It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

All Church Age believers are priests, so why do Catholics ordaine their own priests?

page: 2
4
<< 1    3  4  5 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 06:41 AM
link   

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: zazzafrazz

Your observation is correct, I am anti-catholic, but not because I was bred this way. Until recently I knew nothing about the catholic faith other than the Pope and the huge cathederals. As I began to learn about the Catholic traditions, the more I began to realize that it has very little to do with the bible.

Most Christians acknowledge that we are to hold the Bible as the Word of God. By doing that very thing myself, Im just in utter shock at what the catholic church feeds its followers.

What really bothers my is how Christ made us all priests, yet the Catholic church insists on forcing a false priesthood onto its followers. Its slavery in my eyes.

I have more respect for Islam. Atleast the muslims that I know actually follow what their holy book says.

The bible is an instruction book for our spiritual life. If the catholic traditions are true, then they must harmonize with the bible, but an objective look at the catholic claims prove that not to be the case.

Again, I made this thread to address specific points directed at me by a specific member. We will see how this develops.


And if we are all made priests, what are the duties as priests?

Shouldn't you be wearing sackcloth and ashes to pray for the sins of the people? As a priest, what are you called to perform as a priest?




posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 06:52 AM
link   
a reply to: WarminIndy
The statement that believers as a body have been made "a kingdom and priests" is found in Revelation. ch1 v6, ch5 v10.
Yes, it is probably best to take it as "having responsibility to pray for the rest of the world".


edit on 15-1-2015 by DISRAELI because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 07:36 AM
link   
The first 2 chapters of Baruch describes how early Jewish exiles repented of their sins. They repented to God, and to the priests in Jerusalem.

Oh wait, your bible doesn't have The Book of Baruch. Your bible is missing 7 books actually. Why are they missing? Because the Protestant Deformer, Martin Luther, deleted them.

Now why would he do that?




a reply to: BELIEVERpriest



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 07:49 AM
link   

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
As I began to learn about the Catholic traditions, the more I began to realize that it has very little to do with the bible.

I suggest that, instead of getting your education via Jack Chick tracts and anti-Catholic fundamentalist preachers, you actually go to the source and read what they believe and why. Catechism of the Catholic Church

edit on 1/15/2015 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 07:55 AM
link   

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
how can the Roman Catholic political powerhouse justify the ordination of "catholic priests",


If you really wanted to know, you'd go to one of the many Catholic sites on the internet and read where the priesthood comes from. The Catholic priesthood comes from scripture and from JESUS Himself.

The Priesthood is both Ministerial and Universal

Where in the New Testament Are Priests Mentioned

History of Priesthood - from Pagans to Christians



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 07:59 AM
link   

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
Peter was the first brick to be layed on the cornerstone as he was the first to confess the faith, but that does not give him more authority.


Peter was give full authority over the Church by Christ Himself. And it is very clear by the actions of the apostles that Peter had authority over them.

Matthew 16:18-19

And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.

The Primacy of Peter

Peter and the Papacy

Peter alone was promised something else also: "I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven" (Matt. 16:19). In ancient times, keys were the hallmark of authority. A walled city might have one great gate; and that gate had one great lock, worked by one great key. To be given the key to the city—an honor that exists even today, though its import is lost—meant to be given free access to and authority over the city. The city to which Peter was given the keys was the heavenly city itself. This symbolism for authority is used elsewhere in the Bible (Is. 22:22, Rev. 1:18).


50 Testament Proofs Peter In Charge of Apostles and Church
Peter is specified by an angel as the leader and representative of the apostles (Mk 16:7) and Peter takes the lead in calling for a replacement for Judas (Acts 1:22). Peter instructs the other apostles on the catholicity (universality) of the Church (Acts 11:5-17) and he is the first to receive the Gentiles, after a revelation from God (Acts 10:9-48). Peter is often spoken of as distinct among apostles (Mk 1:36; Lk 9:28,32; Acts 2:37; 5:29; 1 Cor 9:5) .... the list goes on and on.


5. Peter is almost without exception named first whenever he appears with anyone else. In one (only?) example to the contrary, Galatians 2:9, where he ("Cephas") is listed after James and before John, he is clearly preeminent in the entire context (e.g., 1:18-19; 2:7-8).

6. Peter alone among the apostles receives a new name, Rock, solemnly conferred (Jn 1:42; Mt 16:18).

7. Likewise, Peter is regarded by Jesus as the Chief Shepherd after Himself (Jn 21:15-17), singularly by name, and over the universal Church, even though others have a similar but subordinate role (Acts 20:28; 1 Pet 5:2).

8. Peter alone among the apostles is mentioned by name as having been prayed for by Jesus Christ in order that his "faith may not fail" (Lk 22:32).

