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Opposing the Ancient Astronaut Theory: Religion & Mythology

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posted on Feb, 10 2015 @ 09:06 PM
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a reply to: the2ofusr1

Hello the2ofusr1, May Peace be with you. I've never looked into the work of Michael Heiser, thank you for the reference.

 



"His lecture on the council of God and (elohim) really takes away the confusion in scripture. elohim could be better understood as beings of the heavenly realm including the creator God."


Just as the op discussed that the word "Anunna" (Anunnaki) may refer to an individual deity or the pantheon in general, I believe that the word "Elohim" also shares this plurality of meaning. I have concluded that "Elohim" is a word that must be understood in the direct context of its specific usage:

"Elohim" Tense and Usage

• Singular, Proper: El

• Plural, Proper: Divine Council

• Plural, Improper: Assembly (Pantheon) of the Gods

Is this on par with Mr. Heiser's conclusions?

 



"The tower of Babel incident while creating the nations also gave the 70 in the council something to do on earth imo."


This correlates to the "70 Sons of El" of the Canaanite religious systems.

 



"Heiser also has a good lecture on the two powers in heaven that was well known and taught pre 100 AD in Judaism."


Would this be the struggle between the worshippers of El (Elohists, Elism) versus the worshippers of Yahweh (Jahwists, Yahwists)?



edit on 2/10/15 by Sahabi because: (no reason given)




posted on Feb, 10 2015 @ 09:44 PM
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a reply to: Sahabi

thanks!!! beautiful posts!!
i like the colorful pics, and also writings too, they're quite simple and easy to read.

peace
edit on 10-2-2015 by dodol because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 10 2015 @ 10:10 PM
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Fantastic read. I'll be looking into the previous thread as well.


Boba



posted on Feb, 10 2015 @ 10:36 PM
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originally posted by: Aliensun
a reply to: Sahabi

I suggest that you direct your considerable abilities to collect and organize data to investigate the so-called "cargo cults" and attempt to understand much of what you suggest in that new light which does promote intelligent intervention into early earth's civilizations.


May Peace be with you Aliensun.

The phenomenon of "Cargo Cults" does not shine new light onto the attempts of my understandings. After all, many A.A. theorists have repeatedly suggested that much of our ancient culture and/or knowledge was obtained, observed, and copied from extraterrestrials by our ancestors.

Unlike the example of the cargo cults, the qualities and gifts of the gods are regionally localized,... not foreign and unattainable. The astronomical knowledge of our priestly ancestors is from the perspective of generational earth-born sky-watchers,... not that of a broader interstellar/intergalactic context. The mathematics and architecture demonstrated by the ancients is the same found in the natural world, of which is perfectly compatible with human mental capacity,... it is not the supreme knowledge of omniscient beings. The cosmological origin mythologies are philosophical and theoretical in nature,... not absolute truths from a pansophic perspective.

There is evidence in the collective gene pool that suggests several near extinction events (genetic bottlenecks) have been endured by mankind. There is evidence of the extinction of intelligent and tool-using archaic human-hominids. There is evidence of ruined, destroyed, forgotten, and submerged ancient cities.

We can sum this up by saying; Mankind has risen and fallen more than once.

 


Bottlenecks Made Humans Less Diverse

Evidenc e That Two Main Bottleneck Events Shaped Modern Human Genetic Diversity



posted on Feb, 10 2015 @ 10:58 PM
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a reply to: Sahabi

Wow. What an awesome thread. Thanks!

Some of us AAT supporters have already knew of this (or at least I hope so?). Of course most "gods" are clearly not extraterrestrials. And of course men were good with building things.

Still there are few unanswered questions. There are many good threads on this supporting AAT.



posted on Feb, 10 2015 @ 11:29 PM
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originally posted by: EzeqeelNOCH
a reply to: Sahabi

Thank you for the truth you have supplied Sahabi...wisdom beyond words!


I am but a meandering fool in wonder of my wandering


 



As my work is in direct correlation with your own, and only help to sanctify your claims..
..would it be destiny we should meet completing a quest hidden amongst the passages of time!?!


It would appear as though all of existence has converged just to sustain this very moment, thus positively affirming your inquiry.

 



To restore a One Nation Existence with the ways of the ancient's in perpetual balance with Nature.


