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The UK Injustice System... & My Friends Dilemma!

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posted on Feb, 19 2015 @ 05:17 PM
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Little bit pissed.


Need answers.


Google is useless for such a scenario.




My friend is in Court tomorrow...

The charges irrelevant.


They have Mental Health issues...

Legal Aid was delayed further, again...

They have been told they have to represent themselves in Court...




Pissed? Why?


Where does someone with Mental Health stand in the UK Injustice System when they're expected to represent themselves in Court...
Even when they're not fully Compos Mentis...

How can someone who is vulnerable be thrown to the Lions in a so called Democracy...



All I could find online;
www.mind.org.uk...


Page 9-10 of the PDF mention the "Unfit To Plea" circumstance...

But it's pretty vague...




Doesn't say how an "Unfit To Plea" is put forward...

Before the Trial...?
At the start of the Trial...?
At the end of the Trial after my friend has been bullied on the stand by a liars representatives...?




I'd appreciate any wisdom ATS has in such a situation.
Bear in mind this is in UK, & involves Mental Health...

So it may have to come from UK members who also know about Mental Health.


State Laws and Supreme Court rulings will be unlikely to help.



Thanks in advance.




posted on Feb, 19 2015 @ 05:48 PM
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Why don't you represent him and present the plea on his behalf.

The plea will need to be given, when it's asked for. I'm guessing the court will then ask for a report on the extent of your friend's mental health issues.



posted on Feb, 19 2015 @ 06:12 PM
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a reply to: Cobaltic1978

I also have a history of Mental Health issues Cobaltic...

It'd be like shooting fish in a barrel for the prosecution.




All of my friends Mental Health details were already handed to the Lawyers who were supposed to represent them...

& I'm guessing to the prosecution and the Court...



I guess we'll have to find out in the morning how this works.





posted on Feb, 19 2015 @ 06:14 PM
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a reply to: CharlieSpeirs
A person cannot be forced to represent themself in UK court.
They can be sent to court and have to ask the magistrate to adjourn until legel representation can be provided.
That is what your friend should do IMO.



posted on Feb, 19 2015 @ 06:16 PM
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a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

Well, my reading of the section of the document you linked to, which deals with Unfit to Plead circumstances, appears to suggest that in the event of your friend being incapable of representing him , or herself, and at the same time not being able to select and instruct a legal professional to operate on their behalf, a person can point out that they are Unfit to Plead, but will have to provide some sort of medical evidence that they are not in possession of the entire contents of their collection of marbles, so to speak.

In short, if one is of unsound mind, one can make the judge or ejudicating body aware of that, and they may require to have one examined, or gain access to ones records of treatment and pre-existing mental conditions. This is different from being a plea of Diminished Responsibility of course, because there is no admission of guilt implied in suggesting that one is not fit to be involved in ones own defense in court, and besides, Diminished Responsiblity (which can only be used as a defense in a murder case anyway, and is therefore moot) is a DEFENSE not a statement of inability to interact with the proceedings which are afoot.

The Unfit to Plead route seems like a good option, if there are no other options on the table. It is a shame that there are so few hours remaining to you, and to your friend, to deal with the annoyance of figuring out what paperwork, medical history wise, is required. Perhaps, before going to court, it might be wise to get some documentation from your friends doctor, or psychologist, therapist, or case worker if they have any of those. The documentation will probably need to detail the conditions your friend suffers from, and contain a signed statement to the effect that the professional in question believes that your friend is not capable of entering a plea.

That might help.

Other than that, I know not what else to say! I wish we had more time to poke around some case studies, and find out more about how these Unfit to Plead instances play out in court, and what measures a judge tends to apply or require in order to ensure that the person who calls for it, is actually in such a state as to need that sort of coverage.

I wish you and your friend the very best of luck. May the sails of liberty billow full on a strong breeze!


edit on 19-2-2015 by TrueBrit because: Spelling error removed.



posted on Feb, 19 2015 @ 06:20 PM
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a reply to: Silcone Synapse

Thanks Silcone, I thought as much.


