Debunking the notion that those who believe official government denials are "skeptics"

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

False. Panther skeletons, video of panthers, there is a lot of evidence proving panthers have teeth aside from being bit. You people wouldn't be able to post if logical fallacies were outlawed.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: debonkers
Therefore, my experiences are a fact, by definition.

Actually not all experiences are fact. I work with patients that have hallucinations. To them, they are experiencing things that are not real, therefore there experiences are not fact, to the extent they actually happened, though they are very real to the patient.

Please be more accurate.

I never stated all experiences are fact (although, here is the definition of "experience":
"practical contact with and observation of facts or events." But I digress).

I said my experiences are fact.

originally posted by: debonkers

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: debonkers
Therefore, my experiences are a fact, by definition.

Actually not all experiences are fact. I work with patients that have hallucinations. To them, they are experiencing things that are not real, therefore there experiences are not fact, to the extent they actually happened, though they are very real to the patient.

Please be more accurate.

I never stated all experiences are fact (although, here is the definition of "experience":
"practical contact with and observation of facts or events." But I digress).

I said my experiences are fact.

So the experiences of others are not factual, just yours? If you can not tell what is wrong with your belief then you are probably beyond reason at this point.

Except that is not the best definition from your source.

An event or occurrence that leaves an impression on someone

Very telling you chose the one you did since it compliments your bias. I guess you are desperate to find a way to label your memory as absolutely factual.

originally posted by: NoCorruptionAllowed
a reply to: debonkers

He/she has been on that "testable evidence" binge for a couple weeks straight, but never observes any in his/her own arguments.

Until the ostrich feels the bite of the panther's jaws upon him, the panther has no teeth.

Love it! So true.

originally posted by: debonkers

originally posted by: NoCorruptionAllowed
a reply to: debonkers

He/she has been on that "testable evidence" binge for a couple weeks straight, but never observes any in his/her own arguments.

Until the ostrich feels the bite of the panther's jaws upon him, the panther has no teeth.

Love it! So true.

When aliens come and abduct me (feel the panther bite) you will be the first I tell. Don't hold your breath though.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: debonkers

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: debonkers
Therefore, my experiences are a fact, by definition.

Actually not all experiences are fact. I work with patients that have hallucinations. To them, they are experiencing things that are not real, therefore there experiences are not fact, to the extent they actually happened, though they are very real to the patient.

Please be more accurate.

I never stated all experiences are fact (although, here is the definition of "experience":
"practical contact with and observation of facts or events." But I digress).

I said my experiences are fact.

So the experiences of others are not factual, just yours? If you can not tell what is wrong with your belief then you are probably beyond reason at this point.

Except that is not the best definition from your source.

An event or occurrence that leaves an impression on someone

Very telling you chose the one you did since it compliments your bias. I guess you are desperate to find a way to label your memory as absolutely factual.

This is twice now I have asked you to stop putting words in my mouth, please stop misrepresenting my statements, I'm starting to think it is intentional.

I never said the experiences of others are not factual.

Why lie about that?

originally posted by: debonkers
I never said the experiences of others are not factual.

Why lie about that?

What did you mean by this?

originally posted by: debonkers
Please be more accurate.

I never stated all experiences are fact

Your words, It's hard to put anything in your mouth when I am simply quoting you.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: debonkers
I never said the experiences of others are not factual.

Why lie about that?

What did you mean by this?

originally posted by: debonkers
Please be more accurate.

I never stated all experiences are fact

Your words, It's hard to put anything in your mouth when I am simply quoting you.

I question your reading comprehension.

I asked you to stop lying because I never said "the experiences of others are not factual."

Then you justify your misrepresentation of me by quoting me saying, "I never stated all experiences are fact."

Let's make this clear:

I did say "I never stated all experiences are fact". I did not say "the experiences of others are not factual."

Are you able to distinguish between those two statements? Good. Then stop putting words in my mouth, please.

originally posted by: debonkers
I question your reading comprehension.

