Why did King David take orders from Satan…???

originally posted by: Maigret
a reply to: vethumanbeing

You're obviously just making up the statements in your reply to me.

'...Satan entered Judas...' - Judas was a human being. This is not the only instance in the Scriptures where Satan influences human beings, but it does show you didn't read my post properly, and that you have no idea of what the Bible actually says.
Believe me, the Antichrist is already worshiped worldwide! And his mark is being used openly. This shows how sinister and deceptive the Devil is!

To the contrary, I was complementary (I guess I hit a hidden nerve).

a reply to: akushla99

Originally posted by Akushla99
Well, there you go then Joecroft...you have all the information you need to work out my position - a position that hasn't changed (despite the questions of individual interpretation)...and it may not be that far different than your own...the poster you refer to, in my opinion, has nailed it…

Hmmm…so you held my position ALL along, including the other posters too…Your title is right, you really are a Trickster…

Originally posted by Akushla99
I think you're being a tad paranoic, if you believe I've 'targeted' you...

What I found strange, is that the poster you said nailed it, appreciated the question in my OP…But you, well… (fill in the blank)

Originally posted by Akushla99
I can't apologise for the fact that you authored the OP and posed a question...

Great; and neither would I want you to apologise, because there’s simply no need…

Originally posted by Akushla99
I certainly wasn't standing behind you, twisting your arm behind your back compelling you to post the question...

Yeah, I guess that’s true…you got me partner lol

Originally posted by Akushla99
Let's do this...suspend the animus (if there is any), and don't take things so personally...

There is no animus here, plus I thought I was fairly gentle with you, considering your first post on this thread…

Originally posted by Akushla99
…your ideas aren't you...

Actually, they are a part of me...

Originally posted by Akushla99
and IF at any point it seemed I assailed you, as opposed to your ideas, it never is my intention for it to be taken that way...but, I can't control how you take things...

Seemed…Seemed!!!…I don’t think your opening post on this thread, could have been looked at, in any other way…My reaction to it, was perfectly natural…IMO

Originally posted by Akushla99
Yes. I do think the question is a valid one - and yes, I think it's a little peurile –

Seems like a contradiction in terms to me…

Originally posted by Akushla99
So, here is my upturned palm, extended towards you...take it...I swear, I won't pull it away 

Well, seeing as you're aware of the “real truth”, I’m prepared to forgot all that has gone on between us, and shake your hand…

Welcome to the Croft Zone lol


- JC

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
…
…Jesus says something interesting in John that correlated himself with a snake.

John 3
14 Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up,


He says that he must be lifted up just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, drawing a parallel between himself and the snake (Lucifer) in the garden.

Funny, I just recently quoted that verse, like a few days ago, on another thread…

I believe that verse (John 3:14) is a coded reference to the Kabbalah and the Tree of Life…etc…

The keys are in the words used…The use of the word “wilderness” is no accident IMO…it represents a people who are in a baron/land, without water… i.e without the Spirit of God. The snake in that verse represents being in a low spiritual state. The snake represents a lower spiritual state because symbolically, it crawls on the ground and is close to Sheol/Grave…which is why it must be raised up…

The snake being lifted up, represents the spirit being lifted up within the individual, which moves them away from being in a baron/dead state, into becoming spiritually alive.

By his use of the phrase “Son of Man”, Jesus was referring to everyone collectively…(who believes in the truth he was speaking) becoming anointed with the Spirit of God…

To become a “Son of Man” is to become anointed with the Spirit of God…IMO …just like Ezekiel did in the verse below…

Ezekiel 2: 1-2
He said to me, “Son of man, stand up on your feet and I will speak to you.” 2 As he spoke, the Spirit came into me and raised me to my feet, and I heard him speaking to me.

