Russia vs USA: World War 3

originally posted by: noeltrotsky
a reply to: Willtell

Jeb needs a War to make him a man...doesn't he?

Sure does. He's a Bush.

a reply to: TechUnique

Russia will win... sorry. They just don't give a #.

If Russia ever launched a nuclear attack it would be low yield warheads and then only city's or military targets,

Some form of basic infostucture would remain. Unless they use high altitude warheads then the EMPS would end that.

And remember the average citizen is not the enemy, If I survived the initial attack i have at least 5 places to go, I would be at least 3 days away from any major City this would be because any hungry and desperate person would take what I have.

If Hilary Clinton is elected in 2017 then I will be concerned as I would believe she would be the one to protect her power base at all costs. Personally I would not want to live in a world that is a nuclear waste land.

I dont think anything will happen just being prepared will give you the advantage

a reply to: TechUnique

Thank you for the video.

The man who spoke there Talbot and his war party have a full and only responsibility if nukes fly to USA.

Until USA population makes sure that such kind of people are not defining the future of America there will be always a threat
of nuclear war be it with Russia or China.

The current crisis in Ukraine may end in nukes already, but even if it diffuses somehow there will be China threat after.
In short it is USA who is an ultimate aggressor in the world all the rest is just disinfo and propaganda.

Although some people here are thinking that First Cold War ended with the fall of Berlin Wall, this didn't transpired into changing of basic anti Warshaw Block laws. The famous Jackson Vanik ammendment from 1974 wasn't pulled out, so in essence the official stance of USA remained in the state of "Chilly war or peace" . Jackson-Vanik was finally lifted in 2011 and immediately another anti Russian laws started to pile up.
en.wikipedia.org...–Vanik_amendment

In 2011, U.S. Vice President Joe Biden urged a repeal of the law.[3] On 16 November 2012 the U.S. House of Representatives passed a bill which would repeal the Jackson–Vanik amendment for Russia (and Moldova). After the approval by the Senate, the law repealing the effects of the Jackson–Vanik amendment on Russia and Moldova was signed together with Magnitsky bill by President Obama on December 14, 2012. It remains in effect for other former Soviet countries.[5][6][7][8]
Source

I believe there won't be a ww3 but a full scale proxy could happen. Civil unrest could spark in Russia would probably happen due to the current worsening of the economy in Russa, due to sanctions.

If this peace plan introduced by French and German ministers doesn't work, count on a proxy war if its not already happening now.

a reply to: deviant300

If this peace plan introduced by French and German ministers doesn't work, count on a proxy war if its not already happening now.

Unlike Afghanistan, I don't think that Russia is interested in a prolonged proxy war. On both sides of the fences there are mostly Russian people killing each other. So, either this war is ended quickly or it will escalate into the full blown, probably nuclear war.
Americans who are thinking that it will be similar to another Afghanistan one day will be surprised with nuclear mushrooms on their cities. Or Putin will go, or may be something else, but not a many years proxy war like Afghanistan.

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: TechUnique

The only person who will would be a religious nut attempting to prove their versipn of armaggeddon.
You vote people like that in and I will entertain nuclear war.
Again no nation would do it...

North Korea I could see, no jokesies.

a reply to: TechUnique

Well...The real red-line comes in NATO expanding for real onto the border of Russia. If say the Crimea is attacked by the Ukraine/intl. community, THEN there might be a nuclear (note: tactical nuclear) response, as its in accordance with the new military doctrine of Russia...but the Donbass/Novorussia situation is not one where Putin will press the button, the worst case scenario is an all-out conventional war.

a reply to: TechUnique

Okay, first of all you lose credibility by inserting Bible quotes.
Secondly, the dramatic music is needless and is intended to create a sense of dread.
Thirdly, pointing out that the US has foreign policy objectives and repeating this is nothing but propaganda. Of course the US had objectives! Every nation does! Welcome to the notion of global politics.

Now, this situation is far more complex than anyone here will ever be able to understand, there are a million and one things going on behind the scenes that we know nothing about, and likely never will.

However, there are some things we do know, without any doubt.

1. Russia has invaded another country
2. This is criminal under international law, and in breach of agreements Russia has itself signed.
3. An Invasion of Ukraine threatens all of Europe not only physically, but politically. Putin is testing the world and reluctance to act will send a terrible message to other dictators and radical forces.