That's funny because I already questioned your English comprehension. Perhaps you can explain what you meant then.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
Actually not all experiences are fact. I work with patients that have hallucinations. To them, they are experiencing things that are not real, therefore their experiences are not fact, to the extent they actually happened, though they are very real to the patient.

originally posted by: debonkers

I never said the experiences of others are not factual.

So are you claiming when my patient sees a German Dr. on the ceiling looking at her, the German Dr. is factual and truly exists and what the patient experiences is actually happening?

Or is their experience "real to them", but not actually happening?

Is the problem you are having trying to play both angles because you want your definition of experience to mean your experience is factual, and if you admit the experience of my patient is not factual it prevents you from claiming yours must be factual?

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: debonkers
I question your reading comprehension.

That's funny because I already questioned your English comprehension. Perhaps you can explain what you meant then.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
Actually not all experiences are fact. I work with patients that have hallucinations. To them, they are experiencing things that are not real, therefore their experiences are not fact, to the extent they actually happened, though they are very real to the patient.

originally posted by: debonkers

I never said the experiences of others are not factual.

So are you claiming when my patient sees a German Dr. on the ceiling looking at her, the German Dr. is factual and truly exists and what the patient experiences is actually happening?

Or is their experience "real to them", but not actually happening?

Is the problem you are having trying to play both angles because you want your definition of experience to mean your experience is factual, and if you admit the experience of my patient is not factual it prevents you from claiming yours must be factual?

I have no opinion to offer and have made no claim at all regarding anything that occurs at your job. That is a discussion you seem to be having by yourself. Please do not involve me in your personal life, I do not know you, or any patients at your facility, whatever type of facility that may be.

You've derailed the thread far enough and long enough, get back on topic or you will be ignored.

a reply to: debonkers

So you refuse to answer, just as I predicted. As we both know YOU are the one who brought up experiences, not me. All I did was demolish your weak argument. You know what they hallucinate is not actually there, yet you want to cling to the idea somehow your experience must be a fact, when it's not.

So let's back up.

Skeptic here. Your claim, aliens are visiting. Where is your evidence?

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: learnatic

Ah ok. Personally I do not think it gives them a high moral ground. I have no problem with someone being a "believer". My problem is when they act like it is fact, and demand you accept it as such.

I agree with you there. I too do not appreciate people trying to make me accept their claims about anything by getting forceful, agressive and implying I am as thick as two planks simply because I don't take their word for it.

a reply to: learnatic

Yes. I am willing to listen to whatever evidence you have. I also respect your beliefs, so long as you recognize that's what it is, a belief. I don't even mind someone trying to "convert me" so long as they do it respectfully.

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

They = entities not from Earth.

Why not from this earth?

Because they are seen in flying saucers?


I guess humans flying planes are not from this planet either.

That is one question that bugs me about believers in so called aliens visiting, what has made you believe they are from outside of earths realm?


They might be alien but not alien to this planet just peoples perception, so what has made so many believe they come from Mars or Uranus or some other place?

originally posted by: debonkers

originally posted by: InhaleExhale

originally posted by: debonkers


Your rant belongs in the rant forum.


One of the worst generalizing rants I have read in while,

All believe in this and that, bla bla bla.

Sorry I think your cheese slid right of cracker as you seem to have a few members of ATS in mind when posting this and I assume its because the recent Phoenix lights thread, better suited in the rant forum as nothing your saying sounds like thinking but a lot like ranting about your belief what a skeptic is which in turn say is a believer but is the opposite of what you believe or like so many hat say they know from first hand experience.

A person who questions ones claims is a believer of denials by the government?


Really?

Your opinion is very welcome, but I feel my cheese is still on my cracker. Thanks for posting.

well then when you feel its still on is a clear sign that you haven't a clue.

To say what you have lacks logic and to experience what you are beginning to expose would make the cheese slide right of your cracker and one that knows what their experience is would actually say yes my cheese slid of my cracker when I had an alien experience or whatever it be that makes your cheese slide of your cracker.


However your take on what skeptic is and who are skeptics is a rant that belongs in the rant forum.

Yes you did bring some evidence, the dictionary meaning of skeptic, however I think you fail to underestand what you supplied and how it works in the real world.

