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Laser on the F-35.

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posted on Dec, 17 2004 @ 09:31 AM
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From this article taken from aviationnow.com:


Lockheed Martin plans to make space for the laser system by pulling out the Rolls-Royce-built shaft-driven lift fan in the Marine Corps short takeoff/vertical landing (STOVL) variant of the JSF (DAILY, Sept. 23). Within that 100-cubic-foot space, used largely for fuel storage in the other variants, the laser can draw wattage from a shaft connected directly to the aircraft's JSF119-611 engine.


--snip--



Over the summer, Lockheed Martin signed an agreement with the Air Force Research Laboratory's (AFRL) Directed Energy Directorate to cooperatively explore high-energy laser concepts for fighters (DAILY, June 6). AFRL will furnish the laser, while Lockheed Martin concentrates on integration into the aircraft.

Lockheed Martin anticipates the JSF using lasers against both air and ground targets, at a typical range of 10 kilometers (6.2 miles). The laser itself would be housed in a dome that would emerge from the aircraft when needed, Burris said.

Laser on the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter

This article is further backed by the possibility of F-16's being outfitted with lasers:


KIRTLAND AIR FORCE BASE, N.M., Oct. 28 -- F-16 pilots participating in a computerized war-game exercise this week will be armed with a simulated laser cannon developed by the Air Force Research Laboratory.
During the exercise, called Advanced Concepts Event (ACE), pilots will use the newly developed laser-armed F-16 simulator to better prepare for aerial combat once laser weapons become available. The simulator also allows Air Combat Command to develop tactics, techniques and procedures that will be needed in laser battles.

F-16 Pilots Join in Laser Games



According to Martinez, the directorate's lethality branch experts are investigating the feasibility of developing a common laser target damage model that can be integrated into other laser-weapon simulators. AFRL experts are currently investigating the future use of laser weapons on the Joint Strike Fighter, and the high-energy laser fighter is a major step in that effort. (Courtesy of Air Force Materiel Command News Service).

Laser simulator provides weapons training

And this:


"If anybody doubts what I am asserting, they need to go out to Lawrence Livermore lab and see this demo," said Urias, deputy commander of the Army Space and Missile Defense Command and acquisitions executive for Air and Missile Defense.

Big stakes for lab to build battle laser - 27/10/03

The future of air combat and laser dualism has or will arrive very quickly.
Thoughts and comments?



seekerof

[edit on 17-12-2004 by Seekerof]




posted on Dec, 17 2004 @ 09:37 AM
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When I was a child, I dreamed of huge laser battles between craft in space and on earth. Scifi was always my thing. Hearing this is actually comming to fruit brings mixed emotions. The boy in me is saying "I KNEW IT I KNEW IT IKNEWIT> YES!" The rational man in me is saying, "Holy Crap! how much destructive force are we going to put in our arsinal?" This is a welcome development in weapons systems, but it could be a double edge sword if this tech falls into the wrong hands. If they can put this equipment in the JSF, it will only be a matter of time befor a shoulder mounted version is avalible. Not something I would want to have floating around out there.

Good find Seekerof



posted on Dec, 17 2004 @ 11:06 AM
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6 miles is not very far as far as air to air is concerned. So, for air combat its basically a great dogfighting weapon. But guess what? How many dogfights you see happening soon with 100 mile+ range missiles out there? Now many.

For an air to ground weapon, very nice!!! Air to ship might be nice, if the F35 could get that close.

Who knows.



posted on Dec, 17 2004 @ 12:21 PM
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I would think the 6 mile range is more defensive, aimed at defeating incoming missiles?

Once the laserthing really catches on, I think we will see a run towards stronger (more power demanding) longer and longer range lasers in order to outgun your opponent.

For instance, While the F-16 is a fast and powerfull airplane, the relatively slugish Boeing could take her probably out from long distance with her much huger laser that goes a hundred miles....

