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Shoot or don't shoot: Police scenarios prove eye-opening for civil rights leaders

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posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 02:45 PM
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“I didn’t even see it,” said the leader of the Houston area Black Panther Party, who was taking part in a training scenario in an attempt to understand what police officers go through during high-pressure situations. “It could have been anything in his hand, and I still would have used force to stop him.


Shoot or don't shoot: Police scenarios prove eye-opening for civil rights leaders

According to an article by Perry Chiaramonte published on Fox News, several civil rights leaders were placed in police scenarios to better understand what police go through during unknown situations.

In one of the scenarios below, we find out how the activist known as Quanell X managed to handle the situation.



A distressed man with a baby in tow was pacing back and forth in a manic state and shouting incoherently. The responding police officer calmly addressed the man in an attempt to calm him down and defuse the situation, but the man suddenly pulled an object from his side and lunged toward the officer. Instinctively, the officer raised his Taser and squeezed the trigger. It turned out the man was armed with a knife, but the "officer," who was actually the firebrand African-American activist known as Quanell X, acknowledged he would have fired whether the assailant had a knife, a spoon or an empty hand.



From all of the accounts of the activists that took place in the training scenario, it gave them a new perspective on how and why police react in the certain ways that they do when facing uncertain situations.


I found this a great article for anyone wanting a look inside the quick decision making needed for police.



edit on 2/12/2015 by EternalSolace because: Clarity




posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 02:48 PM
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I remember a similar story from few weeks back, I'm pretty sure that it's pure propaganda.

Plant a bunch of outspoken anti establishment types, let them rile up a bunch of people and gain public focus, then invite them to see how police situations work. Top it off with a cherry and a side of "OMG, the police where right all along" and you have a nice serving of propaganda pie.
edit on 12-2-2015 by MisterSpock because: (no reason given)

edit on 12-2-2015 by MisterSpock because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:01 PM
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These things should be common knowledge.


It's a good outreach because it brings an understanding to people the community trust....



But........



It's been a while since I heard a case like this, the most recent cases are;

a) someone choked to death for nothing...

b) someone shot before he was given a chance to even react...

c) someone shot because he charged at an officer unarmed...

d) someone shot for standing with a toy gun from a Walmart shelf...

e) someone shot for holding a knife despite already having been subdued...




The Gas Station incident is the only one I can think of that fits the bill.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:01 PM
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originally posted by: MisterSpock
I remember a similar story from few weeks back, I'm pretty sure that it's pure propaganda.

Plant a bunch of outspoken anti establishment types, let them rile up a bunch of people and gain public focus, then invite them to see how police situations work. Top it off with a cherry and a side of "OMG, the police where right all along" and you have a nice serving of propaganda pie.


I can see where one can call anything that questions another point of view propaganda. Everything is always propaganda to someone else.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:03 PM
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originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs


It's been a while since I heard a case like this...



That's because cases like that aren't really 'news' worthy... are they?



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:05 PM
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originally posted by: EternalSolace

originally posted by: MisterSpock
I remember a similar story from few weeks back, I'm pretty sure that it's pure propaganda.

Plant a bunch of outspoken anti establishment types, let them rile up a bunch of people and gain public focus, then invite them to see how police situations work. Top it off with a cherry and a side of "OMG, the police where right all along" and you have a nice serving of propaganda pie.


I can see where one can call anything that questions another point of view propaganda. Everything is always propaganda to someone else.


To me, it just seems like such a perfect scenario. Take a bunch of outspoken activist leaders and feed them a box lunch and run them through some(highly controlled) scenario's in an effort to undermine their criticism.
edit on 12-2-2015 by MisterSpock because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:08 PM
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a reply to: EternalSolace

Depends if you mean spoken about by the Media or spoken about by Civil Rights Activists.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:09 PM
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Untrained citizens put in a situation that requires training.

Doesn't seem like an equal playing ground to me.

Just because a typical citizen might or might not react in a certain way does not compare to a fully trained, well armed, military garbed officer usually accompanied with a number of other similarly outfitted and trained cops in the same situation.

It's their job to assess first, not shoot first.

Peace



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:13 PM
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Yup, if someone pulls something out and lunges for you, you react in self-defense.

But when someone has their hands up in the doorway of their own home, and you open fire to kill the person, and four attending officers assert the man's hands never moved? What's that, then?

Of course, in these scenarios - set up and controlled by the police - every scenario will be perfectly black and white. The goal is to defend their position that they have to be free to kill and maim and break as many people as they want, without oversight, control, or penalty.
edit on 12-2-2015 by TheTengriist because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 03:19 PM
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I found it more exciting to see people trying to understand another perspective.

Now how do the LEO see the other perspective?



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 04:43 PM
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Error
edit on 12-2-2015 by MisterSpock because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 04:47 PM
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a reply to: MisterSpock

I get that anything that doesn't fit a certain agenda MUST be propaganda.



However, it was less than 2 months ago that when the results of this same exercise done by police were revealed, the results were similar and all these same liberal voices were screaming that it was proof of police racism.

Some people need to learn to admit when their wrong, apologize, and move on.

HA ha, lol, I meant to say "scream propaganda when your race cards are all played out".



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 04:50 PM
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originally posted by: jude11
Untrained citizens put in a situation that requires training.

Doesn't seem like an equal playing ground to me.

Just because a typical citizen might or might not react in a certain way does not compare to a fully trained, well armed, military garbed officer usually accompanied with a number of other similarly outfitted and trained cops in the same situation.

It's their job to assess first, not shoot first.

