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Why do people 'hate' the U.S. and Isreal.

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posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 05:31 PM
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I was listening to Dennis Praeger this morning (he is a conservative talk radio host - I do listen in the attempt to understand the appeal). He was broadcasting from Isreal. He was encouraging his listeners to come to Isreal - that anyone that came to Isreal could not possibly 'hate' them. He just couldn't understanding why people could 'hate' Isreal or the US....

I was listening to a talk yesterday by Martin Luther King where he said that the US was the most violent country on the planet.

Also, yesterday, there was a discussion about military spending in this country and the possibility of 'arming' the Ukrainians.
That we spend (on and off the books) a trillion dollars a year on war - Russia just increased their military budget to a whopping 50 billion.

I started thinking about pollution, energy usage and electric cars. I work for a commerial electrial contractor - charging an electric car is very expensive (were talking a Tesla here). An efficient hybrid system that only uses gas or diesel to charge the main battery is a better answer in the short term. Conservation (conservative right?) is necessary.

The USA is the most violent country in the history of the planet with arguably Isreal coming in second place. I don't think there is any disputing this.

The US military is the largest polluter on the planet and is using limited resources needed by people in the name of endless war.




posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 05:48 PM
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a reply to: FyreByrd

I dont hate the US much, I do hate the fact that they are pushing their own agenda across the world or at least trying to and always calling it Democracy, please dont get me going on Democracy, which is probably the biggest joke in the history of the world. America and even my own UK, seem to think they can attack and charge at any country if they need to move it out of the way and when the arms dont work they go for the puppet strings to get things going with sanctions.

I have to add that when I refer to hating the US I'm not talking about the people, though they do seem very violent and blood craving (not all but a large portion) I am mainly talking about their politicians and the politicians of the past.


+1 more 
posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 05:57 PM
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could it be imperialism, colonialism. banker predatory practice, making the conquered state a fertile ground for resource stealing/population servitude under a guise of 'labor' or installing despot puppets as leaders- until no longer needed?

a Feigned Christian discipline and heritage ?

what else applies ?

 



but when cornered in their own deceptive, rationalized actions & behaviors... only Then will the USA take the high ground...... and let everyone know about it !
edit on th28142318102705032015 by St Udio because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 06:02 PM
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originally posted by: FyreByrd
The USA is the most violent country in the history of the planet with arguably Isreal coming in second place. I don't think there is any disputing this.


I seem to recall some pretty big death tolls in WWII and the Roman army was no slouch either. I think you are wrong and I dispute your claim. I would like to see some #'s or proof that the USA is the most violent country in the history of the planet.

Sorry, I know it is easy to demonize the USA, but this is a pretty big claim. (also probably need to define violent country in this context at some point as I am thinking expansion and killing)



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 06:06 PM
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Well at least we're good at something

We're No. 1

Also noted the top five arms manufacturers are also permanent members of the UN Security Council.

"United" in war.



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 06:13 PM
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a reply to: FyreByrd

The USA is the most violent country in the history of the planet with arguably Isreal coming in second place. I don't think there is any disputing this.


The USSR and China suffered the most deaths in WW2

Both were U.S. Allies then.

Germany and Japan get the Blue Ribbons.

WW2 Deaths by Country



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 06:19 PM
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a reply to: FyreByrd

Because they are dictatorships disguised as democratic countries.....



+7 more 
posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 06:28 PM
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a reply to: FyreByrd

14, 827 murders (according to FBI statistics) in 2012 out of a 2012 population of 313.9 million people.

In terms of U.S home violence this is nowhere near the worst world state.

In Israel there was 134 murders out of a population of 7.91 million.

Israel home violence is by no means the highest.

As societies both states are nowhere near the most violent.

Of course you are referring to military action casualty statistics.

We know what happened in Hitler's Germany. We know what Stalin did. We know what happened in WW1 and WW2.

The U.S is put in the position of being the world police force of Democracy. Israel have their own struggle. Muslim feuding would boggle the mind with the statistics of violence in recent years between Sunnis and Shias, and other feuding.

Might I suggest that you may be misinformed by hype and propaganda?

I'm not excusing violence, but the two states you mention are not the most violent, not by a long shot.

In the West we are very civilized. We are sensitive to conflict and very critical of our leaders when they engage in conflict.

