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Non-Extraterrestrial UFO Hypotheses

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posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 09:01 AM
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But, it could simply be that we have been psychically projecting archetypes of the collective unconscious onto stars and planets for ages, and they, like mirrors, are reflecting our projections back at us.

👣




posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 09:07 AM
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a reply to: Tangerine

Thanks, I don't see this aspect of the subject discussed nearly enough on these boards for my taste. I happen to be mostly in the same camp as Vallee, Keel and others mentioned and also feel that the so called trickster phenomena is at work here.

I believe that the UFO phenomena is just a different manifestation of something larger, just out of sight and just beyond our comprehension. I've seen a "craft" in the sky in broad daylight that just disappeared into thin air. In my childhood home I also experienced terrible "ghostly" manifestations. I find that most of the people that I speak with on the subject that have one experience usually have experiences in other manifestations of strangeness as well.

I think that Vallee's idea of a control system is valid, but I'm not sure whether or not the control is the objective or just a by product of what the 'thing' behind it is. I am not a proponent of the collective unconscious school and archetypes to me don't seem to hold that kind of power. I think whatever is behind 'all this' is exterior to us although we can interact with it and at some times it even seems that we have power to manipulate it, though I think this is just illusion.

Anyway, thanks for posting, I will enjoy reading everyone else's thoughts on the matter.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 10:49 AM
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This is going to be a rather abstract and personal response, so taking from it what you will.

I've always felt a parallel worlds or multiple dimensions explanation for UFO's and the abduction phenomenon were just as valid an explanation as extraterrestrials - due to my own experiences.

When I was a child and would sleep walk and have night terrors - it was never assumed by my family that people from outer space were flying down with their spaceships, taking me for a few hours and returning me.

No... the answer was always fairies. LOL. No joke. It was the mythos that fit with my families eclectic upbringing. Psychic ability in way of dream precognition, telepathy, and empathy was a given set of skills you might be born with. Demonic possession, ghosts, and the such. It was a given that it could happen. Rare sure. But possible. God in all it's multitudes of beings here - cannot match the multitudes of beings we don't know about and can't even see that exist... right along side of us everywhere.

These were basic thoughts and contemplations instilled in me since I was a child. It never occurred to me either, even after I saw my two first UFO's when I was a teenager/young adult... it still didn't occur to me that they could be anything other than something inexplicably connected to not only the earth itself - but us humans to.

Mainly, because in one sighting - I saw how the craft disappeared. It didn't go up and out into space like so many other people say they witness. It collapsed in on itself and seemed to swallow itself up inside it's own black hole and - blink, out of this existence it went. Where or when it went to... I could not see.

Now what struck me about those first two sightings, was the occult things I was involved in during that time. The synchronicity of the events correlated so closely - that I have little doubt my UFO experiences had everything to do with occult ritual I was at play with in group conscious energy. You get eight or nine people together to focus their energy on one goal, and stuff gets 'spooky'. We poked the control system - and it poked back saying - okay NOW I SEE YOU. Back off or things are going to get really scary.

A four hour missing time episode shared with a friend, a few months later... that was the final nail in the coffin to my traveling down the path I was on then. Things got - really scary. And that's how I viewed the UFO's. Messengers of warning, to walk away - no run. Now. I guess the large orbs of light, about the size of a truck, suspended in air - were more angels. To me. Than UFO's. Even though on one of the two occasions, I got out of the chevette and ran all the way up to the house and burst in telling my mother, "I just saw a UFO! Mom, get up." LOL.

But never - once did it occur to me that it might be - extraterrestrial. It was always, at least then, from my perspective then - firmly entrenched in earthly matters stretching across realities that were separated, and the other side would do absolutely anything - anything at all - to bring that separating veil to come crashing down. To re-align our separated realities or at the very least - create a doorway or window to traverse through freely. I always, for the longest time - understood that personal truth for myself. That that was what they gained - from their side working with us paltry little risk takers entrenched in the narcissism of youth. What their goal - what they were tirelessly working at - was to make what is ours - theirs too. In the back of my mind - I still know that to be true. It's the only thing I personally perceived through my experiences that caused me to walk away, and I walked away knowing - if I every went back into that world it would be to fight, close energy vortexes, banish and thwart any and every attempt they try to make.