You are a skeptic just like everybody else in the world, or do you believe in absolutely everything anyone says and the reasons they say they do things?

originally posted by: game over man

originally posted by: draknoir2

originally posted by: game over man

originally posted by: draknoir2

originally posted by: game over man

originally posted by: draknoir2

originally posted by: game over man
a reply to: ZetaRediculian

This is because there are people who don't want to participate into the subject seriously? I might as well have an Alien right next to me? These are the same people who still won't believe in Aliens even if they landed on the White House Lawn?

Get back to us when that happens.

It would be interesting if Aliens did land on the White House Lawn what the skeptics would turn into? Conspiracy theorist would be coming up with all kinds of ideas and skeptics would still be reciting what the government says?

I dunno, man. It's your fantasy, not mine.

Your replies to me are so weird and unfriendly...it's not your fantasy but mine? What are you talking about?

You were asking me questions about a hypothetical situation you made up that has never happened [fantasy]. My answer was that I don't know.

You replied to me, "Get back to us when that happens..."

Then you reply I don't know...

Don't act like you didn't start the conversation.

That was a response to your post. The one YOU made.

I'm not acting.

a reply to: game over man

Skeptics towards UFO's are purely there has never been a smoking gun photograph and witness testimony is worthless.

No one in their right mind is skeptical to UFOs existing.

You even posted this few lines before

UFO's are a fact.

Of coarse they are a fact,

however someone throwing their shoe up in the air could be a UFO to someone else.

What needs to be done in the Alien/UFO community is once and for all discuss in DETAIL (Links/References) these points from a non-biased perspective.

How can that be done with all child like mentalities plaguing the research and discussions into the UFO phenomenon?

Is deep space travel possible?

Questions need more detail and clarification, yes its possible but how probable is it to our species at this point in time?

Can the timelines of advanced civilizations match up?

if they exist that could all the at same as they couldn't.

Probability is what needs to be researched instead of possibility, skeptics go towards probability where as believer ask do you think its possible. Sorry that is a child's question and not one of serious research in any field.

Is the Government and Nasa capable of covering up Alien Contact and UFO's?

They don't need to cover up UFOs because they are unidentified, if they are identified as extra terrestrial, depending on what data is available about the ETs then yes they might be capable of creating a disinfo campaign to muddy waters so to speak.


The U in UFO stands for unidentified not alien.


This is why the discussions are always a joke.

originally posted by: debonkers

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: debonkers

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: debonkers
Therefore, my experiences are a fact, by definition.

Actually not all experiences are fact. I work with patients that have hallucinations. To them, they are experiencing things that are not real, therefore there experiences are not fact, to the extent they actually happened, though they are very real to the patient.

Please be more accurate.

I never stated all experiences are fact (although, here is the definition of "experience":
"practical contact with and observation of facts or events." But I digress).

I said my experiences are fact.

So the experiences of others are not factual, just yours? If you can not tell what is wrong with your belief then you are probably beyond reason at this point.

Except that is not the best definition from your source.

An event or occurrence that leaves an impression on someone

Very telling you chose the one you did since it compliments your bias. I guess you are desperate to find a way to label your memory as absolutely factual.

This is twice now I have asked you to stop putting words in my mouth, please stop misrepresenting my statements, I'm starting to think it is intentional.

I never said the experiences of others are not factual.

Why lie about that?

How does it feel to be misquoted?

a reply to: debonkers

This is a terrific post, LaughingGod, I thank you for your input. I think willful ignorance is an apt description for the mindset of those who reject the past 70 years of alien contact.

Past 70 years or 7000 if not more years?


Are you talking about witnessing Flying saucers as per Kenneth Arnolds descriptions or Alien visitation that is said to be happening for way more than 70 years?

a reply to: debonkers

As long as you embrace the official governmental, academic, and mainstream media viewpoint, you have no justification for calling yourself a skeptic.

Conformist? Yes.

Skeptic? No.

You need to add the words before skeptic because some are skeptics towards claims made by Jo blow just as others are skeptics to claims made by Governing officials.

Everybody is a skeptic in one way or another.

Ponder it yourself.

You should ponder on more things than what you say others should instead of ranting here about your beliefs.