop.......

YOu can stick to your guns all you want.........For god sakes I hope your right and this is great for the internet......

But I dont see it turning out that way.....unfortunately we wont get to say I told you so , if Im right

a reply to: mOjOm

it is the job of Netflix if they are using up that much bandwidth on SOMEONE ELSES infrastructure, to compensate them for that......

again Netflix is a billion dollar company

Not mom and pop down the road.......


THats how free market works.....Pipes are expensive, thats why not everyone builds them......want to fix that? De regulate it.....

Free market system......

We dont need the gov to tell us how the Internet will be run.......

But too late we got it

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
it is the job of Netflix if they are using up that much bandwidth on SOMEONE ELSES infrastructure, to compensate them for that......

I guess, the only explanation is that you either don't like to read, or don't want to believe actual facts.

"Peering Agreements" is not a buzzword, it's how the Internet works, and has been working. Those agreements define how providers have been compensated for extra bandwidth on their infrastructure.

originally posted by: nwtrucker
What you omit in your post is. The Dems could have easily held public hearings addressing all the issues from the little guys as well as the big...ALL IN THE OPEN.

Thus avoiding this criticism.

"thus avoiding this criticism"...WOW...No...As the adage goes...President Obama could literally walk on water tomorrow and FOX News would carry the Headline "Obama can't swim!"

a reply to: SkepticOverlord

I guess, the only explanation is that you either don't like to read, or don't want to believe actual facts.

I feel like this is on going problem on this site involving the majority of your post on this issue, time and time again you have presented the matter in a K.I.S.S style and it seems if falls on deaf ears, or blind eyes I guess.

a reply to: ManBehindTheMask

No, Netflix already pays to host their content. Customers pay to access that content. The ones in the middle are the ISP's who provide access from content providers to costomers and they are already being paid from both and it is their job to maintain the lines.

That is the free market at work right there. No special treatment. How much bandwidth Netflix uses is determined by people who are requesting it. They don't control what or how much people want. They just provide it and they've paid a price to have it delivered already. Just as the customer has already paid to get whatever data they choose to get. The ISP's are only there to provide the road between the content and the customer.

a reply to: SkepticOverlord

Do you not find it a little bit ironic that you say im not informed on it because im not reading.......

Yet this entire thing went through without ANYONE READING IT?!

a reply to: ManBehindTheMask

Think of it like this.

Let's say I pay my ISP to access the net so I can watch movies and that's all I'm doing. Now let's say I spend all my movie watching time on Netflix. Netflix pays the ISP to host and I pay them for access. Now let's say that I decide to watch Netflix 1/2 the time and watch Hulu the other half.

The same amount of data is flowing over the lines from them to me. The only difference is that I'm getting half the data from hulu and half from netflix. But the bandwidth still remains the same and has already been paid for and agreed upon. The ISP's are just the road the data travels on from the source that paid them to the customer which paid them.

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
a reply to: SkepticOverlord

Do you not find it a little bit ironic that you say im not informed on it because im not reading.......

Yet this entire thing went through without ANYONE READING IT?!

Why not just read what was posted in this thread.

Refusing to read the FCC Notice of Rule Making does not constitute "no one reading it."

a reply to: SkepticOverlord

LOL so youre stating this is the 300 plus page Net Neutrality thing they passed?

The public was not allowed to read it BEFORE IT PASSED

putting something like this after the fact is not the same thing

The hypocrisy is you trying to tell me i am not making an educated statement about net neutrality because YOU say im not reading.....

Yet NONE IN THE PUBLIC SECTOR, were allowed to read this WHOLE THING before they passed it......and thats a cold FACT JUST like ACA

Done with this thread

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: ManBehindTheMask

The left has its own problems and were pretty bad for the last so many years, but right now it is ALL right wing nonsense that I'm seeing. I make no excuses for the left's actions. I was right there with many on the right during Obamacare's implementation as well as trying to protect the 2nd Amendment after Sandy Hook, but dammit not everything the left does is bad! Just like not everything the right does is bad. I'm getting tired of seeing the blind hate for anything that Obama or the left does. It is getting ridiculous.

I have to say I totally agree with your comment. I'm as sick as you are of the demonization of everything Obama does; it is ridiculous, especially considering he honestly doesn't do very much of anything except make TV appearances and play golf.

What's got me madder than H...is that right wing media has gone so over the top of being anti-any-government initiative that they're not making any sense whatsoever and rather than reporting facts they do a knee jerk reactionary response based upon all their worst nightmares.

The problem with the left however, isn't much better. It seems everything the Left does hurts the working middle class; punishes them with higher taxes and fees and regulations. And all that for the supposed benefit of the "common good" which isn't ever defined and is virtually meaningless in a jurisdiction (the US) that has come to resemble a failed nation state. The result as far as the leftist media, isn't much different from the right wingnut media; the leftist media distorts facts and intentionally misrepresents facts to fit their "agenda". The result is that the news isn't "news", but is more a running commentary on what the leftists think the world should look like and how they think it should work. It's maddening!

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask


Done with this thread

Good, because you don't understand what you're talking about if you think Netflix is at fault for simply using the bandwidth they've paid for already.

ISP's agreed to deliver data from one place to another, period.

a reply to: Indigo5

So you don't think doing this in an open forum would have been an improvement?

The GOP keeps blocking the release of the new rules to the public.

Link

Furthermore, the ISP Oligopolies aren't the ones who wrote the rules, they are working through the GOP to reverse the ruling... thus the FOX and Rush disinformation brigade.

a reply to: Kali74

Typical GOP tactics. Suppress the truth while blaming all the secrecy on the other side. Meanwhile use that time to spin a false propaganda tale using the Right Wing Media Pundits to hopefully outrage the public using a false narrative.

They are actually getting predictable now at this point for being completely full of sh*t while claiming to smell of roses.