Due to the potential high killrate of future lasers, for missile attacks to be succesfull we will probably see more of of faster and smaller kinetic missiles deployed in overwhelmingly swarmlike numbers....Since these missiles carry a massive and not an explosive warhead and could already brought up to speed in an early stage using a scramjet engine, they would already have some basic shielding (because no fuel nor warhead would detonate on laser impact)

It's interesting to note how beside the americans, the chinese put much effort in developing their lasers, cause that would allow them to just skip a few generations of missile development and really level the playfield, many of american (and chinese for that matter) state of the art missiles would be obsoleted and the americans would have to come with a faster than light solution to take the lead again, i don't see that happening soon...

For airdefences on the ground we probably see the introduction of even stronger proton particle beams , wich require large LinVac infrastructure wich you cannot easily bring in the air.


[edit on 17-12-2004 by Countermeasures]



posted on Dec, 17 2004 @ 02:42 PM
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I see one major advantage of liveing in scotland if the USAF does put this thing on its main jet: foggy ( laser doesnt work) and rainy (laser doesnt work) oh and wet (laser wont work)
HE HE i am safe from the USAF....well almost.
If it rains your laser's will kinda be useless.



posted on Dec, 17 2004 @ 03:00 PM
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Originally posted by Kidfinger
When I was a child, I dreamed of huge laser battles between craft in space and on earth. Scifi was always my thing. Hearing this is actually comming to fruit brings mixed emotions. The boy in me is saying "I KNEW IT I KNEW IT IKNEWIT> YES!"


One thing that is not going to be like the Scifi laser is that they are invisible to the naked eye. Kind of takes the visual awe out of laser battles when you cant even see them


Amazing tech though if they can get a laser weapon to fit into a plane of that size. They have already done it with a 747 but thats way bigger.



posted on Dec, 17 2004 @ 03:09 PM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
I see one major advantage of liveing in scotland if the USAF does put this thing on its main jet: foggy ( laser doesnt work) and rainy (laser doesnt work) oh and wet (laser wont work)


Lazers work in those conditions they are just not as effective havent you used a laser pointer in some fog? Laser weapons are far stronger then any pointer if they can cut through titanuim like butter do you really think they wont work in some fog , They still work but it will effect performance.



posted on Dec, 17 2004 @ 03:12 PM
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If they could just harness the negative energy particles in my wifes stare. Man what a devastating weapon!!! A range of 100s of miles, instant destruction!!



posted on Dec, 17 2004 @ 03:22 PM
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Originally posted by ShadowXIX
Lazers work in those conditions they are just not as effective havent you used a laser pointer in some fog? Laser weapons are far stronger then any pointer if they can cut through titanuim like butter do you really think they wont work in some fog , They still work but it will effect performance.

In scotland there is very little chance of it not raining when its foggy also the fog here in scotland is kinda thick. I dont think the laser would work in my opinion.



posted on Dec, 17 2004 @ 04:24 PM
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How about extending the effective range of a laserbeam by refocussing it in midair?

I was thinking of a ground based large infrastructure that could house a really big bad laser, bigger than the boeing 747.

While there already is a lot of research on relaying laserbeams with mirrors and or prismas, these methods are problematic with powerfull beams, one speck of dust on the mirror and the mirror gets cooked for instance...

also a universal problem with lasers is mainly beamspreading/diffusion at longer distances

Now using the principle of total internal reflection I vision a blimp or plane from wich is suspended a hollow aluminium tube , open on both ends, the opening that will be entered by laserbeam will be slightly wider than the opening where the the beam will go out.

At all times the angles under wich the dispersed photons hit the tubewall will be greater than 70 degrees to insure total internal reflection and as net result will give the beam more milage.

Like wise I vision a focus extender for a ground based proton beam, using a blimp or plane with a superconducting magnetic tube suspend to refocus or relay the beam. For just example: one could imagine the chinese would like to have such a setup near the 3 gorges dam (wich is prone for millitary/terrorist attacks anyway) , where the the dam provides the raw power for the laser/particle beam and the relaystions target anything from lowflying cruisemissiles to hypersonic high-altitude bombers...



