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originally posted by: Puppylove
a reply to: Blue_Jay33
Following that logic you must believe every book that expanded on the bible since as well. So you need to be Mormon, Islamic and Christian at the same time for example. After all God's word can never be corrupted.
originally posted by: misskat1
Im not discounting or debating if Paul had a vision, he may have, but I have had to come to terms with the FACTS. He interpreted his vision by what he had been taught. He was taught in Tarsus. Tarsus was a roman school and taught the ancient Greek Mythology.
The bottom line for me, is that Jesus was a Jew that practiced Judaism. He kept the Sabbath, Hanukkah, and observed all the Jewish Feasts. If He believed these things should be done away with, He would have stopped practicing the laws of the Old Testament. But the fact is He didnt. He practiced Judaism and died for it. We practice Pauls teachings.
I don't consider youtube videos a source of anything aside from entertainment for the most part...
Plus... You were talking about what happened to Paul... the guy in your video restored the books of the bible from Hebrew versions of them... that doesn't explain what happen to paul because his fate isn't recorded in the bible... it comes from external sources well after he lived... and Ignatius is the earliest source as far as I know... which was 50+ years after Paul disappeared... he was reported to have been beheaded, which I don't believe...
and as far as Paul meeting Jesus is concerned... theres not a shred of evidence showing Paul ever met, or even saw Jesus... IF he did see him at the very least... he would have mentioned it without a doubt...
Wrong again as usual. Paul was born CE 5 and was released 2nd time from Roman prison in CE 64 at the age of 59. no more is heard of him till the Sonnini Manuscript emerged with the 29th chapter of Acts . Very controversial but now being accepted by many scholars.
Perhaps not the internet of course. The internet is whatever you want it to be.
Now if the time line is accurate then it is highly unlikely that Paul lived another 50 + years as you have postulated. Your understanding would place Paul at least 109 years old and that i simply do not buy.
As usual your hate overrides reasoning. Simply because a mention is not made is of no consequence whatsoever. One example is that of the Apostle Bartholomew. Bartholomew is mentioned only once by Matthew, once by Mark, once by Luke and not even mentioned by John. By your reasoning Bartholomew does not even exist according to John and the other three must be liars.
That is what hate does to the mind. Yet Paul is loved as a brother and mentioned 143 times by five of the seven Apostles who we have letters.
And lastly you are wrong again. Paul was in the Sanhedrin court as a young rabbi with his master Nasi Gamaliel. He heard and saw the entire proceedings as Jesus was vindicated.
You and Paul bashers can have last word in this matter. Thanks for input.
The bottom line for me is the Bible is full of lies. On this point, you and I would agree.
You make a good point: “If He [JESUS] believed these things should be done away with, He would have stopped practicing the laws….. He practiced Judaism and died for it.” That is not what we’ve been told, but as you point out, we need to question what we’ve been told.
Paul says Jesus died to replace the Old Covenant with the New (where the Law of Moses in null and void).. And Paul wasn’t the only one saying this… read Hebrews… this theology was quick to emerge (suggesting it was already thought out before Jesus died). So we have this early theology where Jesus died for the sin of the whole world, and Covenant of Moses is replaced with an eternal Covenant in Jesus blood for all who believe.
The problem of course is that those closed to Jesus didn’t believe or teach this. James, Peter and the rest of the leaders at the founding church/ecclesia in Jerusalem still upheld the Law of Moses. These men who walk with Jesus got it wrong… according to Paul.
If you are saying that when James "the Righteous" became High Priest of Israel (after jesus, his brother, died), that James had it right to follow and keep the Old Covenant Laws of Moses..... then I have two questions for you: 1) do you really believe that is what God wanted legalism for His People? 2), do you think it applies to us today who are not even Jewish?
Romans 7 14 We know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. 15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good I want to do, but the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
It's in pretty much every translation as far as I'm aware of. If you want to argue semantics, then you are arguing the bible because that's pretty much all it is. It's a tool used to cause debate of semantics, "what word means what, this word doesn't mean that but this, that's not the original meaning", etc.
If what he says is true, his house is built without a foundation according to Jesus. If Paul taught the same thing as Jesus does that mean Jesus' house had no foundation as well?
Yet Paul admits to giving into temptation every day. If Jesus tells us to not give into temptation then why does Paul admit to doing it? Wouldn't that mean he does not practice what Jesus taught and thus his teachings have no foundation?