I would encourage you to ponder who is actually informing you that the U.S and Israel are the most violent? Research it for yourself.

Israel is not a violent country in terms of its own society. If you go there you will not see any war. The military action is in very specific places; Gaza and Golan Heights. There is the odd terrorist incident, but they are thankfully very rare. Tel Aviv is very cosmopolitan. There you would feel that you are in any modern European city. It is a fully fledged modern democracy. The people are very modern and generally very descent. I am telling you what I have seen with my own eyes.

I know it is very upsetting to gentle and civilized people when confronted with the horrors of military action. It is a curse upon our world since the very earliest of times. How about we look at it another way.

If the U.S was to abandon its interests in the world and become insular another state like Russia or China would fill the gap. If the U.S had not intervened in Iraq then Hussein would have a nuclear capability by now and would have dominated the Middle East. He was a callous tyrant who had no issues with massacring the Kurds and Kuwait, Iran also. IS and Al Qaeda would be running amuck decimating Christians. Pakistan would may be now controlled by Al Qaeda and they would have a huge nuclear arsenal with which to blackmail other states. I am painting not too pretty a painting of what might have happened. It certainly would be a lot more dangerous as a world and who knows how many more people would have died.

If Israel did lay back and did not keep her enemies in check they would be armed to the teeth by Israel's enemies. There would have been a much nastier conflict with millions dead. Israel did not create the Arabic animosity toward the West. It has been going on for 1, 500 years. The Jews were decimated in Europe by Hitler. For almost a thousand years in Europe they were persecuted, even in England. They'd had enough. Having their own state was the only way forward because of the anti Semitism they have faced throughout the last two thousand years.

You don't like it that the U.S has to play a heavy hand. I don't like it. I hate it that Palestinian children have died because of this. Yet this world continues to be survival of the fittest. Brute force, unfortunately, is the only language states understand.

We can only hope that as we come together with better communication, sharing common ground and political will that there will be better times one day in the future. The majority of people are held ransom by extremists who use violence as a tactic to gaining political control. They use religion as a motive, but the real motive is political.

I will end my comment with a poem I wrote. Given the very basic tools we have as humans of collective decision making and state relationships there has not yet arisen a better civilized power structure. Let us not abuse this gift of civilization or let it be sabotaged. That is all I can say;


Democracy.
“It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried.”(Winston Churchill).

Democracy and diplomacy
Are our best friends
The rule of rhetoric
The vitality of the vote
Are peaceable companions
They are the tools
Of civilization that enable
Societies to blossom.


How I would plead
With the East
To forsake old ways
Of military force
To give way
To majority rule
Even when one's own preferences
Are not the governing power.

In a democracy
We accept the ballot's decision
We tolerate the opposition
We argue with words
In a house of civility
A polite nobility
Of understanding between factions
Debate is the discourse of our won freedom.

Extremism is as the word suggests
imbalance of perspectives
Minority sabotage by the sword
Only harm arises
When one seeks to impose
Such a manifesto
History catalogues and witnesses
That it is force and violence
At the heart of such monsters.





edit on 5-2-2015 by lonesomerimbaud because: tidy up.



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 06:53 PM
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Its the arrogance of those 2 countries snd the blood they have on there hands that make them hated by a while lot of people.

Its pretty simple if you ask me.


+4 more 
posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 07:16 PM
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If someone doesn't know why most of the rest of the world hates the USA and Israel they are probably a USA or Israel citizen. (Not saying all of them.) It is pretty easy to see from the outside.



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 07:25 PM
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originally posted by: Elton

originally posted by: FyreByrd
The USA is the most violent country in the history of the planet with arguably Isreal coming in second place. I don't think there is any disputing this.


I seem to recall some pretty big death tolls in WWII and the Roman army was no slouch either. I think you are wrong and I dispute your claim. I would like to see some #'s or proof that the USA is the most violent country in the history of the planet.

Sorry, I know it is easy to demonize the USA, but this is a pretty big claim. (also probably need to define violent country in this context at some point as I am thinking expansion and killing)


Not sure how much worse you can get in this link these two countries you mention seem to be competing with the devil

Warning this is not a good story and some may be disturbed by it I was, it is true and was announced on TV some time ago

www.rense.com...



