If you become nothing, does that make you sad?

a reply to: droid56

I personally think we are eternal.

The problem I have is trying to find an example of non existence to accept the fact we cease to exist. What does that even mean in the context of the universe? We know things in the universe change form but what does it mean to cease to exist?

So I personally believe we're eternal just like the universe, matter, energy and information. So either we die and our consciousness still exists in some sort of afterlife or we will die and be reborn again and again and again as the vacuum recreates this universe and other universes over and over again.

So at the end of the day, I think it's impossible for us to die or cease to exist. Do we experience a local death that we perceive as the end? Yes, some people do when they have an egocentric view of reality. I just don't reduce my life and existence to this planet. My life and existence is cosmic so I will die and just like everything else I will change form but not cease to exist.

originally posted by: neoholographic
a reply to: droid56

I personally think we are eternal.

The problem I have is trying to find an example of non existence to accept the fact we cease to exist. What does that even mean in the context of the universe? We know things in the universe change form but what does it mean to cease to exist?

So I personally believe we're eternal just like the universe, matter, energy and information. So either we die and our consciousness still exists in some sort of afterlife or we will die and be reborn again and again and again as the vacuum recreates this universe and other universes over and over again.

So at the end of the day, I think it's impossible for us to die or cease to exist. Do we experience a local death that we perceive as the end? Yes, some people do when they have an egocentric view of reality. I just don't reduce my life and existence to this planet. My life and existence is cosmic so I will die and just like everything else I will change form but not cease to exist.

Therein, the best post in this thread.

I am Immortal, therefor, I am.

It's not sadness I feel, centrally. It's not even the idea there's no recognizable afterlife which bothers me. I think, when I examine it, it's anger I feel. People have to wade through a series of indignities and trials. So much suffering with intermittent periods of calm and then they die. No matter how much some of us try oh so hard to arrive at an optimistic summing up, I think when all the frill and splashy colors are washed away what's left is bitter tasting. It's well remembered for all the flash and bits of glory, but it's not something we'd want to repeat again if given a choice.

Broadly I see us as the same as any creature on Earth. All creatures are going through the same struggle. I believe if the creatures could speak, they'd share a similar story of hardship, love and courage. You'd have an equivalent number of them agreeing and disagreeing with what I just wrote.

Despite what I write above, I still am optimistic at my core. I can write or talk a very unpleasant melody, but for those who're living fully, I support and encourage them. LIfe, when it's good, is rich. I just don't have the viewpoint that there's no possible way to view this life or this world in a negative light. All it needs is an audience, not permission.

a reply to: droid56

At least we won't have to complain about an old bearded pervert in the skies, watching every move with an angel of death over his shoulder nagging about the things we should and should not of done in life.

Then we'd be complaining way more about the manufacturer wanting a recall.

If there's nothing when I die, then I won't be able to mourn my own state of being (or lac thereof), so, if that's what happens, it is what it is. No sense moping about it now in my opinion.

I won't get into details but have before here, that I had a severed aorta from a car wreck 32 years ago and had a Heaven experience. Should of been DOA.

What I remember I have no words for, they all fall short. We live in one grain of sand of knowledge, love, life and truth. There is a desert of grains of sand after this life we become part of. You can remove one grain from a desert and never know it's missing but you cannot make a desert from just one grain.

I believe this world is a beginning to an infinite journey. The choices between good and evil, selfless and selfish, being better or more than others or being part of something greater than yourself, will determine if your journey continues or ends. Heaven is a place where all are together in a love so profound that our understanding of love here is only a shadow of the real thing and doesn't even come close.

Such unity comes from loving and caring about others as much as yourself, loving and appreciating the creator of all that is seen and unseen, and not blaming God for what man has done through free will.

Our brains are an organic computer built to deal with time, space, weight and measurement. Our spirits are immortal and always looking to use our brains to calculate infinite subjects but it falls short not being designed to handle such concepts. We will not truly know until we are free from this world and it's limitations, no longer relying on a brain for our knowledge. We become love, knowledge and truth there, we get really really really really.......BIG!

you are right..!!

I am 42 with a successful career, a good or average family situation and can live life the way I want or I need to make those that matter to me happy and safe .

It's been pretty decent so far and I have a lot of goals left to achieve and things left to enjoy.

Whatever happens when I die will happen but I am not going to spend any of my years on this planet worrying about it. If we die and nothing happens, so be it. If we die and it's like what Matheson wrote in What Dreams May Come then great. For the 80 years or so that we are alive we should try and accomplish everything and anything we can.

originally posted by: neoholographic
a reply to: droid56

I personally think we are eternal.

The problem I have is trying to find an example of non existence to accept the fact we cease to exist. What does that even mean in the context of the universe? We know things in the universe change form but what does it mean to cease to exist?

So I personally believe we're eternal just like the universe, matter, energy and information. So either we die and our consciousness still exists in some sort of afterlife or we will die and be reborn again and again and again as the vacuum recreates this universe and other universes over and over again.

