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originally posted by: TheConstruKctionofLight
Their biggest "crime" was threatening to bring in a non fiat gold based monetary system. Cant have that can we
originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: grandmakdw
I give up on "conversing" with you. You obviously have hatred in your heart for Christians
i waste no time on hatred. it is an ugly and poisonous emotion. what i do have is concern for the emotional well being of our species as a whole, and how it is taxed by the regular political, economic and social exploitation of spirituality. i express this concern by critiquing the tripe regularly submitted by a diverse community that all share one thing in common: they spread ignorance. but more importantly, they spread fear.
this is where we deny it.
I respect that and will stop trying to reason with you.
No matter what I say, you will twist it into something ugly that I don't mean at all. That is your right on ATS and I'll respect that.
i respect your right to make that decision. my only point was that in the event the shepherd is a sham, the flock should take care of it and not just float over to another shepherd. even if only by speaking the true word just as loudly as he defiles it. let good men not stay silent when the dragon roars.
and for the record, you strike me as good model for christians everywhere.
originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: Chronogoblin
What about all the other non-Christian cultures who are persecuted every day?
I don't have any problem acknowledging Christians are persecuted on some level. What I have a problem with is Christians who claim they're being persecuted while they're better off than most other people. Don't act like you're the only one who is persecuted or that Christians don't persecute others themselves (Not directed at you).
18 If the world hates you, you know that it has hated me before it hated you.
19 If you were part of the world, the world would be fond of what is its own. Now because you are no part of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, for this reason the world hates you.
20 Keep in mind the word I said to you: A slave is not greater than his master. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have observed my word, they will also observe yours.
21 But they will do all these things against you on account of my name, because they do not know the One who sent me.
Allowing same-sex marriages, abortions, atheism, teaching evolution theory in school, homosexuals, etc. is not persecuting Christians.
And by reducing the cities of Sod′om and Go·mor′rah to ashes, he condemned them, setting a pattern for ungodly people of things to come. 7 And he rescued righteous Lot, who was greatly distressed by the brazen conduct of the lawless people— 8 for day after day that righteous man was tormenting his righteous soul over the lawless deeds that he saw and heard while dwelling among them.
originally posted by: Stormdancer777
embarrassing silence of Christians
A second-century Church Father named Tertullian famously said that “the blood of martyrs is the seed of Christians,” meaning that Christianity thrives under persecution. This certainly appears to be the case now, as Christianity is flourishing, for example, in China and Africa, while growth is markedly slower in Europe and much of the first world. If current trends continue, China will have the largest Christian population of any nation in the world in just 15 years.
So as Islamic extremists try to eradicate Christianity in its birthplace, and still others attempt to stamp it out in where it is growing fastest—Africa and China—the west seems somewhat complacent, and rests on the sacrifices of prior generations. Moreover, the western response seems often what has been called the “embarrassed silence of Christians in face of anti-Christian persecution.”
originally posted by: Krazysh0t
originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
I see a lot of justification here for hating christians........
But its wrong to dislike Muslims.........even tho they are the ones cutting off heads, blowing themselves up, killing women and children , not allowing women to drive or vote, and killing people for a cartoon?
Two different kinds of intolerance are being discussed here. Christian intolerance is towards Christians wanting to push their religion on others. Muslim intolerance is people hating Muslims because they are Muslim. If Muslims ever got a reasonable presence here in the US to push theocratic laws or try to impose their religion onto my life enough, then I'd complain about them too. But that isn't the case, instead its ALWAYS Christians trying to push their religion onto me here in America.
Funnily enough Christians are constantly complaining about Muslims implementing Sharia Law here in the states, when Christians are closer to implementing THEIR version of Sharia Law than Muslims could ever hope to be.
Oh but you say "Dont lump them all into one group under Islam!"
Yet I see a whole bunch of you doing the same thing to Christians and justifying your illogical , cognitively dissonant attitude....
Check again, I don't want to kill or persecute any Christians for their beliefs. I DO want Christians to stop imposing their religion onto people who don't want it though.
Stop being politically correct and start being honest.........the threat isnt coming from Christians.......
Start with yourself in recognizing the types of discrimination going on.
yes there are hypocrites, yes there are a-holes........
But there is only ONE religion on the planet right now thats having a REAL issue with its followers......
STOP ignoring it and start addressing it.......stop making excuses and stop the projection on to Christians and others....
Now you are trying to turn this thread into a Muslim hate thread (which is offtopic)... Aren't you a Christian? Aren't you supposed to love everyone. THIS is the attitude that is making people not like you guys.