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 07:27 PM
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Because behind US hides a fascist corporate mafia that control both banks,mainstream media and the war industrial complex and the citizens of US have no real bravery to fix the problem and keep voting for the same corrupt people falling always for their distractions.

And Israel is an aggressive country that collectively behaves more like Nazi Germany than a healthy democratic secular society who do not take over land thru wars.
edit on 5-2-2015 by LittleByLittle because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 07:32 PM
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I read recently (ICH possibly) that the US has been waging war for 214 out of the 235 years of it's existence. It would seem business is good.

Israel well they're just a bunch of self aggrandizing megalomaniacs (The government not most of the people).

I myself don't hate them. However I do wish they would stop thinking they are the guardians of democracy (what a farce).


Google search results:
www.google.ca...=the%20us%20has%20been%20waging%20war%20for%20214%20out%20of%20the%20235%20 years



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 07:37 PM
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a reply to: FyreByrd

FyreByrd,

I believe it is important to make a clear distinction between the activities of a nations government, and the beliefs, needs, and desires of its population.

I intensely dislike the foreign policy, intelligence agencies, and many things about the economic structure and related policies, of the United States of America. These attitudes are held primarily as a result of the ripples of the aforementioned. In the case of foreign policy and the intelligence community of the United States, I honestly believe they do more to promote terrorism with their drones, questionable justification for invading sovereign nations, and their mass surveillance strategies, than they ever do to combat it. They also erode the privacy of everyone on the planet, including citizens of the United States!

The economic structure of the United States also bothers me, since it was meant to be based on things like silver and gold, and is instead run on a series of what amounts to cheques drawn on bank accounts with nothing in them. If you were not aware of this, I seriously suggest you look up the fallacy of deficit reduction to find out how every dollar in existence has two dollars of debt attached to it, and can never be paid down. There will ALWAYS be interest. The economy there, like the one here in the UK relies on debt entirely for its existence at this time, a foolhardy practice that should never have been instituted.

With the people, and the culture of the United States, I have NO problem. I am proud to know many Americans through this website, and consider the people of the United States a poorly done to bunch, when it comes to the quality of their political class, when compared to the amount of money that the people pay them to get things done. But the people are golden in the main. I hold no grudge with them.

Israel, similarly, is a nation whose foreign policy makes me angry, preferring to blast a hospital building just because it may contain terrorists, rather than perform surgical and rigidly collateral free assaults using counter terrorist specialists and special forces, not to mention their world renowned Mossad organisation, to do a cleaner, less collateral heavy job of removing insurgents from Palestine. Their attitude to their neighbours, even in the face of the threat posed to them, is barbaric and unacceptable, and I find myself wondering every day how it can be that a nation created in the aftermath of a holocaust, can possibly see its current position as righteous, given the horrific ghettoisation of the Palestinian people, by Israel's government. Its excuses of pathetic rockets being slung at them from Gaza is lame, since their Iron Dome technology could, if properly implemented, make their borders utterly impregnable to everything from bullets to cruise missiles. Given that their defence industry is one of the most advanced in the world, the rocket attacks as they stand are a particularly callous excuse for their punitive response to that "threat".

Their level of response ENSURES more terrorists are created than killed when they act, and they KNOW it.

However, these are the decisions of governments I am talking about. I have met many Israelis who do not feel that their government represents them, in doing what it does, and going about it the way it does. I have no problem with even those Israelis who believe that these actions are justified, because they are the victims of propagandism, rather than being originators of hate. Their government however is riddled with xenophobic tools, and I hope its entire power structure as a nation gets its collective pelvis broken in a Skiing accident.

The people of Israel however, I have no quarrel with what so ever. I do not hate them.

You see, my own nations government is hardly representative of its people, and has not been since before I was born. I hate them with a passion, because they fail us every day, with their questionable support of a clearly flawed policy of arming rebels to fight terror, who become terrorists themselves in time, for their continued support for and refusal to admit the fallacy of a ground war prosecuted by a highly visible, obviously military force, against a shadowy, cell based organisation of terrorists, a strategically idiotic move if ever there was one, a move so idiotic as to suggest that most of the war on terror had nothing to do with terrorism what so ever, and may have been a cover for an agenda which we are left to guess at.