[edit on 17-12-2004 by Countermeasures]



posted on Dec, 18 2004 @ 05:16 AM
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Think of the money they will save by not haveing to spend a million dollars to shot every missile. They could take multiple shots for almost nothing and spend the money they save on other projects.Well worth the money to develope lasers!



posted on Dec, 18 2004 @ 05:30 AM
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Originally posted by thecry
Think of the money they will save by not haveing to spend a million dollars to shot every missile. They could take multiple shots for almost nothing and spend the money they save on other projects.Well worth the money to develope lasers!


That's what the plan is... Current estimates have the lasers being installed n the 2012-2015 timeframe...



posted on Dec, 18 2004 @ 05:39 AM
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[edit on 18-12-2004 by ChrisRT]



posted on Dec, 18 2004 @ 09:42 AM
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Originally posted by devilwasp
I see one major advantage of liveing in scotland if the USAF does put this thing on its main jet: foggy ( laser doesnt work) and rainy (laser doesnt work) oh and wet (laser wont work)
HE HE i am safe from the USAF....well almost.
If it rains your laser's will kinda be useless.


JSF operational altitude is 15 000 meters, it's above fog, clouds or other weather effects. Combination of stealth and laser could highly increase JSF survivability. Just imagine - even if you are able to detect stealth aircraft and get the misilles into the air quickly enugh, the laser will erase them from the sky.



posted on Dec, 18 2004 @ 11:12 AM
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Originally posted by longbow


JSF operational altitude is 15 000 meters, it's above fog, clouds or other weather effects. Combination of stealth and laser could highly increase JSF survivability. Just imagine - even if you are able to detect stealth aircraft and get the misilles into the air quickly enugh, the laser will erase them from the sky.

How you supposed to hit ground targets if you cant see them?



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 12:36 PM
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syntethic aperture radar lifts the fog and is growing up fast:

www.sandia.gov...

Now this is public images to view, they must have even higher resolutions able to spot moving targets, in classified programs...

[edit on 19-12-2004 by Countermeasures]



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 01:29 PM
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I sure hope they use solid state lasers instead of those chemical powered devices. The solid state lasers are far smaller, lighter, and just as powerful. Power may be a small problem, but a solution to it isn't hard to find, I can think of many right off hand...



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 01:30 PM
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Originally posted by devilwasp

Originally posted by longbow


JSF operational altitude is 15 000 meters, it's above fog, clouds or other weather effects. Combination of stealth and laser could highly increase JSF survivability. Just imagine - even if you are able to detect stealth aircraft and get the misilles into the air quickly enugh, the laser will erase them from the sky.

How you supposed to hit ground targets if you cant see them?


Maybe they'll use sonar or thermal heat sensors... There surely has to be a solution to that problem.



posted on Dec, 19 2004 @ 02:16 PM
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Originally posted by faddinglight


Maybe they'll use sonar or thermal heat sensors... There surely has to be a solution to that problem.

You are missing the point, finding them is easy hitting them is different.
A laser wouldnt work with fog in the road and the rain below it would scatter the beam.



posted on Dec, 21 2004 @ 01:56 AM
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(Stares at screen.. double takes)


(Mutters to self incoherently for a minute then manages to compose himself...somewhat)
WWW...GUH...BUU....AHHH.... HOLY MACKEREL!!!!

Sorry bout the caps but I think they are waranted in this situation. I am beyond words. Wow that all I can say wow... In my life time Lasers... on planes... not just big planes...but little planes too...
This is awesome wow
Its times like this that I am proud to be an American....
I just hope we put them to good use and they dont turn out to be a multi billion dollar money pit we throw cash down til we realize we dont have the tech to pull it off or that it is tacticallly pointless.
But I dont think it will be



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