Islam needs reformation out of these extremist elements period, full stop.....
THATS the religion you should have an issue with, you know , the one causing real harm
Christians cause harm to the world in their own way when they try to legislate to get evolution not taught in schools or try to legislate against abortion. Christians still have the same level of intolerance towards people not of their religion as Muslims do (as in its a small proportion of the overall population that are a bunch of idiots and loudmouths that give the whole group a bad name), but Christians have learned how to be sneakier with it (and therefore actually do more damage overall than the immediate gratification of violence).
originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: Blue_Jay33
it almost makes me wonder if jesus knew that half the people who worshipped him would turn out to be assholes. self-fulfilling prophecy. of course people are going to get upset.
originally posted by: Deaf Alien
I went through this thread and I saw no examples of persecutions unless I missed it?
If you claim that Christians are being persecuted, then show examples.
And why do some Christians care what others think of them? So some people hate them. BIG DEAL. They aren't bothering anyone.
Religious persecution is a common occurrence in the history of man. Being abused, mistreated or even killed for having a difference in religious beliefs, connections or lack of them, is all too common; even in many lands today. One’s religious views can be seen as a direct extension of their moral fiber. When it comes to some cultures, this can become a significant issue.
Many things can result in religious persecution, especially in lands where the State imposes its views on citizens. Anyone bold enough to publicize their opposing views is often criticized, shunned and even viewed as a threat to that States security. Socially, demeaning the religious view of any group can lead to violent uprisings, at the least. Unfortunately, the violence that religious persecution has led to in many lands has become so bad that it can be referred to as a human rights issue.
10. Africa’s Cry for Religious Freedom
9. American Outcry
8. Falun Gong
7. Martin Luther
6. Charlemagne’s Pagan Persecution
5. Stalin’s Deadly Rule
4. Hitler’s Horrendous Hatred
2. Bloody Mary (Mary Tudor)
1. Jesus of Nazareth
As you can see, religious persecution is nothing more than an oppressive act. If it were meant for all people to believe the same things…would we not have been created with the same brains? How long will it take for those in positions of power to understand that eventually the subjects of their oppression will grow tired of being victimized? How long will it take those being victimized to find a way to break free?
For so long, so many people have been robbed of so many freedoms. If one man wasn’t better than another because of the color of his skin; can he be better than him because of his faith? There are two themes that seem to be prevalent in almost every religion known to man; love and peace. How much peace can there be if one man can’t love another, simply based on which or how many God’s they serve? Is anyone’s God really happy with their behavior towards another human being? Most of all, does anyone really believe they’re guaranteeing their place in their faith’s Eden by exhibiting what can clearly be called hatred?
Persecution of Christians
In jail for changing his status from Muslim to Christian. Having the AUDACITY to not leave his country and go into hiding, but chose to stay and record when the Muslim Brotherhood took over during the Arab Spring.
The true reason for the extreme prison sentence most likely lies in Bishoy’s history. In 2007, Bishoy, then Mohammed Hegazy, petitioned the Egyptian government to change his official religious status, an unprecedented move in a thoroughly Islamic society. Bishoy converted to Christianity from Islam in 1999 at age 17. His public request to change his religious status generated death threats and forced Bishoy and his family into hiding.
When he was arrested, Bishoy was in southern Egypt filming clashes that resulted after Muslim Brotherhood candidate Mohammed Morsi was ousted from office in July 2013. Hundreds of Christians were attacked, some kidnapped and thousands of churches and Christian businesses throughout the country were looted and destroyed.
Another former Muslim
Alireza Seyyedian is a 37-year-old former Muslim who has been a Christian since 2006. Last year, security forces confiscated his computer during a raid on his apartment. Authorities then discovered video of Alireza’s baptism in Turkey on the computer. In December 2011 he was sentenced to six years in prison, for crimes against national security and propaganda against the regime.
The judge stated that since Alireza was baptized in Turkey, he was trying to express the lack of freedom in Iran and was therefore was propagating against the regime. He was also accused of holding regular meetings with former Muslims and distributing Bibles among youth. They also said he had communication with Zionist satellite TV channels such as Mohabat TV and Radio Mojde and shared worship hymns he had written with them. The verdict also falsely accused him of being a member of the Jesus Only cult.
There are more here, and no, not all are Muslim. I think everyone should have the right to chose your own religion, whether it be Muslim, Christianity, Judaism, or yes, even Atheism. Only YOU can make the choice right for you.
edit on 1/31/2015 by Anyafaj because: (no reason given)
originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: Punisher75
so basically, be quiet and mind the company you keep.