So at the end of the day, I think it's impossible for us to die or cease to exist. Do we experience a local death that we perceive as the end? Yes, some people do when they have an egocentric view of reality. I just don't reduce my life and existence to this planet. My life and existence is cosmic so I will die and just like everything else I will change form but not cease to exist.

I have noticed that it is a recurring human trait to elevate our species so far above and beyond all the other life on the planet, and possibly the universe. Why do most people think that we differ so much from cows, mice, and crickets as to transform us into some eternal god like immortal light entity when we die?

Or do do mice and crickets, and viruses get to live forever in another form as well?

Before we were born, we didn't exist.

I think it takes an enormous amount of self importance to think we are somehow eternal, but apes, dogs, and chickens just die and disapear.

a reply to: droid56

good post. I've pondered eternal nothingness and it used to make me fearful when I was younger. Now I've come to a few thoughts:

1) I was not considered about my non-existence before I was born, so why should I concern myself with any potential non-existence after death?

2) Against all odds, I was born into this world. The likelihood of everything working out perfect to give life is about 1/infinite chance, but luckily for us the universe is infinite. life after death is as likely as life in the first place.

3) Ascent out of this world into the realm of spirit, in which death is avoided.

I'm ok with all options, obviously #3 would be sweet.

originally posted by: Puppylove
If there's nothing when I die, then I won't be able to mourn my own state of being (or lac thereof), so, if that's what happens, it is what it is. No sense moping about it now in my opinion.

That, as I said earlier in the thread, is the essence of Taoism. It is what it is. Welcome to the happy hour of life... drinks are available 24/7 because baby... it is what it is and the only thing we can change is how we deal with it.

I think there has to be something, because there can't be nothing. Our existence can't be based on nothing, we came from something. If you consider quantum physics there is no past, present, or future...it is all happening simultaneously with infinite possibilities.

If we discover there is no life after death, then we would invent some way to live forever. People may stop breeding if they can live forever and during this time there might be an evolutionary change in human beings.

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: neoholographic
a reply to: droid56

I personally think we are eternal.

The problem I have is trying to find an example of non existence to accept the fact we cease to exist. What does that even mean in the context of the universe? We know things in the universe change form but what does it mean to cease to exist?

So I personally believe we're eternal just like the universe, matter, energy and information. So either we die and our consciousness still exists in some sort of afterlife or we will die and be reborn again and again and again as the vacuum recreates this universe and other universes over and over again.

So at the end of the day, I think it's impossible for us to die or cease to exist. Do we experience a local death that we perceive as the end? Yes, some people do when they have an egocentric view of reality. I just don't reduce my life and existence to this planet. My life and existence is cosmic so I will die and just like everything else I will change form but not cease to exist.

I have noticed that it is a recurring human trait to elevate our species so far above and beyond all the other life on the planet, and possibly the universe. Why do most people think that we differ so much from cows, mice, and crickets as to transform us into some eternal god like immortal light entity when we die?

Or do do mice and crickets, and viruses get to live forever in another form as well?

Before we were born, we didn't exist.

I think it takes an enormous amount of self importance to think we are somehow eternal, but apes, dogs, and chickens just die and disapear.

where did the poster say anything about chickens just disappearing? common dude, learn not to insert your own projections into what you read!!!

You got hung up on the word disapearing?

How about commenting on the actual point i was making?

a reply to: Th0r

a reply to: neoholographic

the 'you' whose post i am responding to would cease to exist in any fashion at all. your molecules, atoms, particles wouldnt. but YOU would. and you would never ever return, just like no snowflake is ever made twice.

Im sick to death of this life, not sure i want to live another one.

a reply to: Saylesie17

you're well on your way to true life then:

"Anyone who loves their life will lose it, while anyone who hates their life in this world will keep it for eternal life."

What are you now?
What are you in deep sleep? Do you even know you exist in deep sleep? It is only when the light comes on when waking that you can even know you exist ....................but what do you exist as?
You may think you are a person .......but that is just a thought.
There are thoughts appearing and colours and sounds but are you what is appearing or are you the seer of what appears?
In deep sleep there is nothing and on waking there is a movie made of light appearing.
If no light ever appeared would you even know you exist?
Does what you really are ever appear to exist?

The dream may be experienced but will the dreamer ever be seen?

a reply to: Itisnowagain

Could you be without the body?

a reply to: droid56

It makes sense that we would end up the same way we started; puts a whole "circle of life" spin on it. From nothing to something to nothing again.

For all intents and purposes, there is only one universe. Any theory based on something contrary to that notion is at the least a leap of faith and at most wishful thinking until further evidence comes along, regardless of whether or not there actually is something else out there.

Following from that idea, it becomes pretty simple to conclude that after this, nothing happens (until proven otherwise). Keeping a scientific open mindedness, it is possible that there is something else out there. It just doesn't make any sense to assume there is (particularly when you base your entire life around the idea).

Back to the question, it bothers me no more than the idea that the earth goes around the sun, which is to say not at all.