Ukraine............Preparing for full scale war..............

a reply to: PeterMcFly

Mark my word, Putin won't back down!

Any attempts to include Russia's near abroad into NATO and Putin won't back down. And this even to the limit of fighting WW3 and using nukes.

Regarding full scale war......the Junta forces used ALL means available to them against the NAF including the Air Force but they got spanked every time they conducted a major battle. If Junta declares a full scale war against Russia, then they can count weeks at most before all of Ukraine is put under the boot of Kremlin.

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien
a reply to: noeltrotsky
They should be deleted because they talk about the foreign mercenaries on Ukrainian side ?

Nothing to do with exposing mercenaries and everything to do with treating humans decently. You obviously feel the need to spread this vile treatment which tells everyone a great deal about you as a person.

originally posted by: PeterMcFly
a reply to: stirling

No one can say with a straigth face that NATO is not encircling Russia since the fall of the USSR. Be it Crimea or Ukraine, it seem Putin have decided to lance the abscess once for all.

Mark my word, Putin won't back down!

NATO isn't encircling anyone. Those countries recently freed from Soviet rule were BEGGING to join NATO. In fact NATO has refused Ukraine and Georgia to join on multiple previous occasions.

NATO isn't trying to take over Eastern Europe...Eastern Europe is trying to get free from the Russians.

a reply to: noeltrotsky

The guy himself says he`s not going back to the Ukraine and that means he`s not a prisoner anymore, but don`t let that get in your way as a daily occurrence to try and smear me because your arguments keep failing every time.

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien
a reply to: noeltrotsky

The guy himself says he`s not going back to the Ukraine and that means he`s not a prisoner anymore, but don`t let that get in your way as a daily occurrence to try and smear me because your arguments keep failing every time.

You smear yourself by posting links to war crimes, I'm just pointing that out to people who are probably not even looking at the link anyway.

Your argument that the prisoner is leaving the war fails because prisoners are typically coerced to say ANYTHING they have been told to say. One of the very reasons the Geneva conventions don't allow this type of humiliation...because nobody believes it, except you.

a reply to: noeltrotsky

Yeah, it`s dripping of the guy he`s pressured to do so.

a reply to: infinityorder

Many alive in those countries that NATO is (encircling) Russia with, remember just how "Awesome" it is to be under Russian occupation.

I'm not arguing about how awesome it is to live in NATO land or how awesome it is to live in Putin's land. I'm not putting blame on any side either. I'm just being pragmatic on the outcome of these events!

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien
a reply to: noeltrotsky

Yeah, it`s dripping of the guy he`s pressured to do so.

No it's not. And if you thought you were under the threat of death you would say whatever they wanted you to say also.


I've got a question for you? What is your opinion about the gas/oil and refineries that Putin seized in the black sea and the Crimea ? This whole thing sounds like a war for oil to me yet no one ever mentions it.

Should Putin in anyway compensate to Ukraine for the billions if not trillions of resources and infrastructure he robbed them of?

originally posted by: stirling
a reply to: rickymouse
Funnily enough Ricky, I don't seem to recall that Ukraine attacked Russia.....if you have a link please provide.......

What would the US do if Alaska decided it wanted to join Russia? We would fund the people who wanted to remain loyalty to the US and supply them with weapons. This is not unusual for Russia to do what they are doing, the US does it all the time.

originally posted by: noeltrotsky

originally posted by: rickymouse
Russia did not start this war, the ones who took over Ukraine did.

That's pretty funny! Even Putin admitted the little Green men in Crimea were Russian solders and they arrived days after the Ukrainian leader abandoned his office.

I must have missed the part where Ukrainians attacked Russia.

If I steal things from my neighbor and it winds up in a fist fight, my neighbor throwing the first punch. Who actually started the fight, me for stealing from my neighbor or my neighbor for punching me.

a reply to: noeltrotsky

Sure, i guess that's why we have anti-rocket system in Romania, and NATO and US bases all over the Europe, trying to get as close to Russian borders as possible, right? And you wonder why Russia will not allow for Ukraine to fall into NATO's hands.

originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: rickymouse

When was Ukraine going to sever all ties with Russia. They were exploring new trade options with the EU but that wouldn't sever existing trade agreements with Russia. This was what the people of Ukraine wanted. Russia didn't want to share though. They posed an ultimatum to Yanukovych where they would sever ties with Ukraine if they agrees to the EU trade deal. Yanukovych betrayed the will of his people. They called for his impeachment. He fled. A new President was legally elected. Then Russia invaded Crimea.

All of this could have been avoided if Russia had simply allowed Ukraine to expand relations with their other neighbors.

This is true, the best debate post so far. Remember though, it takes two to tangle and the people of Ukraine are just pawns. It appears that many people in the Ukraine did not want this though, mostly locality based.

a reply to: Greathouse

I've got a question for you? What is your opinion about the gas/oil and refineries that Putin seized in the black sea and the Crimea ?

