Loss of Christianity induced morality is destroying America

It took me around 15 seconds to find solid research that completely disputes
your premise:

Misinformation and facts about secularism and religion

Just thought you'd be interested to know.

Kev

a reply to: Tangerine

I've have studied a bit, about as far back as the 'golden age' as they say. Earlier than that, no.

Largely with the intent of arriving at an 'ecumenical' view of modern religions and their 'prophets'. I had a few friends who were more involved, cough, cough, and a mild interest resulted.

I was baptized Ukrainian Greek Orthodox. Was sent to 'Sunday school at a united church whilst my parents caught up on sleep...

Weddings and funerals since.....

Our founding fathers were not all Christians like you ignorant zealots insist they were.
Please study or close your pie hole.
I am surrounded by ignorant zealots here in Georgia and I am about to.....
Thank you.

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Ok, he makes an argument.

Let me ask you this. Does not the belief in an afterlife, in some form, not imply a potential for consequence of acts not found in secular beliefs?

Will that not sway some to reconsider acts and even change their mind as a result?

Add in the promise of reward for 'good behavior' and now one has the 'lead or silver' technique applied on a spiritual level.

That seems more effective than "I'm not here for a long time. I'm here for a good time".

Just saying....

originally posted by: MyHappyDogShiner
Our founding fathers were not all Christians like you ignorant zealots insist they were.
Please study or close your pie hole.
I am surrounded by ignorant zealots here in Georgia and I am about to.....
Thank you.

I seem to remember that the United States was formerly owned
and occupied by millions of Native Americans. But then some
folks of a certain religious persuasion killed something like
95% of them, and herded up the rest of them onto reservations
like animals.

I also seem to remember that a similar thing happened in central
and south america and also in Europe.

Frankly, I'd say the premise is exactly backwards. Unless mass
genocide and other war crimes, conducted on a global scale
for something like 1500 years are to be considered 'moral'.

Of course it's the victors who write most of the history books,
after the great waves of burning of books and libraries to hide
their crimes that happened during the dark ages.

A great example of this is scalping... most everyone thinks
that it was the 'savages' (the Native Americans) who were
famous for this.

Actually when the white killers went after the Native Americans,
at the first they were paid a bounty by the government for
bringing in the ears of their victims. But of course then they
were paid double.

So the white killers started using the Spanish practice of
'scalping' (removal of the scalp from their murder victims)
as they only had one scalp and could not cheat on the
bounty.

Now in all fairness, near the end, the Native Americans
did start scalping in return in some areas. But it's the
white killers to instituted the practice.

But who pays attention to 8th grade history these days?

Kev

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

...
Let me ask you this. Does not the belief in an afterlife, in some form, not imply a potential for consequence of acts not found in secular beliefs?

...

You didn't ask me but no.

a reply to: Tangerine

That's ok.

NO ONE? Not ever?

Sorry. Are you saying no to the 'fear of consequence' mechanism or fear of consequence in an 'afterlife'?

(I want you pinned down before I open fire...)

a reply to: Tangerine

Wait a minute...

I now suspect your snookering me....LOL

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: Tangerine

That's ok.

NO ONE? Not ever?

Sorry. Are you saying no to the 'fear of consequence' mechanism or fear of consequence in an 'afterlife'?

(I want you pinned down before I open fire...

)

Consequences dished out by whom or what in an afterlife? The original question you asked was, "let me ask you this. Does not the belief in an afterlife, in some form, not imply a potential for consequences of acts not found in secular beliefs?" Is the butterfly on the hook for that which it did as a caterpillar? Who holds it accountable?

a reply to: Tangerine

You know perfectly well what I referred to. The question is in general. Thou shalt not ensnare me, my good man....

I am a christian deist.
I don't believe in organized christian churches as they all twist things so bad that only there own churches are the only right church.

Deist are just if not more moral then any organized christian churches.

- We hold that God likely exists based on reason and observation of the natural universe.
- We hold that everything we need to know of God can be found in the universe itself.
- We hold that God does not act in the universe in ways that contradict natural law, but do not deny the possibility.
-We hold that human beings are capable of having profound experiences of God, but hold that such personal revelations are true only for themselves.
- We hold that love is the noblest and most important element of human relationships. We advocate honesty and justice, guided by compassion and respect, in our dealings with one another.
- We hold that people should advance the human condition within their personal capacity to do so.
- We hold that people should be free in all aspects of their lives, provided they do not disturb the peace, happiness, or safety of society. We believe in personal responsibility for our actions.
- We hold that faith is a personal matter guided by the dictates of conscience. We endeavor to promote deism by teaching those who are interested.
- We hold that the separation of religion and government is essential.
- We hold that our understanding of God and our approach to deism must evolve with our knowledge of the universe.

a reply to: nwtrucker

and you are supporting a religion that has a doctrine that seems to say that God has commanded that the wife should give the husband the final say about everything including the choice of weather to be abstinent or not!
or are you going to deny that?

a reply to: dawnstar

As I have stated many times. I am not a Christian.

Having said that. I have yet to see a household where mama didn't reign supreme....

