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Non-Extraterrestrial UFO Hypotheses

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posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:52 PM
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originally posted by: ZetaRediculian
a reply to: CirqueDeTruth

What I fear is that eventually that wall - separating us from them/it - there from here... eventually it's going to come tumbling down. If anything can do it - crack the code to the control system - science can do it.

I'm not sure I would be too worried about that. First science has to crack the code for consciousness and before that, they have to define it! Essentially I am thinking we a hard wired for these experiences and the telling of them. I think it will always just be out of reach.


what happens when when two worlds collide.

I think you meet your doppelganger?



The liminal nature of this stuff makes it inherently slippery. It may well always be just out of our grasp.




posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:56 PM
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originally posted by: BlueMule
a reply to: Tangerine

It wouldn't surprise me if the Earth is conscious. I've had enough experience with entheogens to know plants are. 🌵

Which reminds me, I've also been pondering the possibility that the UFO I saw years ago was a cluster of disembodied Peyote spirits. 🌌

👣


Those are certainly alien worlds. I can listen to Dennis McKenna all day.




posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:57 PM
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originally posted by: DelMarvel
I continually come back to the Jung book.

A big part of that is the very strange and unexplainable perceptions of synchronicity I experienced while obsessed with the topic of UFOs which also has been discussed by other researchers. This was connected to my own personal spiritual history so it felt to me like a psychological and/or spiritual event and it had nothing to do with the perception of any "aliens." Just the same as many of those who have seen UFOs feel that what they saw was without question physical reality I feel like these experiences must have been paranormal even though that is outside my present paradigm. On the other hand I realize it was subjective reality and there could possibly be other explanations.


Yeah, I think Jung was onto something, too. It's very interesting that seriously delving into the paranormal over a period of time seems to produce or make us beacons for strange phenomena. I always think of John Keel investigating the mothman sightings and the weirdness he experienced. I suspect most of us would have responded by getting the hell out of Dodge. Any thoughts about why delving into the paranormal produces strange phenomena?



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 04:00 PM
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a reply to: Tangerine

I have no experience with dimethyltryptamine. But thanks to the Ayahuasca spirit, which I am already in touch with, I will be gaining some soon.

There are many kinds of entheogens. Almost as many as there are kinds of aliens in popular Ufology.

Hmm.

👣



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 04:04 PM
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originally posted by: BlueMule
a reply to: Tangerine

I have no experience with dimethyltryptamine. But thanks to the Ayahuasca spirit, which I am already in touch with, I will be gaining some soon.

There are many kinds of entheogens. Almost as many as there are kinds of aliens in popular Ufology.

Hmm.

👣


Tell us about your experiences, please -- if you're willing.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 04:05 PM
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originally posted by: DelMarvel

originally posted by: Tangerine

I wonder why we were so receptive to his stories that they imbedded themselves in our collective psyche. As Keel's article mentions, Ivan Sanderson started the Bigfoot ball rolling. What is it about our psyches that some stories find a permanent home and others don't stick?


That fits right in with the Jungian archetype theory. Universal ideas or symbols that are somehow part of the human psyche. So the stories that connect with those gain mythic power while those that don't do not.


Joseph Campbell is another who borrowed heavily from Jung.

en.wikipedia.org... Campbell's concept of monomyth (one myth) refers to the theory that sees all mythic narratives as variations of a single great story. The theory is based on the observation that a common pattern exists beneath the narrative elements of most great myths, regardless of their origin or time of creation. Campbell often referred to the ideas of Adolf Bastian and his distinction between what he called "folk" and "elementary" ideas, the latter referring to the prime matter of monomyth while the former to the multitude of local forms the myth takes in order to remain an up-to-date carrier of sacred meanings. The central pattern most studied by Campbell is often referred to as the hero's journey and was first described in The Hero with a Thousand Faces (1949).

It might be fun to break down some of the more enduring UFO narratives.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 04:05 PM
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originally posted by: ZetaRediculian

originally posted by: BlueMule
a reply to: Tangerine

It wouldn't surprise me if the Earth is conscious. I've had enough experience with entheogens to know plants are. 🌵

Which reminds me, I've also been pondering the possibility that the UFO I saw years ago was a cluster of disembodied Peyote spirits. 🌌

👣


Those are certainly alien worlds. I can listen to Dennis McKenna all day.



I see similarities between that illustration and Australian aboriginal rock art and sand paintings. Hm.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 04:06 PM
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a reply to: Tangerine

I'll do what I can, but with rule 6 in effect I might not be able to say much.