Oh what sweet intent! My Peace be with you my brother.



posted on Feb, 10 2015 @ 11:35 PM
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originally posted by: templar knight
WOW - Can I add to this list - Archimedes in 250BC suggesting that you could work out the volume of a sphere based on splitting the sphere into infitessimal blocks (Calculus by any other name), Eratosthenes in 200BC calculating the circumference of the Earth within 97%. And there was Thornborough Henge built between 3500BC and 2500BC and aligned to Orions belt (even before the pyramids).




Hello templar knight. Yes, feel free to add whatever you feel is relevant. Thank you for the wonderful examples you have shared with us! Peace



posted on Feb, 10 2015 @ 11:47 PM
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Thank you very much fenian8, Iamthatbish, Tangerine, LightAssassin, dodol, and Bobaganoosh!

 


Deaf Alien, although we may disagree regarding the legitimacy of the A.A. theory, I am moved by and applaud your kind words of support



posted on Feb, 11 2015 @ 03:38 AM
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a reply to: Sahabi




I believe life "out there" in the universe is the norm, and that extraterrestrial life has never contacted us in our prehistoric or ancient past.


I would like to hear your reasoning for assuming that, if you don't mind.


Even if we accept that this entire thread is true...does it exclude extraterrestrial visitations ?

If we were to entertain a notion that we are being visited...and have been in the past...I suspect that much of this activity would be very well hidden from us. The alleged alien abductions, the UFO sightings and all that...might just be a tip of the iceberg, a puzzle from a much much bigger story...and we're only allowed to see a fraction of it...without understanding.

Of course, it's all speculation...but we're not talking evidence here...nor can you really prove that all of the OOPArts is just human ingenuity...long forgotten.



posted on Feb, 11 2015 @ 05:21 AM
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a reply to: MarioOnTheFly

Welcome back MarioOnTheFly, I'm glad you've returned to the discussion.


"I would like to hear your reasoning for assuming that, if you don't mind."


I believe in the ancient hidden and/or lost advanced knowledge of mankind, firstly, because it is the most reasonable conclusion that makes the least amount of assumptions.

For example, in this post of the preceding thread, I highlighted some examples of how Communication, Architecture, Agriculture, Farming, Tool Usage, Inventiveness, and Culture is an innate quality of conscious life, which our animal brethren of Earth have demonstrated. Must we assume that extraterrestrials taught architecture to ants, termites, bees, beavers, and spiders? Must we assume that extraterrestrials taught ants the craft of agriculture through mushroom and aphid farming? These things exist naturally on Earth, we do not need to assume these things came from extraterrestrials.

In the last paragraph of this post, I reasoned the motive of the religious priesthoods to obtain and then hide astronomy, mathematics, and other sciences.

In this post, I highlighted some examples of the advanced knowledge being utilized and hidden by the religious and intellectual elite.

In this post, I discussed some examples of ancient lost cities and human population bottlenecks and declines. I even briefly touched upon the extinction of previous intelligent, creative, inventive, and tool-using archaic human-hominids. We have evidence of human population declines, lost cities, extinct humans,.... there is plenty of room for lost human knowledge and ancient human made OOPArts, without the need to assume ancient extraterrestrial contact.

 



"If we were to entertain a notion that we are being visited...and have been in the past...I suspect that much of this activity would be very well hidden from us. The alleged alien abductions, the UFO sightings and all that...might just be a tip of the iceberg, a puzzle from a much much bigger story...and we're only allowed to see a fraction of it...without understanding."


I believe this is all the result of man made black-ops.



posted on Feb, 11 2015 @ 05:28 AM
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a reply to: Sahabi


Hi Sahabi .This is a link to Micheal Heiser's site . drmsh.com... "I have concluded that "Elohim" is a word that must be understood in the direct context of its specific usage:" Yes ,he pretty much agrees but seems to conclude that it refers more to beings from the heavenly relm .The incident where Joshua is called from the dead ,he is referred to as a "Elohim" ..I don't think that daemons are ever referred to as "Elohim" though .

"This correlates to the "70 Sons of El" of the Canaanite religious systems." Heiser has a lot to say about the ancient text in Canaan ,and it does line up or jive with scripture .

" Would this be the struggle between the worshippers of El (Elohists, Elism) versus the worshippers of Yahweh (Jahwists, Yahwists)? " Not sure but I was referring more to the creation of the Masoretic text . I am far from being a scholar and usually piece my info in a hap haphazardly way . lol It seems at times ,certain information will not get into my thick skull while other times info I was not looking for or never contemplated just streams in .