That’s my take…


- JC

I do agree with some of what has been stated on the thread by various posters yet I feel there have been a lot of contradictory statements made among you. For instance in one moment you are treating Satan as a metaphor and the next as an actual entity...which is it ???
It makes a lot of sense to me...from an energy development perspective...that a perfect entity be made as an opposing force to mercy and then pit that force against a promise made by God ( whom ALL entities are ultimately subject to ) thus causing that entity to come full circle to repentance ( and causing maximum development of available energy in the process )...which I believe is Satan's ultimate end ( No longer in opposition thus ENDING the need for the Satan role ) Hint: The fire spoken of in the bible that is considered literal hell fire...is an intense refinement process. There are many instances in the bible where the word fire is used in that context. Just my opinion.

originally posted by: Joecroft
a reply to: HarryJoy

Originally posted by HarryJoy
Yes you are correct ....as I see it Satan would be the one that facilitates the justice. As far as which traits are attributable to Satan......I would say he/she was very much a balanced representative of God until he/she went astray ( due possibly to him/her not being able to make mercy fit into his/her equations..so to speak ).

You realize niether God nor Satan are physical beings (unless you subscribe to the idea the human being its actual mouthpiece/expression); otherwise scripture metaphors (to what purpose), poetry in motion?

HarryJoy: As the "enforcer" so to speak of justice...he/she very well may have not been able to accept the concept of mercy. And it may have been intended to be that way by the creator.

No one enforces another; the sole/souls purpose is to cause friction between the two (enabling chaos) reformation, new challenges; if not, no new circumstances never arise to be resolved or rethought/recreated.

Joecroft: There’s 2 problems with Satan being Gods "enforcer" of Justice IMO…

(1) The problem with Satan being used as Gods righteous “enforcer” of justice, i.e. working for God directly, by carrying out Gods wishes and commands etc...; Is that Satan shouldn’t really be going along with Gods commands/wishes, because he (Satan) is supposed to be in rebellion against God, and in opposition to Gods plans…?

(2) And If God is commanding/allowing Satan to carry things out in a cruel manner, then this is a huge red flag in relation to Gods Character IMO… And again problem (1) above still persists…because Satan shouldn’t be going along with Gods wishes/plans, even if it does suit his (Satan's) character…

The more you think about this, the more you begin to wonder who Satan is, and who the God of Righteousness is
- JC

Some one elses best idea (not yours as you have a better lock on this). God and Satan are the same being. God is the information seeker, Satan is the enlightener; seems to me they are on the same team. This same scenario has played throughout history; differing actors playing the same roles; in differing times of human civilization. There is no separation. Satan is Gods Doppleganger evil twin? Are they equal; NO. The Satan idea was allowed to manifest in order question the system of faith based dynamics (and why not)? Here Comes Science; snorting and stomping its feet.

originally posted by: HarryJoy

HarryJoy: I do agree with some of what has been stated on the thread by various posters yet I feel there have been a lot of contradictory statements made among you. For instance in one moment you are treating Satan as a metaphor and the next as an actual entity...which is it ???

Waiting it out for your opinion.

HarryJoy: It makes a lot of sense to me...from an energy development perspective...that a perfect entity be made as an opposing force to mercy and then pit that force against a promise made by God ( whom ALL entities are ultimately subject to ) thus causing that entity to come full circle to repentance ( and causing maximum development of available energy in the process )...which I believe is Satan's ultimate end ( No longer in opposition thus ENDING the need for the Satan role ) Hint: The fire spoken of in the bible that is considered literal hell fire...is an intense refinement process. There are many instances in the bible where the word fire is used in that context. Just my opinion.

What is scripture hinting at here (not being an expert of). There is no such thing as a perfect being (including the idea of God) if were to be there is no reason for changing the script/format. Utopia will never exist because the lines drawn in that sand continually move backwards to promote the idea of a better change/outcome (creation).

a reply to: vethumanbeing

Sorry, Vethumanbeing, your reply was too tongue-in-cheek for me to appreciate - and I obviously didn't read it through properly. *blush* My apologies.