I have posted my answers about that earlier today over in another thread, but I`m willing to post them again over here.

Crimea: Was It Seized by Russia, or Did Russia Block Its Seizure by the U.S.?

How members of the Kiev junta passed Ukrainian Black Sea shale oil and gas reserves to Romania

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien
a reply to: Greathouse

I've got a question for you? What is your opinion about the gas/oil and refineries that Putin seized in the black sea and the Crimea ?

I have posted my answers about that earlier today over in another thread, but I`m willing to post them again over here.

Crimea: Was It Seized by Russia, or Did Russia Block Its Seizure by the U.S.?

How members of the Kiev junta passed Ukrainian Black Sea shale oil and gas reserves to Romania

Yet as I've noticed as is your M.O. You did not answer a question ask to you. Now that the corruption is over and regardless of whether the US or Russia seized that area.

Wouldn't you think the Ukraine is due compensation instead of the gas bill? That is what cracks me up about Putin. He is the typical gangster he will rob you then send you a bill.

originally posted by: rickymouse
A new government takes over and puts the people in jeopardy of being killed then they want others to join in to share the blame of killing their citizens. This way nobody who joined in with their effort can judge their actions.

The losers are the Ukrainian people here and the ones who pay for this war. Russia did not start this war, the ones who took over Ukraine did. There is no reason they had to sever all ties with Russia. They could have been at peace with everyone.

Why is it that they always want or force the people to choose sides?

A new government takes over because the other one was killing protesters, in what started as the euromaiden and grew to become a revolution opposed to Viktor Yanukovych's administration. Russia does not like the new government, so rushes into Crimea and forcefully takes it, breaching all international rules. Then Russia blames Kiev for not listening to its people and for oppressing them. This means Russia is helping the oppressed.

The losers are Ukrainians, suffering because of Russia's gambit to control the government in Kiev. Kiev did not start this war, Viktor Yanukovych did by gunning down outspoken citizenry calling for more integration with the European union. It was the largest pro-European rally in history. There's no reason Viktor Yanukovych's administration had to suddenly suspend signing the Ukraine–European Union Association Agreement and turn away from its people. They could have put their guns down and sought peaceful ends.

Why is it governments across the world and in history will ignore their people, choosing rather to ignite wars and hate?

a reply to: Greathouse

Wouldn't you think the Ukraine is due compensation instead of the gas bill?

If any, the West should pay for the damage it has done to Eastern Ukraine.

So Russia should pay and pay and pay and pay for all the shenanigans of the West ?

It pays more than enough for it, truck load after truck humanitarian aid it`s already shipping to Eastern Ukraine.

Here another fine example of it...

Russia finds $21.7bn mistake in Yukos case

a reply to: jonnywhite

Why is it governments across the world and in history will ignore their people, choosing rather to ignite wars and hate?

Why did they ignore the will of the people in Eastern Ukraine and Crimea about not recognizing the new government as being legit ?

And why is everyone ignoring that the majority of the Ukrainians were negative towards the EU ?

Ukraine..... is being the meat puppet of the USA, Oh Sure the Fascist gov't installed in Ukraine will extract all the wealth/arms/resources it can from the hawkish USA which itself is being run by a small cadre of Muslim Brotherhood policy makers who in turn seem to pull the strings on their domestic meat puppets...

purging the military of defenders of the now kaput constitution and Oath that has been denigrated to nill

originally posted by: rickymouse

originally posted by: stirling
a reply to: rickymouse
Funnily enough Ricky, I don't seem to recall that Ukraine attacked Russia.....if you have a link please provide.......

What would the US do if Alaska decided it wanted to join Russia? We would fund the people who wanted to remain loyalty to the US and supply them with weapons. This is not unusual for Russia to do what they are doing, the US does it all the time.

Except Alaska is part of america, the Ukraine and Crimea are not a part of Russia.

When one takes sovereign territory of another nation it is an act of war.

Russia not only took Ukrainian land, they have invaded it with thousands of troops.

What is the difference between what they are doing now and what they did in ww2?

Both times they invaded and usurped other countries.

originally posted by: Nikola014
a reply to: noeltrotsky

Sure, i guess that's why we have anti-rocket system in Romania, and NATO and US bases all over the Europe, trying to get as close to Russian borders as possible, right? And you wonder why Russia will not allow for Ukraine to fall into NATO's hands.

We have all of those at the behest of the countries they are in, to protect them from russia, not to attack it.

I would think it obvious at this point that if america wanted to attack russia we would have.

Even in proxy wars america has not attacked russia once.

They have attacked Russian troops in other countries through proxy war though.

Not once though were the troops attacked inside Russia.

The point, it they wouldn't invade other countries, we would never help kill their soldiers.

See how that works?

Russia and america only clash when russia tries at empire.