Seriously, if both parties are agreeable to it then none of my business...as long as it doesn't violate laws of the land.
That is pretty much old Testament, is it not?

I'm not up on which sect practices it or whether it's more lip service these days.

But if you intend to sink the whole religion based on some point that is no longer practiced, it won't fly. Christianity has evolved, grown and adapted.

The point of the thread is there has been some positives in the Judea-Christian moral code and it's benefits to this nation.

No one said perfect. More benefits than liabilities from what I can see. JMO

a reply to: nwtrucker

"If one requires a 'fear of god' to behave as a good person; they're not a good person." -Scott Smith

originally posted by: Tangerine
Most of this whining is coming from men who can't accept the fact that the incestuous twins patriarchy and the appalling Abrahamic religions are in their death throes and women are no longer willing to be their doormats.

Meh. Not going to happen.
Religion fills a critical void in the human psyche. Otherwise, we would not have evolved to have it.
Or, perhaps it is a genuine need that was placed in mankind by a Creator.

Either way, it is here to stay. Even irreligious people can hold beliefs that are essentially religious. They may not be tied to a particular faith, but they share a startling similarity to religious views. For instance, apocalyptic beliefs like the fear of global warming/climate change and the resulting destruction of the world remind one of the eschatological views held by Christians or Muslims. (This is just one example, but I'm sure ATSers are well-acquainted with other doomsday views!) Similarly, progressive views that hold to the idea of societal progress is similar to the eschatological views of some Christians who believe that the Kingdom of God will keep spreading and spreading until Christ returns.

Religion has been with us from the very beginning. It will see us through to the end.

originally posted by: MyHappyDogShiner
Our founding fathers were not all Christians like you ignorant zealots insist they were.
Please study or close your pie hole.
I am surrounded by ignorant zealots here in Georgia and I am about to.....
Thank you.

They pretty much all held to a Christian worldview though.
Even Jefferson, who would fit right in here at ATS () seemed to think religion was beneficial to mankind.

originally posted by: StalkerSolent

originally posted by: Tangerine
Most of this whining is coming from men who can't accept the fact that the incestuous twins patriarchy and the appalling Abrahamic religions are in their death throes and women are no longer willing to be their doormats.

Meh. Not going to happen.
Religion fills a critical void in the human psyche. Otherwise, we would not have evolved to have it.
Or, perhaps it is a genuine need that was placed in mankind by a Creator.

Either way, it is here to stay. Even irreligious people can hold beliefs that are essentially religious. They may not be tied to a particular faith, but they share a startling similarity to religious views. For instance, apocalyptic beliefs like the fear of global warming/climate change and the resulting destruction of the world remind one of the eschatological views held by Christians or Muslims. (This is just one example, but I'm sure ATSers are well-acquainted with other doomsday views!) Similarly, progressive views that hold to the idea of societal progress is similar to the eschatological views of some Christians who believe that the Kingdom of God will keep spreading and spreading until Christ returns.

Religion has been with us from the very beginning. It will see us through to the end.

You misread my post. I didn't say that religion isn't here to stay. I said patriarchy and the Abrahamic religions are in their death throes. Interesting that you couldn't distinguish that from religion in general. Hmmm.

originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: StalkerSolent

originally posted by: Tangerine
Most of this whining is coming from men who can't accept the fact that the incestuous twins patriarchy and the appalling Abrahamic religions are in their death throes and women are no longer willing to be their doormats.

Meh. Not going to happen.
Religion fills a critical void in the human psyche. Otherwise, we would not have evolved to have it.
Or, perhaps it is a genuine need that was placed in mankind by a Creator.

Either way, it is here to stay. Even irreligious people can hold beliefs that are essentially religious. They may not be tied to a particular faith, but they share a startling similarity to religious views. For instance, apocalyptic beliefs like the fear of global warming/climate change and the resulting destruction of the world remind one of the eschatological views held by Christians or Muslims. (This is just one example, but I'm sure ATSers are well-acquainted with other doomsday views!) Similarly, progressive views that hold to the idea of societal progress is similar to the eschatological views of some Christians who believe that the Kingdom of God will keep spreading and spreading until Christ returns.

Religion has been with us from the very beginning. It will see us through to the end.

You misread my post. I didn't say that religion isn't here to stay. I said patriarchy and the Abrahamic religions are in their death throes. Interesting that you couldn't distinguish that from religion in general. Hmmm.

I read your post just fine, thanks.
I don't see any evidence that the Abrahamic religions are in there death throes. There's nothing around that can put them down. Paganism was killed off by the Abrahamic religions, and there's nothing around right now with the spiritual stopping power to bother the Abrahamic religions. In fact, they're still growing: Christianity in Asia and Africa, Islam in the West. If religion is really around to stay, than Islam and Christianity are going to continue to be around for some time.

a reply to: StalkerSolent

There's nothing around that can put them down.

Science and common sense, can and will "put them down".

a reply to: NotTooHappy

Great! It keeps the "not good people" in line...

The good ones take care of themselves...

Rather simple, isn't it.