While no one wants to see things in Ukraine getting any worse, it is not the Ukrainian government responsible for the deaths and injuries on the ground. The only people responsible for this are the Rebels and the Russian troops and government. They had no reason to attempt to claim territory in this way, whether they were genuinely Rebels or the Russian government. You cannot simply form a group and state that the land is yours, stealing it from those who inhabit it.

That is NOT the right to self-determination, it's terrorism or war.

Because of all of this, because Russia has invaded another country, the world now has no other choice but to support the Ukrainian government in defense of their nation. Anything less than assisting them would be considered a massive failure, would bolster nutty Putin, and would send the message to other world leaders with eyes on foreign lands that they might be able to start a proxy war and steal whatever they like.

Putin has now given us no other choice, doing nothing is simply not acceptable.

We tried this before, remember? We held back, we had talks, we made agreements and we even attempted to look the other way when a maniac leader stole a foreign land from the people living there. And what happened? He was bolstered in his position, he found allies who found him useful in order to excuse their own actions, and he then spread his murderous plan across the entire continent. We then ended up having to fight a massive army across numerous fronts in order to defend ourselves, all because we failed to have the balls to stop him when we had the chance.

Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it, and Putin certainly is doing just that, seemingly reading from a Hitler guide book and thinking he knows where he went wrong in his maniacal plans.

Merkel and Hollande are only involved in the peace talks because their nations have economic and financial interests in taming Russia. Merkel wants the gas, Hollande has massively lucrative military deals with Russia. It is in their interests to play this down and make a deal with Russia which then allows them to continue their partnership with some semblance of credibility.

The question is, just how far will they go in order to save face? Will they willingly sign up to a deal handing over swathes of Ukraine to Russia? Will they be willing to carve up another nation in order to keep themselves in a good relationship with Russia? Leaders are elected to work in the best interests of THEIR nation, not a foreign nation. Leaders are also extremely short-sighted, stumbling through their stewardship and putting out fires when they happen, without much regard for the long-term problems that the next guy will have to deal with.

Personally, I think Merkel and Hollande are about to try and screw over Ukraine and basically hand the East of the country to Russia.

Regardless of all of this, the US will not be happy with the expansion of Russia, and nor should they. Neither will any other nation in Europe. NATO has been forced to go knocking on Putin's door by increasing presence in NATO member states, and Ukraine (whatever is left of it) will likely be invited to join it too in the coming decade.

Putin has backed himself into a corner, lost a hell of a lot for his country, and seemingly has no way out of escalating this other than simply removing his troops from Ukraine. That's not likely to happen, given that Putin is an egomaniac and would sacrifice his entire nation in order to maintain his image.

We should be arming Ukraine, to the hilt. We should be sending everything we can to force Russia out of Ukraine, and then we should be spending billions on keeping Russia within its own borders. We have no other choice, Putin has left us with no other choice. The only person to blame in all of this is the man who invaded another country.

a reply to: Rocker2013

Interesting post...Not really much more I can add.

All of this reminds me of the chilling docudramas Count Down To Looking Glass and so on. I really had hoped back in 1989 with the Berlin Wall being torn down and Eastern Europe regaining their freedoms for the first time since WW2 that Humanity and the World would move on. Sure there would have been some wars, that is human nature unfortunately. When I was applying for university places I was asked by a history professor as part of my application for a history degree what I thought would happen, this was back in late 1989. I thought for a moment and replied, that with Eastern Europe liberated and the Berlin Wall coming down, Russia would become more democratic as people would demand the same in their countries, but that there would be hot wars in the Middle East and increase in terrorism, the thinking behind that being that the fear factor of all out nuclear war would diminish as would the tight leash on the Middle East under the Cold War framework.

However I did not see the rise of Putin, nor did I realise the rise of religious hatred in the form of IS for example, and earlier Al Quidea. It is all very sad and pathetic really. Humanity had a golden opportunity offered on a silver platter back in 1989 for a more peaceful and understanding world, turning swords into ploughshares. We should be spending money on finding cures for cancer, exploring Mars and beyond in a serious way. We need to branch out in order to survive and escape our homeworld. Instead we are going backwards and plunging headlong and freefalling into a world engulfed by hatred, greed and power hungry elities ie the military industrial complex.

When I travel to work I often look at babies and toddlers, smile and then am sad. What legacy are we leaving them, will they even live to see adulthood? Will they even remember the world as lush and beautiful as it is now or will they live in a nuclear scarred world? It is a chilling and worrying thought. I for one would like to apologise to future generations that our generation is failing as caretakers of this world.