9. Peter alone among the apostles is exhorted by Jesus to "strengthen your brethren" (Lk 22:32).

edit on 1/15/2015 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 08:36 AM
link   
a reply to: Ignatian




Like another poster stated, Spend more time with Christ, and less time in bashing His Church.


That was uncalled for!



How soon so many folks forget, we were ALL Catholics until the Protestant Deformation/Reformation.


No. You had your Ebonites, Nazarenes, Gnostics, Marcions, Manichees, Arians, and more. The Roman Catholic Church was established by the end of the sword, not by the words of a gentle Jewish guru.

There was no unification of beliefs in the early days of the church. In fact, as evidenced by how upset you get at just the mention of James the Righteous, the reality of the leadership of James the Righteous in Jerusalem shakes the foundation of the church's assertion of "Apostolic succession".

According to Josephus, the murder of James the Righteous was so disturbing to the Jews (and Christians) of Jerusalem, that it was his death that was the cause of the uprisings and eventual "Siege of Jerusalem" that destroyed the city, the temple and the culture of the Jewish people.

Perhaps, you should worry more about your spiritual relationship with your "Christ" and worry less about the bricks and mortar buildings that house your popes and priests.



edit on 15-1-2015 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 09:26 AM
link   
a reply to: Ignatian


Why did Jesus tell him to go see a priest?

Because at the time, Jesus had not fulfilled the Law yet. The Church Age did not start until Pentacost on the year of His crucifixion.

I'll reply when you answer all the questions i've posed to you in other threads. Your answers would expose your apostasy, so you wont.

I thought I addressed your points.

What is your authority? Who "made up" the ideas you espouse? Jesus started my church. Who started yours?

I already told you, Jesus did not establish a denominational Church, He gave us the Holy Spirit, Pastors and Teachers to study under, and our universal priesthood. Anyone with a bible, an pair of eye balls, and reading comprehension skills can pick up a bible and see that the Catholic doctrine is a fabrication.



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 09:31 AM
link   
a reply to: WarminIndy

As priests, we are to represent ourselves before God, confess our sins to Him when needed, and pray for ourselves and those around us. We also represent God on earth to those who do not have the light. During the Millennium, Im sure our priestly duties will be more like that of Melkizedek's, since the universal priesthood of believers only applies to the Church Age.



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 09:47 AM
link   
a reply to: FlyersFan


I suggest that, instead of getting your education via Jack Chick tracts and anti-Catholic fundamentalist preachers, you actually go to the source and read what they believe and why.


I dont know who Jack Chick is, but as free thinker, I was able to come up with my ideas independently, free from other teachers. All you have to do is read the bible within its context. Jack Chick must be wise man if his message mirrors mine. I guess great minds do think alike.

The Catholic priesthood comes from scripture and from JESUS Himself.

No, again, all Church Age believers are priests. The priesthood that Jesus established was universal for all His followers. The catholic priesthood is a fabrication of man. Jesus discharged us from the Law, and here the Catholic political complex is trying to create their own Law.

Peter was give full authority over the Church by Christ Himself. And it is very clear by the actions of the apostles that Peter had authority over them.

No, Petros, the small rock was the first brick to be set on the petra, the foundation stone. Jesus established the Church on Himself. This is the literal interpretation. While Peter was given the authority as a single Apostle, James had the authority over the Apostolic body. That is what the bible plainly states.

Perhaps if you actually took the time to read what I wrote, I would not have to repeat myself.
edit on 15-1-2015 by BELIEVERpriest because: typos



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 09:48 AM
link   
So your eyeballs and your own reading comprehension is your authority? YOU decide. Hmmm, okie dokie.

It's for this exact reason Jesus established His church. To guard the deposit of faith from anyone who comes along with a different set of eyeballs and comprehension skills, that could lead folks astray.


a reply to: BELIEVERpriest



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 09:53 AM
link   
a reply to: Ignatian

No, I am not my own authority. I already told you, Christ established our universal priesthood, so that we could learn from Pastors and Teachers, and discuss these concepts with God in prayer. By the Holy Spirit, I address these issues with God as all Christians should. We dont need the Catholic church to tell us what to believe, all we have to do is study under a Pastor and ask God in Jesus' name.
edit on 15-1-2015 by BELIEVERpriest because: clarification



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 10:00 AM
link   
a reply to: Ignatian

Rather than questioning my authority, why not address the issues that you raised with me? I started this thread in response to you. The bible should be our final authority, therefore an objective study of it will yield the truth.



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 10:18 AM
link   

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
Perhaps if you actually took the time to read what I wrote, I would not have to repeat myself.