👣



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 04:07 PM
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originally posted by: ZetaRediculian

originally posted by: DelMarvel

originally posted by: Tangerine

I wonder why we were so receptive to his stories that they imbedded themselves in our collective psyche. As Keel's article mentions, Ivan Sanderson started the Bigfoot ball rolling. What is it about our psyches that some stories find a permanent home and others don't stick?


That fits right in with the Jungian archetype theory. Universal ideas or symbols that are somehow part of the human psyche. So the stories that connect with those gain mythic power while those that don't do not.


Joseph Campbell is another who borrowed heavily from Jung.

en.wikipedia.org... Campbell's concept of monomyth (one myth) refers to the theory that sees all mythic narratives as variations of a single great story. The theory is based on the observation that a common pattern exists beneath the narrative elements of most great myths, regardless of their origin or time of creation. Campbell often referred to the ideas of Adolf Bastian and his distinction between what he called "folk" and "elementary" ideas, the latter referring to the prime matter of monomyth while the former to the multitude of local forms the myth takes in order to remain an up-to-date carrier of sacred meanings. The central pattern most studied by Campbell is often referred to as the hero's journey and was first described in The Hero with a Thousand Faces (1949).

It might be fun to break down some of the more enduring UFO narratives.


Go for it.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 04:09 PM
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originally posted by: BlueMule
a reply to: Tangerine

I'll do what I can, but with rule 6 in effect I might not be able to say much.

👣



Staying within the rules, give it your best shot. I don't think there's a rule about not discussing entity encounters and other worlds. You might want to skip any reference to how you came to encounter the entities and other worlds and just focus on the entities and other worlds if you feel that that won't be a violation. I don't want to encourage anyone to break any ATS rules.
edit on 20-2-2015 by Tangerine because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 04:25 PM
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a reply to: Tangerine


I see similarities between that illustration and Australian aboriginal rock art and sand paintings. Hm.


I noticed the similarity with sand paintings too. The Huichol yarn paintings are less...organized? Tibetan Sand paintings product of a disciplined lifestyle consisting of meditation and no sex!



Round geometric shapes and colors. Most UFOs are described as a mandala. Round swirling lights producing a profound experience...



edit on 20-2-2015 by ZetaRediculian because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 04:31 PM
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originally posted by: ZetaRediculian
a reply to: Tangerine


I see similarities between that illustration and Australian aboriginal rock art and sand paintings. Hm.


I noticed the similarity with sand paintings too. The Huichol yarn paintings are less...organized? Tibetan Sand paintings product of a disciplined lifestyle consisting of meditation and no sex!



Round geometric shapes and colors. Most UFOs are described as a mandala. Round swirling lights producing a profound experience...




What is the explanation for the content of Huichol yarn paintings and TIbetan Sand paintings? In other words, what do they say the artwork depicts?

Anyone who has ever been in a disco and experienced those god-awful lights knows that lights can produce an out-of-body or altered-consciousness experience. I wonder if those blipping cop car lights that appear to be spinning were selected to disorient or entrance the people being stopped. Also, lights can trigger epilepsy and temporal lobe epilepsy is one of the hypothetical causes of entity experiences. I know that some people are sensitive to the banks of flickering florescent lights in big box stores. I wonder if any of the sensitive people have had entity encounters in those stores. I'm not even kidding when I ask that. When I'm in a store like that I sometimes feel slightly out-of-body and can't think clearly. I remember one occasion when I was vainly looking for paperclips and could not,for the life of me, remember what they were called or even the general category of office supplies so that I could ask a clerk where to find them. It was as though an entire brain-circuit had been disconnected.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 05:06 PM
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originally posted by: DelMarvel

originally posted by: Tangerine

I wonder why we were so receptive to his stories that they imbedded themselves in our collective psyche. As Keel's article mentions, Ivan Sanderson started the Bigfoot ball rolling. What is it about our psyches that some stories find a permanent home and others don't stick?


That fits right in with the Jungian archetype theory. Universal ideas or symbols that are somehow part of the human psyche. So the stories that connect with those gain mythic power while those that don't do not.


