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Apostle Paul makes you complicit to evil leaders due to stupidly false assumptions

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posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 09:11 AM
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a reply to: Gryphon66

When I figure it all out, I will let you know. So, far Ive figured out that there is a real Christ Spirit, and we all seem to fill in the blanks with our Religious Programming. I do think there is profound wisdom in a lot of ancient texts and I do not limit my research into just the quamran material or the nag hammadi. Im still asking questions, and I probably wont know until I meet my maker. I just know that for most of my life Ive been driven to find out. Just a curious bystander.




posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 09:14 AM
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originally posted by: johndeere2020
This is Pauline (Apostle Paul) logic:


Romans 13:1-3 13 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong.


Note that evil and corrupt leaders have existed in Paul's times.

Paul is the #1 apostle to many Christians. The bulk of New Testament was apparently written by Paul.

******* He makes a false assumption that all leaders are good!!! ******

Paul is also the same apostle who taught women to subject themselves to their husbands and banned them from leadership. We know this teaching doesn't produce any good results in the real world!!! The WEST have ditched the practice and have become one of the most peaceful nations on Earth with the highest average quality of living!

The most hell-bent religious nations, including nations who are not religious but neglects the welfare of women are infested with crime, human rights abuses, and generally miserable living conditions on average - despite having high levels of economic growth like China, India, many Middle Eastern Nations and many deeply RC Christian nations.

We see here that money isn't a huge factor in having a nation with high average standards of living but how it uses sound logic/wisdom and its treatment of women. The more stupid the leaders are, the worse off is a nation despite a high national income.

We can also conclude that money - making had nothing to do with wisdom but rather the opposite. Greed seems to be making life on average more difficult. The desire and envy to get rich is making everyone miserable but the few thieves who reap from the stupidity greed causes.



Abrahamic religions wage war against sound reasoning and logic and against women.


Yeah Paul should have said rise against tyranny and start wars and kill anyone you disagree with

I cant believe how shallow some people are, the promise was not made for here on earth.



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 09:16 AM
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The Church added that part to a gnostic writer, including the part about women as Paul was schooled in the Egyptian gnosis which was equality, not the Essenic gnostic hierarchal version.

World wide, most Christians are not fundamental Christians, that is only popular in the US. Most are more metaphoric and simply don't follow archaic suggestions in the bible, they only uphold the good loving parts, and use discernment.



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 09:28 AM
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a reply to: lonesomerimbaud

That is what you call a persecution complex. The more people are against you the more you believe you are right. Most if not all have a form of this, that is why each one thinks they are right. This solidifies people's belief in the likes of scientology.



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 09:33 AM
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originally posted by: johndeere2020
Paul is the #1 apostle to many Christians. The bulk of New Testament was apparently written by Paul.

[snip]

Abrahamic religions wage war against sound reasoning and logic and against women.


I can't argue with you... just want to say thanks for stipulating that "Paul is the #1 apostle to many Christians," and not ALL Christians.

I am one of those Christians who does not accept Saul of Tarsus as an apostle of Jesus.... not even as a true disciple of Jesus. "My" bible comprises the four gospels about the ministry and acts of Jesus -- not the letters and acts of Saul of Tarsus.



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 09:54 AM
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a reply to: celticdog

Exactly. It's like if some guy said

"Hey I'm a time traveler from the future, but if you tell people about me they'll think you're crazy."

Then when you tell people and they think you're crazy, you take it as evidence that the guy knew what he was talking about.

The bible is designed to hinder critical thinking. It even outright forbids it. It's genius.



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 09:58 AM
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One of the reasons I think the Christian faith should be called Paulism.

Paul was a deceiver or a crazy person who cannot teach about the holy spirit who speak with duality and his own ego delusions and wants. I hope the soul that was Paul have ascended and moved on but will forever think his work is not good enough.

Why listen to "not good enough" when there is Yeshua, Rumi, Siddhārtha Gautama, Nanak, Socrates and Plato. I demand much from those who teach and both Paul and Muhammed do not measure up to teach anything from my point of view.

But then I like the holy spirit to reveal itself as a real things that do not need faith. I found that in meditation and in Reiki. Spirit energy infused in the body and the mind saw thing clearly on a higher level.

Namaste (I bow to the divine in you)
edit on 3-2-2015 by LittleByLittle because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 10:01 AM
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a reply to: borntowatch

You made a very good point. I think that Constantine was a very wise ruler. He united Rome. He made everyone happy. They used the myths and legends of Mithra took Mithra's birthdate and gave it to Jesus. And at that time and in that season it was probably the best thing he could have done. There are like 180 similarities between Mithra and Jesus.

I probably shouldnt be bursting the Christians bubble. But, it really is the truth.



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 10:01 AM
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originally posted by: johndeere2020

******* He makes a false assumption that all leaders are good!!! ******


Or maybe he's saying that leaders that abuse their authority are not legitimate, thus giving grounds for revolution if leaders are *not* upholding the good and punishing evil.

Sneaky, sneaky Paul, cleverly slipping his subversive teachings past the eyes of the Roman authorities under a guise of a message of obedience and submission.



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 10:06 AM
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Paul is the antichrist that was already in the world as John stated in 1 John 4:3.

Romans 13 is about bowing to corrupt rulers and not resisting them, because to do so brings judgement on yourself, meaning God will bring his judgement on you for standing against their war crimes. Why? Because they are GOD'S servants for your good. Not Satan's, but God's. Judging by their actions how can they work for God who is only good?