Now when the waters became muddied...I'm not sure. With entrenching myself in the UFO lore, I saw many many similarities. It fits. It clicks. I'm in love with the romanticism of the AA theory. The idea of space brothers, our benefactors to existence out there always poised to save us. It's an attractive story. Again - a common myth theme we are conditioned to find attractive. But it doesn't correlate with what I perceived when I was in the thick of my youthful escapades in paranormal experience. I perceived - something else. Not extraterrestrial. I perceived archetypes that were ancient and had a very real basis on the mythology man has crafted so painstakingly over and over and over again throughout millennia. But not only connected to us and our perceptions, but very connected with the Earth itself.

But UFOlogy muddies the waters. What could be perceived- rightly so as a pixie - gray spindly creature with huge black almond shaped eyes, standing two to four feet tall like a child - now is a grey alien - no longer of elves, gnomes and fairies. The Djinn or 'demons' with their anthropomorphized snake likeness (for your subconsciousness to signify danger - stay away from this being) - suddenly becomes reptilian aliens... Angels - bright lights in the sky to signify to you to pay attention to your surroundings and what people are doing in your life around you - now is a spacecraft filled with beings from another world with unclear motives....

Somehow... I feel we're losing something here... believing these things to be apart from us... anyone else?

Anyhow... are we sure we are not just saying the say damn thing under a new 'mythos' and there is nothing inherently wrong about that. About our propensity to do that to this same phenomenon we don't understand and have been experiencing since our ancestral beginnings? Obviously. We have the myth and lore to confirm it. It's all just variations of the same concepts, archetypes, and fables.

The difference today is - where we turn to get our answers from. So we look to people who are scientists and researchers in 'fields' to tell us what's what and give us the hypothesis's and what if's - instead of your tribal shaman. Or your spiritual teacher - whomever that may be. That's what's changed. So we create sciences to explore and poke at that control system and peer at it's inner makings and beyond it - any you know what....

What I fear is that eventually that wall - separating us from them/it - there from here... eventually it's going to come tumbling down. If anything can do it - crack the code to the control system - science can do it. And then don't say the texts - all the myths and legends and ancestral knowledge passed down for thousands of years - didn't warn us - what happens when when two worlds collide.

CdT


edit on 20-2-2015 by CirqueDeTruth because: eta



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 02:44 PM
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originally posted by: Kandinsky
a reply to: Tangerine

What does extraterrestrial even mean?



For purposes of this thread, the extraterrestrial hypothesis refers to purely physical beings from other than earth visiting earth via spacecraft and includes ancient aliens, breakaway civilizations, etc.. Also, strictly speaking, advanced technology need not be extraterrestrial, and as yet undiscovered purely physical beings living on planet earth are not extraterrestrial, they are not topics appropriate for this thread. In other words, that to which 99% of the discussion in the U.S. about UFOs is devoted is not an appropriate topic for this thread. This is a thread for discussing non-physical hypotheses about UFOs. I hope this explanation helps clarify.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 02:51 PM
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originally posted by: ZetaRediculian
posted by: TrueMessiah


...WHERE'S YOUR TESTABLE EVIDENCE FOR THIS?




I was wondering how long it would take for this comment to appear. But really the evidence for all non ET type explanations is in all the threads where there is no evidence for ET! All we really get are assertions and stories to back up those assertions. Just link any random thread in the forum and we can observe. There is your testable evidence for a mythology


It was an attempt to derail the thread. Please don't take the bait. This thread is devoted entirely to non-physical hypotheses about UFOs and, as such, there are no claims of fact to be tested.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 02:53 PM
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originally posted by: BlueMule
Lately I've been pondering something. What if some stars and planets are alive? What if they are hyper-psychic?

As I'm sure you all know, consciousness transcends time and space. The psychic projections of a star would not be limited to the speed of light. Suppose they are reaching out with their minds, and we perceive their psychophysical projections in symbolic, mythological form? Forms that we can comprehend? Forms that can alternate between the physical and the non-physical?

That would explain any statistical correlation between UFOs and sidereal time, and it would explain why their form keeps changing from culture to culture, age to age, until finally we arrive at the form of ET. And why they are so bizarre and elusive.

In any case, the days of Little Green Men from Mars are over.

👣



That's a very interesting take on the phenomenon. Thanks for bringing it up. Would you care to expand on it?