ETA ..


edit on 11-2-2015 by the2ofusr1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 11 2015 @ 07:19 AM
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a reply to: Sahabi




I believe in the ancient hidden and/or lost advanced knowledge of mankind, firstly, because it is the most reasonable conclusion that makes the least amount of assumptions.


Hm...I agree on this...defo the least amount of speculation. But does it spell "truth" because of it ? Word "speculation" has an unfortunate ill effect when being used...it somehow puts the subject in the realm of SciFi...while I think it's not always deserved.

Sometimes...the truth is not simple...sometimes it is out of our reach. Just because things can be simple...it doesn't really mean they always are.




I believe this is all the result of man made black-ops.


I believe that is a slight cop out for us. While you state that ET visitations are not happening because of the amount of speculation...but the same can be said about black-ops. In order for those abduction cases to be linked to any black op...one would need to assume much:

1. your government is lying to you
2. your government is killing, torturing, abducting it's own citizens.
3. your government has technology which surpasses everything in the public domain and is keeping it a secret from everyone

...and if you accept that...than you must accept every other conspiracy out there. Because if you accept they kill their own citizens...then where would they stop ??

Now, isn't all this a bit too much speculation to take on board just so we deny ET visitations ?

ps.

Sorry I can't read all your references to other threads...I'm mostly come here while on work. It would take too much time to go through all links.



posted on Feb, 11 2015 @ 07:23 AM
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a reply to: the2ofusr1

I made a mistake earlier . It's early and my brain not firing . lol so it was . 1Sa 28:9 The woman said to him, "Surely you know what Saul has done, how he has cut off the mediums and the necromancers from the land. Why then are you laying a trap for my life to bring about my death?"
1Sa 28:10 But Saul swore to her by the LORD, "As the LORD lives, no punishment shall come upon you for this thing."
1Sa 28:11 Then the woman said, "Whom shall I bring up for you?" He said, "Bring up Samuel for me."
1Sa 28:12 When the woman saw Samuel, she cried out with a loud voice. And the woman said to Saul, "Why have you deceived me? You are Saul."
1Sa 28:13 The king said to her, "Do not be afraid. What do you see?" And the woman said to Saul, "I see a god coming up out of the earth."

(KJV+) And the kingH4428 saidH559 unto her, Be notH408 afraid:H3372 forH3588 whatH4100 sawestH7200 thou? And the womanH802 saidH559 untoH413 Saul,H7586 I sawH7200 godsH430 ascendingH5927 out ofH4480 the earth.H776

H430
אלהים
'ĕlôhı̂ym
el-o-heem'
Plural of H433; gods in the ordinary sense; but specifically used (in the plural thus, especially with the article) of the supreme God; occasionally applied by way of deference to magistrates; and sometimes as a superlative: - angels, X exceeding, God (gods) (-dess, -ly), X (very) great, judges, X mighty.



posted on Feb, 11 2015 @ 09:53 PM
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Very interesting post, and well presented also.


Now I am wondering how you will explain this?

" target="_blank" class="postlink" rel="nofollow">


In ancient times people carved, painted, molded, and eventually wrote about the things they saw and experienced. Cave paintings were what the painter was looking at. There is nothing suggesting they were fictional works of art and imagination. The jewelry shown is from the Inca. What is important to note here is that the airplane, for lack of a better term, has a vertical stabilizer. That does not appear anywhere in nature. You can then assume that either the Inca had advanced knowledge of mechanical aerodynamics or they saw something shaped like that in the sky.
edit on 11-2-2015 by Vroomfondel because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 11 2015 @ 10:17 PM
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originally posted by: Vroomfondel
Very interesting post, and well presented also.


Now I am wondering how you will explain this?

" target="_blank" class="postlink" rel="nofollow">


In ancient times people carved, painted, molded, and eventually wrote about the things they saw and experienced. Cave paintings were what the painter was looking at. There is nothing suggesting they were fictional works of art and imagination. The jewelry shown is from the Inca. What is important to note here is that the airplane, for lack of a better term, has a vertical stabilizer. That does not appear anywhere in nature. You can then assume that either the Inca had advanced knowledge of mechanical aerodynamics or they saw something shaped like that in the sky.

