18 months ago, a different, no less scary, police shooting in Fairfax, VA

A scary case of police impunity

The killing of John Geer is probably the clearest and most compelling example of what amounts to police impunity in recent American history.

He committed no crime the day he was killed. Even the officer who shot him acknowledges that. There was no struggle. The details are not murky.

But because no one was marching in the streets on behalf of John Geer, because he was absent from national headlines, the system was able to make his outrageous death go away by the simple expedient of doing nothing and refusing to discuss it.

Here are the facts:

In August 2013, Geer's common law wife, who was breaking up with him and moving out, called police to report he was angrily throwing her possessions onto his front lawn.

Asked whether Geer had weapons, the woman answered yes, but they were legally owned and secured. No, he hadn't been drinking.

Two squad cars — four officers — initially responded. Geer, on seeing them, retreated into his home, refusing to answer questions.

A few minutes later, Officer Rodney Barnes, a trained police negotiator, arrived, and as the four other policemen stood close behind him with weapons drawn, he began trying to coax John Geer out onto the porch.

Barnes would later recall that Geer was polite, but reluctant to leave his home, saying repeatedly he was frightened of being killed. He said "I don't want anybody to get hurt," the negotiator told investigators a few months later. "I don't want to get shot."
Barnes asked Geer if he owned a pistol. Geer said yes, and fetched it. He held it up, holstered, for Barnes to see and set it aside, raising his hands again. He offered to let Barnes come into the house and retrieve the weapon.

He asked for permission to scratch his nose, Barnes said, and did it slowly, then raised his hands again. He asked to reach into his pocket for his phone; Barnes asked him not to, and he obeyed. "He said 'I know if I reach down or drop my hands I can get shot," Barnes told detectives later. "I said, hey, nobody's going to shoot you…" But Geer pointed to one nearby officer in particular: Adam Torres, who kept raising his Sig Sauer pistol from the "ready" position (pointed at Geer's legs) to aim at Geer's chest.

Please ask him not to point his gun at me, Geer begged Barnes. Geer even offered to come out and be handcuffed voluntarily if Torres and the other patrolmen would agree to move "way back." Then he asked to scratch his nose again. Barnes consented. And Torres fired.

Asked by Barnes why he'd fired, Torres said Geer had dropped his hands to his waist suddenly, that he appeared to be going for a weapon. The other three officers who'd been present told investigators the same thing. So did two civilian witnesses. But prosecutors and police commanders and county officials buried the case. Fairfax County's top prosecutor declared a conflict of interest and referred the shooting to federal authorities. Federal investigators did investigate, and have reported to the U.S. attorney in Virginia, who has done nothing.

And all this was done under a cloak of secrecy, until, earlier this month, a judge finally ordered disclosure of nearly 11,000 documents, containing interviews with nearly everyone involved. The judge's disclosure order has created a bizarre situation: Nearly all the available evidence, including audio of the witness statements, is now available on the Fairfax County website.

According to those official documents, the shooter — a cop with significant anger issues (he once screamed and cursed at prosecutors in open court) — is contradicted by four fellow officers and two civilian witnesses. That sort of rank-breaking is practically unheard of. And yet there has been no judicial action, and almost no public uproar. Most politicians have remained silent. Those who have marched against police shootings in the past have been largely uninterested.

A protest at Fairfax police headquarters drew a couple of dozen people. Only the Washington Post has taken a serious interest in the case.
But the killing of John Geer should frighten everyone. It is the best example yet that while police often target minorities disproportionately, their basic and overriding demand is total and unquestioning submission to their authority.

Resist, however peacefully and even in your own home, and heaven help you, no matter what your skin colour.

Moral of the story, it doesn't batter if you are black, red, white, blue or purple, they will shoot you, and they don't care. And our government? They don't care either, so don't expect them to save you. Time to protect yourselves people and calling the police! That is unless ou WANT to wind up dead. Then by all means, feel free.

Barnes asked Geer if he owned a pistol. Geer said yes, and fetched it. He held it up, holstered, for Barnes to see and set it aside, raising his hands again. He offered to let Barnes come into the house and retrieve the weapon.

Seems like if you are in a stand off with the police, the last thing you should ask the man to do is go and fetch the weapon. And then when you fetch and are able to put it down, to just 'set it aside' seems like a poor choice.

All that aside, just another case of murder by a cop. I agree that are an equal opportunity bunch but that doesn't dismiss any notion of issues of race.
It totally should have sparked protest and marches, that fact that it didn't is not the fault of the media but the community that did not rally around him.
Was there marches and protest that were not covered? That would be the bigger story other then an absence of them.
The media covers the protest and marches, they don't cause them.
It is a difference of communities, some feel oppressed, some feel that people just make bad choices and it is on them to not present the cops with an opportunity to shoot them.