They fail us when they cut public spending instead of renegotiating poorly written contracts, and reclaiming BILLIONS of pounds in unpaid tax from private firms with whom the government have contracts. Some of these companies overcharge the government by hundreds of percent, and fail to pay tax, by putting their banking off shore, and this costs the taxpayer a massive, massive amount of money per department, per year. It makes me want to literally pull the head off of George Osborne, slowly, over a period of days, when he cuts the benefit paid to the disabled, or to the unemployed, without having first ensured that those with the broadest backs have not shirked their greater responsibility.

They fail us when they try to privatise our NHS by the backdoor, or fail to fund it correctly. They fail us when they refuse to answer questions honestly, concisely, and without waving their metaphorical phalluses in everyone's face, and they fail us by being over educated and under experienced in what it means to do a days physical graft, and yet having the cheek to call themselves our representatives in government.

They failed us when the allowed the banks to steal our futures.

I have more in common, with the common man or woman in the US, or Israel, than I do with the leaders of my nation. We share the same needs, food, shelter, heat and power on tap, and a certain degree of security from invading forces and criminal enterprises. I feel no hate for fellow citizens of the planet.

For those who mistakenly claim to be representative of their respective people however, I have nothing but the most awe inspiring loathing.



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 08:09 PM
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The USA is the most violent country in the history of the planet
a reply to: FyreByrd

?? I've lived here for 55 years and I have never witnessed a violent crime, yet !! Bull#.



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 09:01 PM
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originally posted by: donktheclown



The USA is the most violent country in the history of the planet
a reply to: FyreByrd

?? I've lived here for 55 years and I have never witnessed a violent crime, yet !! Bull#.



I'm guessing you don't live in a major urban area. When I lived in the USA (and yes, downtown of a larger city) I not only saw quite a few violent attacks, I myself was subject to a mugging that I woke up in the hospital from. Personal experience (for you or I) does not paint the whole picture.



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 09:27 PM
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originally posted by: Danny85
a reply to: FyreByrd

I have to add that when I refer to hating the US I'm not talking about the people, though they do seem very violent and blood craving (not all but a large portion) I am mainly talking about their politicians and the politicians of the past.


I agree with you here and as a US citizen, it's the state that infuriates me not most of the people though there are some.....

When I think of what 'could have been' and was 'is' since WWII (maybe even WWI), I'm deeply saddened.


edit on 5-2-2015 by FyreByrd because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 09:38 PM
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originally posted by: Elton

originally posted by: FyreByrd
The USA is the most violent country in the history of the planet with arguably Isreal coming in second place. I don't think there is any disputing this.


I seem to recall some pretty big death tolls in WWII and the Roman army was no slouch either. I think you are wrong and I dispute your claim. I would like to see some #'s or proof that the USA is the most violent country in the history of the planet.

Sorry, I know it is easy to demonize the USA, but this is a pretty big claim. (also probably need to define violent country in this context at some point as I am thinking expansion and killing)


You are free to dispute that "the US is the most violent nation in history" but the facts support the conclusion.

I don't mean just physical violence, but political ('nation making', 'regime change' - which are hardly bloodless enterprises; economic violence (see the former and Russia and other BRIC nations, for reference see "I was an Economic Hitman") pyschological violence (torture, propoganda, surveillance, drugs and their attendant US 'assisted' drug wars) Oh and what about military occupation via the 300 + military facilities in other countries often as concessions to avoid 'blackmail' of the former types.

Then there is the violence within our own borders - prisions, treatment of minorities, drugs and the drug war.

Now do you still want to assert that the US is not the most violent nation on the planet?



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 09:45 PM
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a reply to: lonesomerimbaud

Ah, an apologist. Welcome.

I find your definition of violence very limited and disingenuous.

Death figures (within a society and without) are simplistic when talking about violence. Much - most violece doesn't result in death - or let me say 'direct' and 'instant' death. The effects of violence are cumulative (as in growing terrorism or lingering death from militiary pollution).

Thank you for sharing your position.



posted on Feb, 5 2015 @ 09:48 PM
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a reply to: FyreByrd

Absolutely, you have not presented any data, just a list of things you think the US is guilty of.

You made a huge claim and included all of recorded history, but no evidence... It's on you to prove that the US is hands down the most violent nation ever. And I strongly disagree with that assertion.

Rome had gladiator combat, Nazi Germany had concentration and death camps, the Russian Purge, all seem more violent than contemporary USA.




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