Cave painting were what the painter was looking at? There is nothing suggesting they were fictional works of art and imagination? ROFLMAO. Really? On what testable evidence is that load of codswallop based? Are you claiming that humans 30,000 to 10,000 to 1,000 years ago didn't have imaginations?



posted on Feb, 11 2015 @ 10:23 PM
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Why bother "connecting the dots"...
Believers will "believe" regardless of info to the contrary...

The day is called SUNday ...

Get a clue...



posted on Feb, 11 2015 @ 10:25 PM
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originally posted by: Tangerine

originally posted by: Vroomfondel
Very interesting post, and well presented also.


Now I am wondering how you will explain this?

" target="_blank" class="postlink" rel="nofollow">


In ancient times people carved, painted, molded, and eventually wrote about the things they saw and experienced. Cave paintings were what the painter was looking at. There is nothing suggesting they were fictional works of art and imagination. The jewelry shown is from the Inca. What is important to note here is that the airplane, for lack of a better term, has a vertical stabilizer. That does not appear anywhere in nature. You can then assume that either the Inca had advanced knowledge of mechanical aerodynamics or they saw something shaped like that in the sky.
...........

Response follows:
Cave painting were what the painter was looking at? There is nothing suggesting they were fictional works of art and imagination? ROFLMAO. Really? On what testable evidence is that load of codswallop based? Are you claiming that humans 30,000 to 10,000 to 1,000 years ago didn't have imaginations?



Sahabi

posted on Feb, 11 2015 @ 10:38 PM
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a reply to: the2ofusr1

Peace be with you the2ofusr1.

I quite enjoyed the video clip you shared. It is reassuring to hear a Doctor of Philosophy corroborate and affirm many of the points presented in this thread. It's nice to see a scholarly academic tackle the A.A. theory head-on. I have a feeling I'll be reviewing more of Mr. Heiser's work.


EzeqeelNOCH

posted on Feb, 11 2015 @ 10:50 PM
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originally posted by: Sahabi

originally posted by: EzeqeelNOCH
a reply to: Sahabi

Thank you for the truth you have supplied Sahabi...wisdom beyond words!


I am but a meandering fool in wonder of my wandering


 



As my work is in direct correlation with your own, and only help to sanctify your claims..
..would it be destiny we should meet completing a quest hidden amongst the passages of time!?!


It would appear as though all of existence has converged just to sustain this very moment, thus positively affirming your inquiry.

 




Oh what sweet intent! My Peace be with you my brother.


Meandering..possibly
Fool...absolutely not!
Much wisdom you speak brother..your correlations are correct
according to my personal finds.

According to historical records and scripture, we were once a Tower of Babel civilization.
A civilization that fell to a natural cosmic cycle of demise..as attributed in original scripture.

This prior man's advanced technology has been left in the open for all to decode their lost history!

Religion and academics have misunderstood the language of the ancient sent across time.
Their left brained society lived in coercion with mother nature; that is why we see very little
carbon footprint - and what we do find is mostly inexplainable to today's academics, known as Ooparts.

Be well.
E.NOCH


Sahabi

posted on Feb, 12 2015 @ 12:31 AM
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a reply to: Vroomfondel

Hello Vroomfondel. Thanks for the interest and taking the time to comment.


"Now I am wondering how you will explain this?"


1. First and foremost, we must ask; "How do the Inca explain them? Did the Inca attribute the artifacts as extraterrestrial sky vehicles?" If we have no inscriptions or explanations, anything we presume may very well be speculation and conjecture.

2. Secondly, by what methodology do we attribute ancient artifacts as being literal representations, imaginative, symbolic, or belonging to extraterrestrial inspiration? Do we just cherry-pick and choose the artifacts that best suit our theories, while ignoring others?

 



"What is important to note here is that the airplane, for lack of a better term, has a vertical stabilizer. That does not appear anywhere in nature."


It does appear in nature. The Dorsal Fin and Anal Fin of marine animals are vertical stabilizers.



These artifacts actually share common features found in various species of flying fish:









 



"You can then assume that either the Inca had advanced knowledge of mechanical aerodynamics or they saw something shaped like that in the sky."


The artifacts resemble features found in animals of the air and sea. Such natural features need not the assumptions of other-worldly inspirations.

Furthermore, traditionally, alleged extraterrestrial UFOs have been reported as being round, circular, oval, shield-shaped, saucer/disk shaped, cigar shaped, and/or triangular. Are we now proposing that extraterrestrial interstellar craft are shaped as fish, birds, and man-made planes?


edit on 2/12/15 by Sahabi because: (no reason given)



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