I read it. It has been proven wrong. Perhaps if you actually took the time to read what I wrote, and read the information given, I would not have to repeat myself.

The topic - Why do Catholics have priests?
I have answered it. In abundance.
I suggest you read the information and learn.


originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
We dont need the Catholic church to tell us what to believe, all we have to do is study under a Pastor and ask God in Jesus' name.

If that's what you think then go do that and leave others to worship as they have determined God wants them to.

edit on 1/15/2015 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 10:29 AM
link   

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: zazzafrazz

Your observation is correct, I am anti-catholic


Thanks for answering, I know it can be annoying to feel you are defending a position. I am asking these question of you in the hope you delve a bit deeper as to whether what you are doing is for your own spiritual benefit?




Most Christians acknowledge that we are to hold the Bible as the Word of God.

What is the word of God in regards to judging your neighbour? Or Doing unto to others as you would do to yourself?
Place what you are doing in your anti catholic behaviour/actions to what the word of god would say you to do in dealing with a people who are trying (like you) to understand and live by the word of their god.




The bible is an instruction book for our spiritual life

What would the Bibles instruction be to someone who is worrying about an institution rather than looking internally to spirit. When you write in anger and judgement about Catholicism, can say you are operating from the word of god in spirit, or are you operating from a position of hatred or anger?

I am asking this as I hope you do turn your head a little and think on spirit, which your actions affect. When you operate in judgement, anger, obsession this makes a impact on "spirit" or mind. Your spirit (and mind) will be at ease if you can grasp what I am saying.


edit on 15-1-2015 by zazzafrazz because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 10:46 AM
link   
a reply to: zazzafrazz

I understand your concern, and I respect you for asking. The spiritual benefit is not for me and my issue is not on the individual level, but against the Roman Catholic political system. I want my fellow Christians to be liberated from catholic Law. Jesus established a universal priesthood that discharged us from the Law. My desire is for the edification of those who do not realize that they are free. Ill admit that I do get frustrated running over the same old ground over and over again, simply because no one wants to be on the same page.

I want my brothers and sisters to stop bowing to man, stop bowing to statues, stop praying to the dead, and be free as Christ intended.

I wont excuse my poor behaviour in the past. Im sure Ill be an A-hole in the future too. But I will say that even Christ had to step on a few toes to wake people up.

Religion is not exempt from criticism, and as long as I live, I will continue to reveal the cracks in the foundation of Religion. Through Christ is freedom, in religion is slavery.



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 11:00 AM
link   
a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Then you are operating from a position of anger, judgement and not from spirit.

I have found over my old decrepit years the louder someone yells, the more deep down they doubt their own beliefs. You yell to convince yourself of your 'correct' stance rather than coming from a soul/mind that understands self and has love for your fellow human (not just Christians)

Love is not lust, or in love , love is an Understanding.One of the genuine and few Understandings in the human experience. My last suggestion to you is to operate from Understanding your 'critics' rather than from anger and judgement.

Good luck with your journey, it appears it will be a life long one.



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 11:01 AM
link   
a reply to: BELIEVERpriest
They'd like the same for you ... liberation from the false interpretations you have been indoctrinated with.


Wouldn't it be nice if proselytizing Christians would stop spending so much time pounding on other Christians and instead took the time to clean up their own spiritual houses? Take care of the log in their own eye before trying to remove the speck in the eyes of others.



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 11:08 AM
link   
a reply to: zazzafrazz


I have found over my old decrepit years the louder someone yells, the more deep down they doubt their own beliefs. You yell to convince yourself of your 'correct' stance rather than coming from a soul/mind that understands self and has love for your fellow human (not just Christians)


This is not always the case, but I can see why you might say that.



posted on Jan, 15 2015 @ 01:22 PM
link   
a reply to: FlyersFan


The topic - Why do Catholics have priests? I have answered it. In abundance. I suggest you read the information and learn.

Very well, then I suppose your services are no longer needed here. This thread was really a response to a concern raise raised by Ignacius in another thread anyways.

I read it. It has been proven wrong. Perhaps if you actually took the time to read what I wrote, and read the information given, I would not have to repeat myself.

I'll read what you linked, but the bible speaks for itself, and it makes it clear that there is no such thing as a Pope or Apostolic succession. Those are inventions of men who twist scripture out of context. nd again, you have proven nothing.

People can believe what they want, but this is a discussion form, so I will discuss whatever issue I see fit to discuss. If you have something to contribute, then do it objectively, if you dont like the subject matter or my point of view, then do not participate.

People like to attack protestants theology all the time here, but now that I raise some serious issues in the Catholic doctrine, Im criticized for doing so.




top topics



 
4
<< 1    3  4  5 >>

log in

join