I really do hope Minsk will prove to be a turning point and cooler heads will prevail. However I am not hopeful. This conflict has gone on far too long and both sides are now entrenched with bitterness in their hearts. I pray for all of us. Whatever God you ascribe to.

originally posted by: Hijinx
a reply to: TechUnique

Russia will win... sorry. They just don't give a #.

Know something we dont? LAst time a tour was given for russian and chinese defense officials they were all smiles and laughing with color in their faces. a comparison picture when they emerged says they were scared crapless and white as ghost and not laughing anymore. Take from that what you will.

But never declare a winner. Our president dont care either apparently.

originally posted by: TechUnique
a reply to: boymonkey74

You don't think that there is anyone stupid enough to push that big red button? Look at the state of the world as it stands and then reconsider that notion.

Ive been hearing that nonsense for years other people have been hearing it for decades,somebody is always claiming that WW3 is just around the corner,ive fell for it a couple of times but im pretty sure that there is never going to be a direct conflict with russia or china because everyone knows its suicide.

My advice is to not waste 1 minute of your life worrying about a nuclear exchange between USA and russia because its never going to happen.

I believe Ukraine will simply be split in two and that's the end of that, no nuclear war. Likely Russia will try to start revolutions in former USSR states the coming years through propaganda and espionage and more territory might be split.

Then there are other factors such as robotics which will influence economies in a huge way. Many countries will choose the US/EU because of their tech. Once robots are sophisticated enough mass production will commence and from then things will move quickly, most notably millions will be out of work and I expect there to be a time of mass demonstrations, riots and revolutions even with changes to governments in many countries both EU but also Russia. Actually, Russia might have a better chance to finish first economy wise because they are better used to the idea of free/shared food, clothing and home and it might be other countries choose to deal with them it's just that they are not as quick as the US/EU with their IT developments. But anyway people will forget all about Ukraine, in a decade it'll all be about robotics and the massive losses of jobs to name just one subject which will affect the economy.

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: TechUnique

While bad no one is stupid enough to push the button.
Didn't happen in the cuban missile crisis won't happen now.
But I think it will be a different country backing down this time.

The US backed down through back channels in 62. Kennedy pulled our nuc's out of Eastern Europe.

a reply to: Rocker2013

Some good points.

But i think the real test will be when Russia trys the same strategy in a weak NATO country to test article 5.

Then it will be interesting to see how the likes of Merkel and Hollande respond.

Between self interest and commitments to NATO.

My personal belief is that the US will get taken out. There are many Countries that are tired of the BS caused by us.
Many would revel in the 'payback'.
There are many modern Prophets who have had visions of such an attack.
Dumitru Duduman


Henry Gruver


Remarkable how similar these are.

Believe what you want, but my bet is the US will cease to excist as a superpower due to an attack.
After this many will fall for the false peace and the one who brings it.
Those of you who don't believe just keep this in your mind when things begin to happen.

If you survive THIS war it is NOT to late to look to the TRUE Redeemer.

But why gamble your soul on maybe living through it for proof?

a reply to: victor7

Oh no sir, Obama isn't the no-war president you think him to be. For example, he greatly escalated the war in Afghanistan. In 2011, the peak of the war, we had over 100,000 troops there. We still haven't left yet. In Iraq, pulling out the way he did kind of caused, or greatly added to, the current "crisis" worth IS. Many more of his actions will inevitably lead to war time scenarios. So, Obama may be a lot of things, even not bad things, but a no-war president is not one of them.

a reply to: Rocker2013

We should be arming Ukraine, to the hilt. We should be sending everything we can to force Russia out of Ukraine, and then we should be spending billions on keeping Russia within its own borders. We have no other choice, Putin has left us with no other choice. The only person to blame in all of this is the man who invaded another country.

Russia is quite capable of destroying the USA, something you may have overlooked in your quest for world domination. You shouldn't be arming anyone, period. You say Putin has invaded another country...ring any bells?

Who is going to keep the USA within it's own borders? We know who to blame for the fiasco in Ukraine, we even know how much it cost.

a reply to: joho99

But i think the real test will be when Russia trys the same strategy in a weak NATO country to test article 5.

USSR was afraid to "test" article 5 and you think much weaker Russia will do it.

Russia will not test article 5 , if feel threatened to the death it will strike right to the command center in USA.
Or you think they want to invade some Finland or Latvia to receive first strike ?

Russians may be stupid, but there is some border to stupidity.