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The Immorality Of Eating Meat When There Are Vegi Alternatives Do People Care?

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posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 09:20 PM
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originally posted by: jedi_hamster

originally posted by: KnightLight

But vegetarians are fine.




boiled or roasted?

not my cup of tea either.


Are you going to cannabalism in a morality discussion?




posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 09:22 PM
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a reply to: FormOfTheLord


So all beings have a right to life wether we decide they do or not.

Where did this come from? The logical leap is not an Olympic event. Wasting time and effort training for it.



Even plants and animals have a right to life.

If YOU believe that then YOU stop eating them.



To see yourself as above right and wrong isnt wisdom.

To see yourself as the arbiter of right and wrong is arrogant, and delusional. Add hypocritical considering your previous statements on the matter of morality being a personal choice.



What gets me is people act as if they dont know right from wrong

What gets me is people who think they alone decide right and wrong in contradiction of their previous statements to the contrary.



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 09:23 PM
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a reply to: DenyObfuscation

What I said was not a dig but if you see it in that way (personal) what can I say

You seem to want pick an argument rather than discuss or am I seeing that wrong

Yes it does seem ridiculous to me to compare a plant with an animal ... that is my opinion ... I have explained why I see that the way do ...

To answer your question ... I don't see any Morals in the personal choice of what one chooses to eat ... I have never stated that ... that was the OPs word ... If it is right for you then it is your choice and if I try to persuade you differently then I am wrong in my own mind ... as I stated I am not attempting to convert you to my way of thinking ...

My line is drawn as I stated ... I eat plants and feel that that is right for me ... but do not eat animals because it would not be right for me ... because I could not kill them

What is right for you is right for you ... and non of my business





edit on 13-2-2015 by artistpoet because: Typo



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 09:24 PM
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.
edit on 13-2-2015 by HarbingerOfShadows because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 09:30 PM
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We each have our own personal morals for the choices we make ... and they differ ...
What can I say



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 09:32 PM
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a reply to: artistpoet


What is right for you is right for you ... and non of my business

We're on the same page there pretty much.



My line is drawn as I stated ... I eat plants and feel that that is right for me ... but do not eat animals because it would not be right for me ... because I could not kill them

Somewhere between cows and plants are living beings that you either feel it's ok to kill, or kill/support their killing in some way despite your stated position. Am I incorrect?



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 09:38 PM
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a reply to: DenyObfuscation




Somewhere between cows and plants are living beings that you either feel it's ok to kill, or kill/support their killing in some way despite your stated position. Am I incorrect?


I see animals as living beings ie sentient ... plants are alive but not sentient in my opinion ... though I do believe Intelligence runs through all living things ... but do not see plants as concious beings ie sentient... so I draw a different definition between plants and cows ... hope I have explained myself clearer



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 09:43 PM
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a reply to: artistpoet


hope I have explained myself clearer

We're off of plants. What non-plants do you kill or support the killing of (indirectly?)?



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 09:58 PM
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a reply to: DenyObfuscation

By non plants I assume you mean animals ... I don't kill any animals directly or indirectly nor birds ... If others kill animals or birds for food that is their business not mine ... But I must say if someone was killing an animal for fun or sport I would object and physically intervene ...Have I answered your question



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 10:09 PM
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originally posted by: artistpoet
a reply to: DenyObfuscation

By non plants I assume you mean animals ... I don't kill any animals directly or indirectly nor birds ... If others kill animals or birds for food that is their business not mine ... But I must say if someone was killing an animal for fun or sport I would object and physically intervene ...Have I answered your question


Star for you, I feel that wholeheartedly. I hate it when people just blast birds for target practice on camping trips, I just don't get it. I'll take an animal if I am needing food, and I will thank it's spirit.

Last year I went on an Adventurous camping/black bear hunting trip in a remote part of Alaska.

I could never kill a bear unless it was charging me, I was praying to God that we not actually stumble across one cause I was in their home witha freakin 12 gauge, uninvited.

I was in it for the scenery and the strenuous rewarding hike/post celebration...........thank God, prayers came true. (though we were surrounded by them and we either heard a large Brownie or a Sasquatch........anyway, I even rescue spiders, daddy long legs, flies and the like from time to time I kid you not.
edit on 13-2-2015 by GoShredAK because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 10:20 PM
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a reply to: FormOfTheLord

are you going to tell us what to think now?
you know, looking at the history of human civilization, attitude like that never got really appreciated in the end.

why bother trying?
do you have any idea how ridiculous bible thumping with spinach and apples is?



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 10:23 PM
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originally posted by: DenyObfuscation
a reply to: FormOfTheLord




So all beings have a right to life wether we decide they do or not.