Right. What is it about those particular stories (UFOS and Bigfoot) that are part of the human psyche? Perhaps the common response to interpret them as physical is a reaction to the difficulty we modern humans have accepting the numinous.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 05:11 PM
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a reply to: Tangerine

The Huichol yarn paintings are depections of the spirit world. Blue Mule described it perfectly. At the center is the "UFO peyote button"

I am a little rusty on my Tibetan mythology. One interesting thing is that once these paintings are complete, they destroy them. I think that is where most of the meaning is.




edit on 20-2-2015 by ZetaRediculian because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 08:50 PM
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a reply to: Tangerine




Welcome to the discussion. You're certainly not alone is suspecting that UFO phenomena is a manifestation of something larger, just out of sight and just beyond our comprehension. Perhaps that's why people who devote a lot of time delving into this topic come to feel like they're in a hall of mirrors. It's a very slippery subject and a good example of liminality: betwixt and between--neither here nor there.


Thank you, I'm happy to take part in it. Betwixt and between--neither here nor there, I like that.




Vallee talks a great deal about the similarities between faerie encounters/abductions and modern-day UFO encounter/abduction stories. Have you read any of his work? Patrick Harpur has interesting insights, too. His book Daimonic Reality is well worth reading.


I used to be one of those who believed in nuts and bolts saucers. Vallee is the one who really turned me around on the subject. I read all of his books that I could get and what he has written just rings true to me when held up beside my own experiences. I will have to read the Harper book you mention. I know first hand that there are things out there, or beings or whatever you want to call them, and they are deceitful and malicious in nature.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 09:00 PM
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originally posted by: wtbengineer
I know first hand that there are things out there, or beings or whatever you want to call them, and they are deceitful and malicious in nature.


Just curious whether you think there might be any 'good' ones?



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 09:58 PM
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originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: DelMarvel

originally posted by: Tangerine

I wonder why we were so receptive to his stories that they imbedded themselves in our collective psyche. As Keel's article mentions, Ivan Sanderson started the Bigfoot ball rolling. What is it about our psyches that some stories find a permanent home and others don't stick?


That fits right in with the Jungian archetype theory. Universal ideas or symbols that are somehow part of the human psyche. So the stories that connect with those gain mythic power while those that don't do not.


Right. What is it about those particular stories (UFOS and Bigfoot) that are part of the human psyche? Perhaps the common response to interpret them as physical is a reaction to the difficulty we modern humans have accepting the numinous.


I'm sure you know this and I'm repeating what most here know but that was a major point of Jung's book: That people were mistaking spiritual reality for physical reality. For myself, I really feel like I saw "something" and there were other people who saw them, too, but I suppose everyone feels that way.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 10:16 PM
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a reply to: lostgirl

Oh yes, I absolutely do! In fact, I think that my continued existence may be attributed to the help of such entities. It's just that they don't insinuate themselves into your life the way the bad ones do, in fact, you normally don't even know when they are around.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 10:22 PM
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originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: DelMarvel
I continually come back to the Jung book.

A big part of that is the very strange and unexplainable perceptions of synchronicity I experienced while obsessed with the topic of UFOs which also has been discussed by other researchers. This was connected to my own personal spiritual history so it felt to me like a psychological and/or spiritual event and it had nothing to do with the perception of any "aliens." Just the same as many of those who have seen UFOs feel that what they saw was without question physical reality I feel like these experiences must have been paranormal even though that is outside my present paradigm. On the other hand I realize it was subjective reality and there could possibly be other explanations.

. I always think of John Keel investigating the mothman sightings and the weirdness he experienced. I suspect most of us would have responded by getting the hell out of Dodge. Any thoughts about why delving into the paranormal produces strange phenomena?


I should have given that thought, I suppose. I actually have no idea. My hardcore immersion into UFOs was twenty years ago now and is fuzzy. I remember that I was reading Messengers of Deception and the Mothman Prophecies, some strange things started happening and I became afraid that if I continued I would meet the Men in Black. So I abruptly stopped all my research, put everything out of my mind and went back to my previous life. It felt "real" but somehow I was aware that it was the result of where I was putting my attention and that I could stop it by directing my mind elsewhere.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 10:32 PM
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It felt "real" but somehow I was aware that it was the result of where I was putting my attention and that I could stop it by directing my mind elsewhere.
a reply to: DelMarvel

This is exactly the approach I have taken. I have found that if I apply my mind only to day to day concerns, i.e. my job, kids etc., I don't have these interruptions in my life. It's funny, I still love reading about all these things, but I have to keep a certain distance from them.

Also, to add, I apply liberal doses of alcohol to alleviate these unwanted intrusions. I don't want to condone it, but it works for me. When I don't drink I have all kinds of sleep disturbance and nightmares and sleep paralysis etc.



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