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 02:56 PM
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originally posted by: wtbengineer
a reply to: Tangerine

Thanks, I don't see this aspect of the subject discussed nearly enough on these boards for my taste. I happen to be mostly in the same camp as Vallee, Keel and others mentioned and also feel that the so called trickster phenomena is at work here.

I believe that the UFO phenomena is just a different manifestation of something larger, just out of sight and just beyond our comprehension. I've seen a "craft" in the sky in broad daylight that just disappeared into thin air. In my childhood home I also experienced terrible "ghostly" manifestations. I find that most of the people that I speak with on the subject that have one experience usually have experiences in other manifestations of strangeness as well.

I think that Vallee's idea of a control system is valid, but I'm not sure whether or not the control is the objective or just a by product of what the 'thing' behind it is. I am not a proponent of the collective unconscious school and archetypes to me don't seem to hold that kind of power. I think whatever is behind 'all this' is exterior to us although we can interact with it and at some times it even seems that we have power to manipulate it, though I think this is just illusion.

Anyway, thanks for posting, I will enjoy reading everyone else's thoughts on the matter.


Welcome to the discussion. You're certainly not alone is suspecting that UFO phenomena is a manifestation of something larger, just out of sight and just beyond our comprehension. Perhaps that's why people who devote a lot of time delving into this topic come to feel like they're in a hall of mirrors. It's a very slippery subject and a good example of liminality: betwixt and between--neither here nor there.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:06 PM
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a reply to: CirqueDeTruth

Thank you for your insights. I, too, have had experiences that were certainly woo-woo but never felt like they were coming from "out there". Vallee talks a great deal about the similarities between faerie encounters/abductions and modern-day UFO encounter/abduction stories. Have you read any of his work? Patrick Harpur has interesting insights, too. His book Daimonic Reality is well worth reading.

I especially like your take on the anthropomorphized snake likeness of djinn or demons as our subconscious warning us of their dangerous nature. First-rate!



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:11 PM
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originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: ZetaRediculian
posted by: TrueMessiah


...WHERE'S YOUR TESTABLE EVIDENCE FOR THIS?




I was wondering how long it would take for this comment to appear. But really the evidence for all non ET type explanations is in all the threads where there is no evidence for ET! All we really get are assertions and stories to back up those assertions. Just link any random thread in the forum and we can observe. There is your testable evidence for a mythology


It was an attempt to derail the thread. Please don't take the bait. This thread is devoted entirely to non-physical hypotheses about UFOs and, as such, there are no claims of fact to be tested.


No it wasn't.
Aren't tales of abductions and first hand witness accounts of sightings "assertions and stories" so to speak as well?



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:24 PM
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a reply to: Tangerine

I've been pondering it on and off since I came across this.

Star Consciousness: An Alternative to Dark Matter

Stars are considered to be conscious entities maintaining their galactic position by their volition. Mind-over-matter.

We all know how closely tied the UFO phenomenon is to parapsychological phenomena. And we know psi is a feature of consciousness, therefore not limited to humanity. A conscious, psychic star or planet could conceivably control matter and energy on Earth in order to create a temporary body for itself. Or could project itself into a person or animal.

I don't consider this the most likely explanation. But in a panpsychic reality, something like that would probably be inevitable.

👣



edit on 934Friday000000America/ChicagoFeb000000FridayAmerica/Chicago by BlueMule because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:24 PM
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originally posted by: TrueMessiah

originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: ZetaRediculian
posted by: TrueMessiah


...WHERE'S YOUR TESTABLE EVIDENCE FOR THIS?




I was wondering how long it would take for this comment to appear. But really the evidence for all non ET type explanations is in all the threads where there is no evidence for ET! All we really get are assertions and stories to back up those assertions. Just link any random thread in the forum and we can observe. There is your testable evidence for a mythology


It was an attempt to derail the thread. Please don't take the bait. This thread is devoted entirely to non-physical hypotheses about UFOs and, as such, there are no claims of fact to be tested.


No it wasn't.
Aren't tales of abductions and first hand witness accounts of sightings "assertions and stories" so to speak as well?


This isn't a thread for discussing physical abductions or sightings of entirely material objects. This isn't a thread for discussing 99% of the things that consume most of the UFO threads. As such, the things we're discussing here can't be measured and tested by science. Of course if you want to discuss abductions and sightings as non-physical events, that would be on topic and your thoughts would be welcome.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:27 PM
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originally posted by: BlueMule
a reply to: Tangerine

I've been pondering it on and off since I came across this.