Where did this come from? The logical leap is not an Olympic event. Wasting time and effort training for it.






Even plants and animals have a right to life.



If YOU believe that then YOU stop eating them.






To see yourself as above right and wrong isnt wisdom.



To see yourself as the arbiter of right and wrong is arrogant, and delusional. Add hypocritical considering your previous statements on the matter of morality being a personal choice.






What gets me is people act as if they dont know right from wrong



What gets me is people who think they alone decide right and wrong in contradiction of their previous statements to the contrary.


Dont tell others how to live thier life, this is a moral discussion if you cant talk about morality why are you even posting on this thread.

I dont see myself as arbiter of right and wrong.

What is morality to you?
Do you define good as whatever you want it to be and bad as whatever you dont like, or is it more than that to you?

When asked about your stance on morals you go to petty insults like arrogant, delusional, and hypocritical.
Have you ever looked in the mirror at yourself and thought that you may be the things you seem so intent on calling others?



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 10:26 PM
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originally posted by: FormOfTheLord

originally posted by: DenyObfuscation
a reply to: FormOfTheLord




So all beings have a right to life wether we decide they do or not.



Where did this come from? The logical leap is not an Olympic event. Wasting time and effort training for it.






Even plants and animals have a right to life.



If YOU believe that then YOU stop eating them.






To see yourself as above right and wrong isnt wisdom.



To see yourself as the arbiter of right and wrong is arrogant, and delusional. Add hypocritical considering your previous statements on the matter of morality being a personal choice.






What gets me is people act as if they dont know right from wrong



What gets me is people who think they alone decide right and wrong in contradiction of their previous statements to the contrary.


Dont tell others how to live thier life, this is a moral discussion if you cant talk about morality why are you even posting on this thread.

I dont see myself as arbiter of right and wrong.

What is morality to you?
Do you define good as whatever you want it to be and bad as whatever you dont like, or is it more than that to you?

When asked about your stance on morals you go to petty insults like arrogant, delusional, and hypocritical.
Have you ever looked in the mirror at yourself and thought that you may be the things you seem so intent on calling others?


"why are you even posting on this thread".
yet you claim you're no arbiter.

the hell you're not. you're constantly telling people to GTFO from your threads whenever you disagree with someone. it's really getting boring.



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 10:30 PM
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originally posted by: jedi_hamster
a reply to: FormOfTheLord



are you going to tell us what to think now?

you know, looking at the history of human civilization, attitude like that never got really appreciated in the end.



why bother trying?

do you have any idea how ridiculous bible thumping with spinach and apples is?

Why are you jumping to that when asked about your morals you think someone is telling you how to live, are you unable to have a discussion without feeling as though your being told to do something by a Bible thumper?

I have said follow your bliss, do what feels right for you, and the insinuation that I have ever said otherwise is false.
So when you discuss your position on morality your reaction is he is telling us how to live? What is that about?
Discuss morality and not me if you can.

I wonder where people get these ideas from, why can no one deal with the immorality of killing other beings, and then say its not immoral at all.



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 10:32 PM
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originally posted by: jedi_hamster

originally posted by: FormOfTheLord


originally posted by: DenyObfuscation

a reply to: FormOfTheLord








So all beings have a right to life wether we decide they do or not.







Where did this come from? The logical leap is not an Olympic event. Wasting time and effort training for it.












Even plants and animals have a right to life.







If YOU believe that then YOU stop eating them.






To see yourself as above right and wrong isnt wisdom.







To see yourself as the arbiter of right and wrong is arrogant, and delusional. Add hypocritical considering your previous statements on the matter of morality being a personal choice.












What gets me is people act as if they dont know right from wrong







What gets me is people who think they alone decide right and wrong in contradiction of their previous statements to the contrary.




Dont tell others how to live thier life, this is a moral discussion if you cant talk about morality why are you even posting on this thread.



I dont see myself as arbiter of right and wrong.



What is morality to you?

Do you define good as whatever you want it to be and bad as whatever you dont like, or is it more than that to you?



When asked about your stance on morals you go to petty insults like arrogant, delusional, and hypocritical.

Have you ever looked in the mirror at yourself and thought that you may be the things you seem so intent on calling others?




"why are you even posting on this thread".

yet you claim you're no arbiter.



the hell you're not. you're constantly telling people to GTFO from your threads whenever you disagree with someone. it's really getting boring.


Now your just lying, I have never said such things can you discuss the topic and not the poster or are you dead set on going against T&C of ATS?