The Lawyers didn't relay this alternative to my friend and left them in a frantic state of mind.

I've tried to reassure them they can't force anybody, let alone someone with Mental Health issues...


Appreciate the insight.




posted on Feb, 19 2015 @ 06:24 PM
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originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: Cobaltic1978

I also have a history of Mental Health issues Cobaltic...

It'd be like shooting fish in a barrel for the prosecution.




All of my friends Mental Health details were already handed to the Lawyers who were supposed to represent them...

& I'm guessing to the prosecution and the Court...



I guess we'll have to find out in the morning how this works.




Keep us posted, hopefully if Silicone Synapse is right, which I am sure he is. He will be given time for legal representation to be afforded to him.



posted on Feb, 19 2015 @ 06:27 PM
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a reply to: TrueBrit

Thanks TrueBrit...


I was happy to find the link...

Mind are usually always aware of what to do in pretty much any Mental Health situation so I was sure I'd find something in relation to a Trial with them...


I'm not too sure if my friend has the documentation at hand...

I know they did, because they had to give it to the Lawyers during legal advice sessions because it was always going to be part of the not guilty plea...

A change of medication lead to the incident at hand and they were not in the right state of mind at all.

It was also relevant info for Legal Aid...


Thing is, I'm not sure if the documents signed by their Consultant and GP detailing their history and aversion to the newer medication were duplicates, or the only copies...


I will have to find out in the morning, & gather them together if there is copies available to present to whoever is in charge...
Magistrate if I remember correctly.




Thank you for the well wishes buddy!


Much appreciated!




edit on 19-2-2015 by CharlieSpeirs because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 19 2015 @ 06:29 PM
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a reply to: Cobaltic1978

Definitely matey...


That was my initial thinking, it was harder to convince my friend of that.


Thanks!




posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 04:00 AM
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What type of court?

That would help, as there are differences in how they work.

Criminal or civil?

Magistrates or County?

Regards



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 04:11 AM
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I once represented myself in court.....ended up getting barred from every licensed premises in York city centre for life.
It was a few years ago.

I firmly advise against your friend representing himself unless he has substantial legal experience.

And as has been said, no-one can be forced to do so, there should be a Duty Solicitor who can both advise and represent.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 04:58 AM
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Thanks Paraphi & Freeborn it's all moot now the case was thrown out!

By the prosecution!!!



The liar didn't turn up to make his fraudulent case.



My friend gave their name address & DOB and that was the end of it...



Thanks for the input everyone.





posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 05:12 AM
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a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

Has your friend the opportunity to provide a proof of some sort that he already got treated for mental issues ?
This is - here in Belgium - the easiest way to avoid a trial or jail : when diagnosed with mental disability you are dealing with specialized centers rather than common judicial institutions.

 


Seems I arrived too late for a constructive input ... Glad to hear that your friend got away without further annoyance than some wasted time ...




edit on 20-2-2015 by theultimatebelgianjoke because: filled out



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 06:10 AM
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a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

Fantastic!

I am very pleased to hear it. Nothing is quite so alarming as facing injustice first hand.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 06:42 AM
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a reply to: TrueBrit

Thanks buddy... There is nothing worse than screw ups in the Justice System...

I'm relieved for my friend...

They deserve a break!





posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 06:47 AM
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a reply to: theultimatebelgianjoke

Thanks Ultimate...

Much appreciated!


As for your initial input, it's difficult how it works in the UK, with two types of plea under a similar bracket;

1) Unfit to plead
2) Insanity


1) is basically leads to an assessment and most likely a drop in charges but with a 6 month section on a mental ward...

2) can still lead to being found guilty and sentenced to time in prison...



There is a few "in betweens" with Mental Health cases too.



posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 09:12 AM
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a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

Glad to hear its worked out well for your friend.
Sounds like a real hassle to be put through.





posted on Feb, 20 2015 @ 01:09 PM
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a reply to: Silcone Synapse

Thanks matey.


It has been, 7 months of worry...

30 seconds of exchange lifted the weight of the World off their shoulders.









 
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