And just to clarify, I am not blaming the man at all, he was asked to get his pistol and obliged, I am blaming the negotiator for telling him to get get a weapon when he was cops pointing guns at him.

a reply to: Anyafaj

Please ask him not to point his gun at me, Geer begged Barnes. Geer even offered to come out and be handcuffed voluntarily if Torres and the other patrolmen would agree to move "way back."

Then he asked to scratch his nose again. Barnes consented. And Torres fired.

...

Torres acknowledged it had been him, and began muttering how he was sorry, and that his wrist was hurting. Then, unbidden, he told Barnes how he'd had a fight over the phone with his wife just before arriving on the scene.

Asked by Barnes why he'd fired, Torres said Geer had dropped his hands to his waist suddenly, that he appeared to be going for a weapon.

"I said I didn't see that," said Barnes later. "You know, and I never took my eye off him (Geer)."

THREE Police Officers who were on the scene, the Police Negotiator, and TWO Civilian Witnesses all testified that he did not lower his hands an that he did ask for permission to scratch his nose and then scratched his nose.

Does he regret having shot Geer? "I don't feel sorry for shooting the guy at all."

Why did he tell Barnes immediately afterward he was sorry? He was concerned about having upset Barnes by shooting, he said.

Why did he talk about his wrist hurting? He doesn't remember. Why did he immediately say he'd just had a fight with his wife? "I don't know why."

I flat out dare the apologists to come in and proclaim that our Police Force's unchecked authority isn't a threat to the Average American. I dare them to claim that the justice system works for the Average American. I dare them to tell me that if you just respect the cops authoritah then this won't happen to the Average American.

Seriously, I double puppy dog dare you to tell me there is nothing wrong with this story.

a reply to: Anyafaj

Moral of the story, it doesn't batter if you are black, red, white, blue or purple, they will shoot you, and they don't care.

Agreed...

And on another note, if you are confronted by multiple officers with guns at the ready, how about not asking to scratch your nose - more than once!

Stupidity all around...

a reply to: Anyafaj

Submitting to LEO orders can get you killed. There's been at least 3 cases in the last 12 months. Self defense is a human right.
I think could make a damn strong argument in a jury trial. If I'm alive to do it.

Come to think of it, that's probably why they choose to murder when there is the least bit of doubt. They know they are guilty and can be killed legally in self defense.

LEO's will treat you as an enemy combatant. Act accordingly.

It's not too late for this piece of garbage to be charged with murder. There is no statute of limitations. It's time to hit the "streets" (i.e. social media) and "protest" (i.e. raise awareness).

a reply to: Anyafaj

any word on what the ex wife had to say?
other than her calling about her stuff on the lawn, what else do we know about her?
we hear from all the other major players in this story.
the victim,
the negotiator,
the police officers,
some by-standers,

but what about the ex wife?

a reply to: Sremmos80

Seems like if you are in a stand off with the police, the last thing you should ask the man to do is go and fetch the weapon. And then when you fetch and are able to put it down, to just 'set it aside' seems like a poor choice.

I know it runs counter to a lot of people's views, but if you find yourself in a tense situation like this with the police - even if you didn't do anything wrong - you should ask to be handcuffed - as in "Officer, for your safety and mine, would you like to handcuff me?"

And when someone draws their weapon, it's time to full-stop, stand down, raise your hands over your head, drop to your knees - you don't know the guy on the other end of that weapon, they might be someone with anger issues whose wife left them that day, and took his dog with her, and all that anger and adrenaline is now pointed at you - and the difference between you living or dying is 4 pounds of pressure on a trigger.

Get angry later.

a reply to: squittles

While I some what agree with you, it makes me sick that we have come that.

In the land of the free, we need to protect our lives by submitting to an out of control police force.

originally posted by: subfab
a reply to: Anyafaj

any word on what the ex wife had to say?
other than her calling about her stuff on the lawn, what else do we know about her?
we hear from all the other major players in this story.
the victim,
the negotiator,
the police officers,
some by-standers,

but what about the ex wife?

Very true. I'd be curious as to what she has to say.

2nd

This was handled ridiculously all around...


First don't retreat when the cops show up... Bad bad move. Meet them with a smile and handle the business unless you want to he greeted with extreme skepticism.

Why was his nose so itchy? Opiates like to make noses itchy and make people angry and unruly. Just a thought.

Was he really asked to fetch his weapon? If so why?

Idk it's a really sad case obviously if it played out exactly like your op states but idk... I smell something odd about this one. A factor that's not known or something. Just doesn't balance out.

Why am I not surprised that this murderer is still on the force? Now who would willingly continue to work with this murderer and does that make them good or bad? Seriously, why was/is there no pressure from other officers, especially those involved who exposed his lie, to remove this murderer from the force? Where are those good apples to pluck this bad apple from the bunch? Perhaps the rot extends beyond just him. Simply disgusting.

a reply to: Anyafaj

Yes, I discovered this only relatively recently.

Not sure how it was kept under the rug, maybe because it had no useful racial component.

Posted earlier here
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Please add further comments to the ongoing discussion in the above linked thread.
Thanks

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