Peace


All the training in the world doesn't help when put into a position where a split second call has to be made. It doesn't matter who you are, where you came from, or how well you're trained, you're going to do what you need to do in an attempt to survive.

Rookie cop's body-camera records the horrifying moment a man pulled a gun on him and shot him dead... just moments after they chatted amicably
edit on 2/12/2015 by EternalSolace because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 05:37 PM
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originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
These things should be common knowledge.


It's a good outreach because it brings an understanding to people the community trust....



But........



It's been a while since I heard a case like this, the most recent cases are;

a) someone choked to death for nothing...

b) someone shot before he was given a chance to even react...

c) someone shot because he charged at an officer unarmed...

d) someone shot for standing with a toy gun from a Walmart shelf...

e) someone shot for holding a knife despite already having been subdued...




The Gas Station incident is the only one I can think of that fits the bill.


Individual situations require individual analysis and the police clearly over-react at times. However, when someone charges at a police officer the officer is entitled to protect himself/herself. Wal-Mart sells real guns, as far as I know. How would the officer know that the toy gun is not a real gun? Does he wait until the trigger has been pulled? Did he order the person to drop the gun and was the order obeyed? Was the toy gun pointed at him or another person? How was the knife-holding person already subdued if he was still holding the knife?



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 05:37 PM
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ALSO why I cannot be a cop.
My reflexes ARE to fire.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 05:47 PM
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They have shown that an untrained black panther member is not the best person to use in a crazy father acting manic with a child situation.

Now its been used as a peice of .........


Propaganda is a form of communication aimed towards influencing the attitude of a population toward some cause or position. Propaganda is information that is not impartial and used primarily to influence an audience and further an agenda, often by presenting facts selectively (perhaps lying by omission) to encourage a particular synthesis, or using loaded messages to produce an emotional rather than a rational response to the information presented.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 05:55 PM
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a reply to: Tangerine

We'll differ on this until the cows come home so I'll discuss your last example.


It was a she, not a he...

17 years old.


Quite a few threads about it as well.

She had already been taken down, and inbetween that moment and being filled with lead from around 3 officers, there is a bit of a blank as to what happened.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 06:30 PM
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These officers are trained to react as though they're in active war zones- Everything they don't fully understand is out to kill them.
Remember when officers carried six shooters, and were there to help?

Funny how things go full circle in the end. They act like they're a target everywhere they go- and now in some places that's starting to be the case.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 07:34 PM
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My word is this "effort" is a shockingly stupid simplification which leads to nothing meaningful at all. Take those same guys and put them in a harness working on high tension powerlines and they won't be able to do that either. Take them an put them in with a live Lion in a circus ring and they won't be able to deal with that either. Take them into an NFL game and put them in as the starting quarterback and they won't be able to deal with that either - George Plimpton couldn't.

This kind of exercise proves nothing. Nothing at all. In fact in only serves those who figure the police created policy of kill or be killed is fine because the common man can't see how dangerous it is in the streets everyday and can't make decisions in PRE CREATED SCENARIOS designed to simulate the worst situation possible. "These guys are putting their lives on the line every day for our safety," is the PR machine created meme that not only justifies the actions of the cop but the merits of this asinine exercise. The so called "civil rights leaders" are complete idiots, total morons with not one bit of common sense at all - idiots.

1. The police do NOT work for you. They work for the state.
2. The police are not their to protect you at all, they have no moral, legal or contractual, or constitutional obligation to lift a finger to help you - ever!
3. The police are there to protect the assets of the state - period.
4. The police only exist when a population believes leaving their house is the most dangerous thing they can do, then, and only then, can the moronic population be be sold a self-policing police force who's true reason for existence is hidden in the PR campaign that was used to hire them.

What is shocking to me is the inability of people to reconcile the lies they were told about the police as children with the reality they see in front of them. The police KILL people on their town, collect taxes, act like thugs and lie, lie, lie yet they same citizens keep insisting on believing the police force is a kind, benevolent system of community support.

The reality is in the actions, not the propaganda that was used to justify the existence of the neighborhood wardens/slave managers. The police are required to justify their job, crime and terrorist type actions are the only thing that justifies their job, ergo: they need crime that can only be dealt with by the police's special forces training. So these idiots who partook in this educational sham just gave the police force a brand new PR event to demonstrate why the high school dropouts with middling IQ's and loyalty to no one but each other need RPG's to protect their wards from the evils of society.



posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 11:07 PM
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I don't condone murder. That's my stance. They have non-lethal weapons to use on people with knives, rocks, or running away. If they persist on shooting people, they are going to get shot themselves. It's only the reaction to that action. The # is getting out of hand. If you are scared to do your job or think you might have a problem jumping the gun, please don't make law enforcement your career.

Common sense goes a long way. There should never be one solo police officer doing anything. They need backup and it's for the safety of both sides. Start sending them back to retrain when thy screw up. That deterrent alone will make them use more common sense. If they get sent three times, they are done in law enforcement. Hold them accountable for their actions. That's the problem I'm having with the bad cops. There are many officers who do use common sense and the stupid just make it harder for them to do the job.

I don't even know why I'm offering any solutions. If they really cared, they would have done it themselves already. That means their actions are less than honorable, right up to the top. There is something deeper to this problem, that's for sure. There is a reason that the last few years have been violent.

I guess tasers, pepper spray, and bean bag shotguns are hard to use for some of these bastards. Make them pay for the wrong they do so the next person thinks twice about the ramifications of their actions. There is truly no justice anymore.




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