Star Consciousness: An Alternative to Dark Matter

Stars are considered to be conscious entities maintaining their galactic position by their volition. Mind-over-matter.

We all know how closely tied the UFO phenomenon is to parapsychological phenomena. And we know psi is a feature of consciousness, therefore not limited to humanity. A conscious, psychic star could conceivably control matter and energy on Earth in order to create a temporary body for itself. Or could project itself into a person or animal.

I don't consider this the most likely explanation. But in a panpsychic reality, something like that would probably be inevitable.

👣


I think it's a perfectly good idea. Might not the earth be conscious, too? Heck, messing with us psychologically might be the earth's hobby.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:39 PM
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I'm sure many here have seen this article by John Keel or know the story but for anyone who hasn't this is very interesting:



But the man responsible for the most well-known of all such modern myths - flying saucers - has somehow been forgotten. Before the first flying saucer was sighted in 1947, he suggested the idea to the American public. Then he converted UFO reports from what might have been a Silly Season phenomenon into a subject, and kept that subject alive during periods of total public disinterest. His name was Raymond A. Palmer.


The Man Who Invented Flying Saucers.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:40 PM
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In a PM to me, someone raised the topic of feeling uneasy discussing UFO-type experiences, not in the sense of being embarrassed but, rather, the nature of the experience produced uneasiness and recalling it does, too. It occurred to me that we have comfort zones and experiences outside of those comfort zones make most of us feel uneasy. I had a bad fall that resulted in a serious injury and now, if I even momentarily start to lose balance climbing over something while, for example, hiking, I experience a queasy sensation that's quite unsettling. This response to being out of our comfort zones might explain the uneasiness some people experience during UFO-type experiences. In other words, fear, fogginess, and the dream-like, drugged-like state might not be caused directly by the experience but indirectly by our out-of-our-comfort-zones psychological response to the situation. What do you think?



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:40 PM
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a reply to: CirqueDeTruth

What I fear is that eventually that wall - separating us from them/it - there from here... eventually it's going to come tumbling down. If anything can do it - crack the code to the control system - science can do it.

I'm not sure I would be too worried about that. First science has to crack the code for consciousness and before that, they have to define it! Essentially I am thinking we a hard wired for these experiences and the telling of them. I think it will always just be out of reach.


what happens when when two worlds collide.

I think you meet your doppelganger?


(post by BlueMule removed for a serious terms and conditions violation)

posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:45 PM
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originally posted by: DelMarvel
I'm sure many here have seen this article by John Keel or know the story but for anyone who hasn't this is very interesting:



But the man responsible for the most well-known of all such modern myths - flying saucers - has somehow been forgotten. Before the first flying saucer was sighted in 1947, he suggested the idea to the American public. Then he converted UFO reports from what might have been a Silly Season phenomenon into a subject, and kept that subject alive during periods of total public disinterest. His name was Raymond A. Palmer.


The Man Who Invented Flying Saucers.


I wonder why we were so receptive to his stories that they imbedded themselves in our collective psyche. As Keel's article mentions, Ivan Sanderson started the Bigfoot ball rolling. What is it about our psyches that some stories find a permanent home and others don't stick?



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:48 PM
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I continually come back to the Jung book.

A big part of that is the very strange and unexplainable perceptions of synchronicity I experienced while obsessed with the topic of UFOs which also has been discussed by other researchers. This was connected to my own personal spiritual history so it felt to me like a psychological and/or spiritual event and it had nothing to do with the perception of any "aliens." Just the same as many of those who have seen UFOs feel that what they saw was without question physical reality I feel like these experiences must have been paranormal even though that is outside my present paradigm. On the other hand I realize it was subjective reality and there could possibly be other explanations.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:49 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 




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edit on 2/20/2015 by Zaphod58 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 03:52 PM
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originally posted by: Tangerine

I wonder why we were so receptive to his stories that they imbedded themselves in our collective psyche. As Keel's article mentions, Ivan Sanderson started the Bigfoot ball rolling. What is it about our psyches that some stories find a permanent home and others don't stick?


That fits right in with the Jungian archetype theory. Universal ideas or symbols that are somehow part of the human psyche. So the stories that connect with those gain mythic power while those that don't do not.



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