Paul's teachings are unnecessary, were Jesus' words not enough? He said follow the two commandments to have life. The commandments were to love others as yourself and to love God. If you love others then that is a sign of loving God. How simple is that? What Paul writes is anything but. Even Peter says his teachings are hard to understand.

Jesus' yoke (teachings) was easy and light, Paul's are a burden and heavy. Very simple vs. very complicated, that's Jesus vs. Paul in a nutshell.



edit on 2/3/2015 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 10:14 AM
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a reply to: johndeere2020

"Render unto Caesar what is his..."

"Live by the sword and die by the sword."

Jesus taught the same kind of obedience, and even practiced it until it killed Him. What's your point?...That you hate the bible? That's not breaking news.



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 10:19 AM
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a reply to: StalkerSolent

Maybe, but if he really felt that he couldn't just say whatever it was he wanted to say, would it not have been better to let the people rely on what they already knew of good and evil to come to their own conclusions?

If your government is killing innocent people then why can't you just use what you already know about murder to make your own call?
Why should a religion be so complicated? Why all the rules?

It seems like an almighty God could sum everything up neatly without confusing everyone. Who really benefits from all the overcomplications besides maybe an earthly ruler who can reinterpret them to mean just about anything?



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 10:33 AM
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a reply to: Chronogoblin

I disagree. Paul is saying that because they are in power, God put them there.

Read that again. Read the scripture.

This means that Putin, the bloodthirsty oligarch who is using his oil and gas as a means to draw more territory and political clout, is perfectly in line with God, since, after all, God put him there. Yes, he can tuck his tits inside and cross his arms to deny food for the kids…he won't feel a thing. And, apparently, his worshippers dig him. He will waste the perverts in outhouses…but again: God placed him there, with 70 billions in allowance…sure thing.

Or like nazis. Yup, God did this.

At least the bloody Bolsheviks who used a gun to force half of eastern europe to lose their language, declared that there is no God, and you'd better believe it, or else. At least their spawn, which now rules the world, are godless in the extreme. As such, we know we are right to fight them. Nothing can convince me that the zionist technofascist state is of God. It is unflinchingly satanic.


Paul is a spiritual child, or perhaps just fearful of the powers that he offends. It's just so hard to believe that these guys hung around with Jesus. It's like giving acid to children and then making into spiritual law whatever they babble about.

Hard to imagine, I know, but look around you. Do these godless clowns belong in power?

Paul is wrong.

# 361



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 10:52 AM
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originally posted by: JessicaRabbitTx
a reply to: StalkerSolent

Maybe, but if he really felt that he couldn't just say whatever it was he wanted to say, would it not have been better to let the people rely on what they already knew of good and evil to come to their own conclusions?

If your government is killing innocent people then why can't you just use what you already know about murder to make your own call?
Why should a religion be so complicated? Why all the rules?

It seems like an almighty God could sum everything up neatly without confusing everyone. Who really benefits from all the overcomplications besides maybe an earthly ruler who can reinterpret them to mean just about anything?



I don't actually think Paul was encouraging rebellion, (I was being facetious) but I do think that the OP's explanation of this passage is overly simplistic. (Also: the Roman government was killing innocent people? Err...not at a hugely higher rate than ours does, as far as I know...) [ETA: Nero lived around this time, and there was a few other bad cookies, but he was one of the first really wacky ones.]

I also don't think that the Christian religion is that complicated, or really has than many rules at all. But that's just me

edit on 3-2-2015 by StalkerSolent because: It will be obvious...



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 11:09 AM
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This passage has always made me feel uneasy. Sounds more like the brainwashing dogma of a ruling elite than the words of a/the deity.

Next they're be finding a lost gospel that says bankers are part of Gods authority and if we disobey them, we disobey God.



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 11:12 AM
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a reply to: StalkerSolent

Oh don't get me wrong. I never implied that the roman government was killing more innocents than our own.

On the rest I respectfully agree to disagree. I think the golden rule is simple enough to live by and that there are too many unnecessary over complicated commandments.



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 11:31 AM
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a reply to: JessicaRabbitTx

I agree with your reasoning.

From my point of view:
On one level I am very disappointed on the bible but on another level it is the perfect spiritual test. Not a perfect non contradictional spiritual truth but a perfect book to separate sheep from goats.

Matthew 25:31-46 - The Sheep and the Goats
Matthew 13:24-30 - The Parable of the Weeds

Namaste
edit on 3-2-2015 by LittleByLittle because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 11:39 AM
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originally posted by: McGinty
This passage has always made me feel uneasy. Sounds more like the brainwashing dogma of a ruling elite than the words of a/the deity.

Next they're be finding a lost gospel that says bankers are part of Gods authority and if we disobey them, we disobey God.


Maybe
.

But in my way of thinking:
Trickle up economy->Trickle up karma (responsibility for suffering). To be on the top of the power pyramid means you get part of all sins created below you. Only the unwise who do not know better sacrifice their future for the now.
edit on 3-2-2015 by LittleByLittle because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 11:58 AM
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a reply to: JessicaRabbitTx

Yeah...if you look in the Bible, you'll find you can distill the essence to "love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength, and love your neighbor as yourself." That seems simple enough to me. In another place, it says taking care of widows and orphans is religion true and undefiled...and that sounds like a good sort of religion to me.



posted on Feb, 3 2015 @ 12:59 PM
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a reply to: StalkerSolent

actually what it is I think is that if the people are not living according to God's instructions he will raise up leaders that will do terrible things till they repent or use another force to dethrone their king and rule instead..







 
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