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 10:37 PM
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a reply to: artistpoet


Have I answered your question

No. Maybe this will help, is pest control acceptable? How about lawn mowing? That has to kill a few things. As I said earlier, somewhere between cows (an animal that is eaten) and plants (not plants, again between cows and plants) are living things we kill either directly or indirectly. Do you have a 'line'? If so, where is it?

Is it moral to 'steal' the habitat of animals (that's gotta cause a little suffering, no?) as humans spread out and do evil things like build houses and roads and # like that?



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 10:40 PM
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originally posted by: artistpoet
a reply to: DenyObfuscation



By non plants I assume you mean animals ... I don't kill any animals directly or indirectly nor birds ... If others kill animals or birds for food that is their business not mine ... But I must say if someone was killing an animal for fun or sport I would object and physically intervene ...Have I answered your question





This is a video which deals with the lack of morality in our society today, killing animals without the need to do so. There is no excuse for killing even a mouse if there is no need, meaning its not on your properity and your just killing it for the fun of killing it. If this guy is caught he faces jail time why because what he did was wrong, why because its immoral to kill an animal when there is no need to do it.

Notice the bounty on his head keeps going up.

In the same way to kill and animal like a bird flying around the city would most likely get you jail time too.
edit on 13-2-2015 by FormOfTheLord because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 10:43 PM
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a reply to: FormOfTheLord

Really it a matter of empathy, if a person is cruel to animals they end up being the ones that can quite easily kill a human. Because they are halfway there. Farmed Animals exist purely as numbers on a profit and loss sheet. Absolutely no regard is spent on their personal welfare unless it hits the bottom line. Anyone who has a relationship with an animal realises that their consciousness is just as important to them as ours is to us . Eating a bit of their body, if you know the animal in question, is just bad karma and a waste . The meat will rot in your guts, and cause serious health problems over time. I knew a lot of people that worked in freezing works, and they would smuggle the best cuts of steak and eat it every evening. Without an exception they all died of bowel cancer, around fifty.



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 10:53 PM
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originally posted by: DenyObfuscation
a reply to: artistpoet




Have I answered your question



No. Maybe this will help, is pest control acceptable? How about lawn mowing? That has to kill a few things. As I said earlier, somewhere between cows (an animal that is eaten) and plants (not plants, again between cows and plants) are living things we kill either directly or indirectly. Do you have a 'line'? If so, where is it?



Is it moral to 'steal' the habitat of animals (that's gotta cause a little suffering, no?) as humans spread out and do evil things like build houses and roads and # like that?


Use common sense to answer all of those questions.
To kill for no reason other than you want to do it is considered a bad thing.

Try it out and see, cut some trees downtown and the cops will be there in no time.
If its on your own property no one will fault you for it.

As to the OP killing animals when there is no need its a different topic than what your talking about. The point is you dont need to kill animals to survive its done out of want.

The fact of the matter is people dont want to see it as a bad thing even though they know its not a morally good thing to kill other creatures without the need.

Your continual discussion on killing plants has nothing to do with killing animals.

Your refusal to talk about what you even think morality is when it comes to killing animals without the need to do so tells us alot.



posted on Feb, 13 2015 @ 10:56 PM
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originally posted by: FormOfTheLord

originally posted by: jedi_hamster
a reply to: FormOfTheLord



are you going to tell us what to think now?

you know, looking at the history of human civilization, attitude like that never got really appreciated in the end.



why bother trying?

do you have any idea how ridiculous bible thumping with spinach and apples is?

Why are you jumping to that when asked about your morals you think someone is telling you how to live, are you unable to have a discussion without feeling as though your being told to do something by a Bible thumper?

I have said follow your bliss, do what feels right for you, and the insinuation that I have ever said otherwise is false.
So when you discuss your position on morality your reaction is he is telling us how to live? What is that about?
Discuss morality and not me if you can.

I wonder where people get these ideas from, why can no one deal with the immorality of killing other beings, and then say its not immoral at all.


killing for fun is immoral.
killing for food is nature's law.

it's your God's law.

by the very use of 'immorality of killing other beings' phrase you make a claim that you know what is moral and what is not. and you don't.

US military killing civilians in iraq - that is immoral.
killing a thief with a gun at your house is not.
just like lion killing someone for food is not.
just like lion killing someone to defend himself is not.

this very thread implies what you think is immoral and what others should consider as immoral. it turned into a morality discussion only because many people disagree with you, so that's the only ground you can have any stand on.

now, i'm not saying the way animals are treated, is moral. no way.
but if i would be alone on an island, and i would have a choice - to kill an animal or die because of hunger - i would kill. and if someone would show up and called it immoral, he would get the next bullet.



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