And no, he's not a faceless coward - he's frigging lethal! I know there is a lot going on behind the scenes of the rich and famous, but he isn't one of them and he appears to be one of the really good guys (read 'righteous') - and has yet to be revealed.

Besides the Antichrist, (Judas, resurrected as Pope Francis - showing the influences of having been a disciple previously), I've also earmarked the False Prophet (Emeritus Pope Benedict XVI, pushing for Jesus to be worshiped as God, which you can see coming out in all sorts of places) and the Two Witnesses, (Nehemia Gordon and Keith Johnson - both working in tandem, reading, speaking and writing Hebrew, as well as studying the Torah).

So I'm waiting...

a reply to: vethumanbeing

Well...I say Metaphor..and anyone that says otherwise is a nutcase. What do you say ? Also most of what has been said on here is nonsense from my perspective and the ONLY reason it has ANY validity is because you have agreed to agree among yourselves. Even though as I said I do agree with SOME of what has been said. And this whole subject matter is very wearisome for me to dwell on...because I don't see where it is of any tangible benefit to me or society at large.

And most of what you and others ask of me has already been given and you are either overlooking it or purposely ignoring it...I will use the last question as an example...If God were perfect...why does the script change ? Answer IMO....because he is dealing with imperfect beings and he deals with us in a progressive manner FOR OUR SAKE NOT HIS (which I stated a few posts back /or the other thread we were participating in ). A hint to that fact is Jesus was the lamb slain from the FOUNDATION of the world. What was the first acceptable sacrifice in the bible ?? The lamb offered by Abel. What was it a type of ? The sacrifice of Christ...so where did the script change ?? Yes he progressed through various other methods/attempts of bringing about righteousness...for the sake of the finite onlookers.... but he obviously knew what the ultimate solution would be.

a reply to: Joecroft

"Seems like a contradiction in terms to me" Quote Joecroft

A moebius strip can easily be made with a strip of paper and a piece of tape. A walking ant can navigate both sides of the strip, and end up where it began.
"Let Us make man in our image" - statement immortalised in the act of creating/making...we are creators, and everything is permitted, but not everything is necessary...Be careful what you imagine, you might frighten yourself...into armageddon (unnecessay but permitted)...3 (?) main characters and generations of choruses sharing the stage (audience/hecklers in the stalls) taken through the gamut of emotion. Drama with familiar real life in all its glory, mundane and madness...T.Hulce played
Am-a-deus in the 1984 film...I suspect the narrative was based loosely on real life events, but I wouldn't definitively extract history from it...so I can definitively assert that the OP question is a valid one, and a puerile one at the same time, just like I could walk around that strip and have walked on both sides of a piece of paper...

Å99

DP

a reply to: akushla99

Originally posted by Akushla99
A moebius strip can easily be made with a strip of paper and a piece of tape. A walking ant can navigate both sides of the strip, and end up where it began.

So you use this analogy A LOT, to help make any two things fit together, when in a tricky spot…like war and peace…love and hate…etc…

Wow!!!, what kind of debating tactics are these lol …?

Originally posted by Akushla99
"Let Us make man in our image" - statement immortalised in the act of creating/making...we are creators, and everything is permitted, but not everything is necessary...

Yeah, seems to make perfect sense…no puerility detected lol

Originally posted by Akushla99
Be careful what you imagine, you might frighten yourself...into armageddon (unnecessay but permitted)...3 (?) main characters and generations of choruses sharing the stage (audience/hecklers in the stalls) taken through the gamut of emotion.

Edgar Allen Poe would be proud, nice work…

Originally posted by Akushla99
Drama with familiar real life in all its glory, mundane and madness...T.Hulce played Am-a-deus in the 1984 film...I suspect the narrative was based loosely on real life events, but I wouldn't definitively extract history from it...

Thank you for sharing your thoughts with us, interesting insights Å99…but why are you are bringing this up again lol…?

Originally posted by Akushla99
so I can definitively assert that the OP question is a valid one, and a puerile one at the same time, just like I could walk around that strip and have walked on both sides of a piece of paper...

To state something is “puerile”, means that it’s childish and silly…and for something to be “valid”, means that it has some sound basis or logic to it etc…

So how can the two co-exist together, in any one instance…???


Moebius strips are one thing, but definitions of words cannot traverse the space time continuum barrier, and come out the other end, with opposite meanings attached to them…IMO


- JC

a reply to: vethumanbeing

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Some one elses best idea (not yours as you have a better lock on this).

Thanks, nice to know someone out there concurs with me…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
God and Satan are the same being.

That wouldn’t go down to well, as a latest “NEWS FLASH”; a “news just in” type scenario…and “reports are coming in” etc…

People would get real angry, create a sign, and march through the streets…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
God is the information seeker, Satan is the enlightener; seems to me they are on the same team.

If this was the Salem witch trails or the Spanish inquisition, you’d be fried lol

“Same team!, Blasphemy!!!” would be the cry's from the auditorium…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
This same scenario has played throughout history; differing actors playing the same roles; in differing times of human civilization. There is no separation. Satan is Gods Doppleganger evil twin? Are they equal; NO.

But that “NOT equal” line, might just have saved your bacon…

On the same team, but somehow NOT equal…how so…?


- JC

originally posted by: Joecroft
a reply to: vethumanbeing

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
This same scenario has played throughout history; differing actors playing the same roles; in differing times of human civilization. There is no separation. Satan is Gods Doppleganger evil twin? Are they equal; NO.

Joecroft: But that “NOT equal” line, might just have saved your bacon…

On the same team, but somehow NOT equal…how so…?

God created Satan to serve IT not usurp its dominion.

originally posted by: HarryJoy
a reply to: vethumanbeing

HarryJoy: Well...I say Metaphor..and anyone that says otherwise is a nutcase. What do you say ? Also most of what has been said on here is nonsense from my perspective and the ONLY reason it has ANY validity is because you have agreed to agree among yourselves. Even though as I said I do agree with SOME of what has been said. And this whole subject matter is very wearisome for me to dwell on...because I don't see where it is of any tangible benefit to me or society at large.

I like metaphor as an abstract (poetic) as its reasoning (non-linear) allows for multiple thought forms and allows for the understanding of very difficult information to be interpreted by MANY PEOPLE.

HarryJoy: And most of what you and others ask of me has already been given and you are either overlooking it or purposely ignoring it...I will use the last question as an example...If God were perfect...why does the script change ? Answer IMO....because he is dealing with imperfect beings and he deals with us in a progressive manner FOR OUR SAKE NOT HIS (which I stated a few posts back /or the other thread we were participating in ).

Do not blame this on the human. We are God's imperfect creation by design; not 'dealing with' as burdensome? This is all about the AUO understanding and describing its own BEINGNESS through the human (as a process of ITS own enlightenment).

HarryJoy: A hint to that fact is Jesus was the lamb slain from the FOUNDATION of the world. What was the first acceptable sacrifice in the bible ?? The lamb offered by Abel. What was it a type of ? The sacrifice of Christ...so where did the script change ?? Yes he progressed through various other methods/attempts of bringing about righteousness...for the sake of the finite onlookers.... but he obviously knew what the ultimate solution would be.

Jesus was a 9 dimensional being down stepped into the third dimension to change a paradigm is all (a prior 2000 year old Piscean overlay of 'overlords' domination and fear). Sacrifice? The Human Metaphorical God (Jesus) allows this; as imitating a lamb or goat at the Temple, then to be processed (butchered) sold to those Romans occupying (you realize this was just a business to pay the Romans for false perceived protection against future Visigoths that failed). Did this metaphorical sacrifice fail or become in future a resounding success; and to what eventual purpose?

a reply to: vethumanbeing

Originally posted by Joecroft
But that “NOT equal” line, might just have saved your bacon…

On the same team, but somehow NOT equal…how so…?

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
God created Satan to serve IT not usurp its dominion.

“God Created Satan”…noooooo way lol…these are hard teachings to accept, Mr Miyagi lol

But wait, didn’t you also say, they were the same being…? In your previous post below…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
God and Satan are the same being.

If they are the same being, then how did He (God) manage to create him, if he was already…you know…lol…?

You appear be to entering Akushla territory…


Let me guess, there’s this piece of paper called a moebius strip, and it just so happens that if you_____________…etc etc…lol



- JC

a reply to: Joecroft

I tend to see Son of Man as either being those who have yet to become Sons of God or as the offspring of man (the body).

In other words my bodily appearance as in my face, eyes, arms, legs, etc. are of the world (mankind), whereas my soul is the Son of God who is Spirit. Everyone is born a Son of Man, but few find God and become Son of God.

The whole Son of Man and Son of God thing is ambiguous and hard to nail down for me personally, I'm still trying to discern what each means, I've got some ideas though.

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

And just to clarify, I like your idea. Maybe the Son of Man being raised up represents someone becoming the Son of God instead of just Man.

Like I said though, the Son of God/Man thing is a bit ambiguous. Jesus seems to call himself both at different points in the gospels so I'm still trying to put my finger on the mankind of each.

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
I tend to see Son of Man as either being those who have yet to become Sons of God or as the offspring of man (the body).

I see it as both of those together…with a bit extra thrown in…

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
And just to clarify, I like your idea. Maybe the Son of Man being raised up represents someone becoming the Son of God instead of just Man.

Yeah, just to re-clarify, because I hadn’t fully described it correctly in that final part of my other post…

The ”Son of Man”, is a “human being”, who has yet to receive the Spirit of God and become to know he is a Son of God…IMO …at least, that’s how it should be viewed in relation to (John 3:14)

Somewhere along the line, Jesus got exclusive rights to this “Son of Man” phrase. The phrase “Son of Man” = “ben Adam” = "Son of Adam” = "Human Being", and is more generally a way of describing the human body.

It’s interesting, because the word “being” in “Human being”, is similar to the “I will be what I will be” which is the.…beingness, aliveness, awareness…Spirit…etc…

I also think it’s entirely possible that the “Son of Man” phrase could be representing both the Flesh and Spirit together… i.e. with the “Son” = Spirit/being (which is lying dormant within etc...) and the “Man” = the Human/flesh…

So collectively, it’s that beingness (Spirit) within the “Human being” which needs to rise up…to come to know itself and become a “Son of God”…


- JC

a reply to: Joecroft

Exactly! Great way of putting it, that sounds about right to me. It explains it perfectly in my opinion. Thanks for that brother.

But yeah, Jesus somehow got the Son of God/Man attributed to him alone somewhere down the line, that was to make people look outside of themselves for the truth. When Jesus spoke he was speaking of mankind as a whole and what we can all become if we just open ourselves up to love.

It's always a pleasure talking with you, hope everything is going good in your neck of the woods!

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
Exactly! Great way of putting it, that sounds about right to me. It explains it perfectly in my opinion. Thanks for that brother.

Thanks…

My understanding on things, is growing all the time…I find that not forcing something/things, but just contemplating them over time, is the best way to get the pieces to fall into place… If I don’t see the truth in something now but I do later, then all that has changed, is my understanding and overall knowledge…

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
But yeah, Jesus somehow got the Son of God/Man attributed to him alone somewhere down the line, that was to make people look outside of themselves for the truth. When Jesus spoke he was speaking of mankind as a whole and what we can all become if we just open ourselves up to love.

I often wonder how you’ve gotten this far lol, I mean, not many people come to, what I would call “the real spiritual truth ” using the Bible. And most who think they have, are really just set in their own religious ways/dogma etc. IMO. But you seem to have found a way through…truly remarkable…IMO…you must have had one heck of a spiritual journey…I know I did lol

Originally posted by 3NL1GHT3N3D1
It's always a pleasure talking with you, hope everything is going good in your neck of the woods!

Likewise…brother…


- JC