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Gun owners - Have you apologised for a spree killing recently?

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posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 12:55 PM
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a reply to: Krakatoa

Lol.
Who called anyone an idiot?.
People jump the gun without reading the full OP.
They see the title and jump to the conclusion that this is an anti gun thread...it isn't.




posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 12:55 PM
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originally posted by: neformore
I find it funny that while people were posting images backing Charlie Hebdo everyone got satire.

And yet when this issue is raised, suddenly they don't.



Using an inanimate object or tool to associate to a belief is stretching it some to connect the dots since moderate Muslims own guns too and extremist use them, so who apologizes to who again... lost my thought... hehe


edit on 11-1-2015 by Xtrozero because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 12:56 PM
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Because people make choice's nef, whatever there poison is (no pun intended) guns happen to be the choice of the idiots that choose to cause chaos, so the gun community should apologize for someone else's actions?

Maybe the knife community should step forward and apologize for all the stabbings too?

And the people that use rope should apologize for the strangling's?

And the people that have blunt objects around, or near their homes apologize for bludgeonings?

And the farmers should apologize for fertilizer and fuel oil being used for bombs?

Come on where is personal responsibility these days, why do others have to apologize for the actions of others?

Just like all Muslim's should not have to apologize for the wackos in their culture. lol




originally posted by: neformore

The problem is that people with guns kill people. And the gun community isn't doing anything about it.

When was the last time you saw a mass rally by gun advocates such as the NRA protesting a spree killing?

When was the last time a gun owner apologised to you personally for the actions of others of their ilk?

Why haven't the majority of gun advocates stood up and done something about the spree killings, weeded out these extremist spree killers before they've struck and got rid of them?

When will gun owners reform their views that everyone has the right to bear a weapon, and change the writen advocacy of such, and their enshrined laws? They obviously don't care or they'd have done something about it by now. They probably secretly support the spree killings don't they?

Why aren't the gun community doing anything?




edit on 11-1-2015 by Realtruth because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 12:59 PM
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a reply to: Spiramirabilis

If we were allowed to form teams here (totally against T&C) I would pick you.



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 12:59 PM
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a reply to: butcherguy

Bagsie in nets



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:00 PM
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a reply to: onecraftydude



Total BS. Following your flawed logic every gun owner is a terrorist.


We can replace the 'gun owner' with 'person of muslim faith' and it would prove the point of this thread!
This is what we are seeing in all the threads about how all of the muslims that are not doing anything are either to blame or are part of the grand scheme.

Awesome thread

edit on thSun, 11 Jan 2015 13:02:35 -0600America/Chicago120153580 by Sremmos80 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:00 PM
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a reply to: boymonkey74


Who called anyone an idiot?. 

Are you reading this thread?



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:01 PM
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originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: CranialSponge


Bad analogy or not, the entire point of this thread was to draw attention to the delusional mindset of group think and illogical generalizing.


It's only a bad analogy if you don't see that sometimes 2nd Amendment support in this country is also fervent ideology



I get the analogy and the satire.

The biggest difference is that there is not a sizable sect of 2nd Amendment supporters who recruit/indoctrinate/encourage people to become mass murderers because of a twisted idealistic interpretation of the 2nd Amendment.

So yes, it's a bad analogy. I get the joke but it's a bad analogy.



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:02 PM
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a reply to: neformore

No. Its a valid analogy. Just annoyed by all the posters saying "lol, it just went over your head, american's just don't get it" and not really making any real contributions themselves.

I know you mean well, but so many people use those exact same points mentioned in your OP. Just go to the comments section of any MSM article regarding guns. I don't know why i torture myself by reading the comment section on those sights.

I think what it really is, you hit a soft spot for a lot of people on here which i'm guessing was your point. So... good job.



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:02 PM
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A thread that should have been a discussion about the responsibilities of those who hold certain religious beliefs becomes a discussion about those who hold certain cultural beliefs which then turns into a discussion about the legitimacy of a specific genre of literature which seems to be turning into a specific critique of the OP's use of Satire.

I need a drink.



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:03 PM
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originally posted by: neformore
I find it funny that while people were posting images backing Charlie Hebdo everyone got satire.

And yet when this issue is raised, suddenly they don't.



everyone doesn't?



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:03 PM
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originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: Krakatoa

Lol.
Who called anyone an idiot?.
People jump the gun without reading the full OP.
They see the title and jump to the conclusion that this is an anti gun thread...it isn't.


Perhaps not. However, it does (in a deeper sense) equate a gun owner with extremist fanatical Muslim killers. It easily could be construed as a very thinly veiled attempt to hide an anti-gun stance....which is what some are responding to here. Adding a "disclaimer" at the end is merely an attempt to distance themselves from any controversy IMO. The OP could have chose a number of more closely related analogies, yet the choice of gun owner was chosen. Why? Was it to stir the pot and sit back to watch "the fun ensue" (which is the root of trolling posts which is against T&C's here as a mod would/should know). The analogy is an unfair one on its face, let alone in a deeper sense...I believe that is what the responses were about. But then, that is my opinion, as I do not KNOW what others are thinking nor would I be so arrogant to state that I do either (unlike some other members here).



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:03 PM
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originally posted by: Realtruth

Come on where is personal responsibility these days, why do others have to apologize for the actions of others?



Yes!!! You're right!!!!



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:05 PM
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originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: butcherguy

Bagsie in nets

I had to resort to the English to American dictionary for bagsie...
Calling dibs for those on the west side of the pond.



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:06 PM
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originally posted by: Krakatoa

Perhaps not. However, it does (in a deeper sense) equate a gun owner with extremist fanatical Muslim killers.



You're wrong there. It is equating a law-abiding gun owner with a peaceful Muslim.



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:06 PM
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a reply to: Answer

It is about the calling of the many to fix and prevent the action few and blaming the many for not doing it.
And then not wanting those actions of the few to be used to blanket the many.

It is all ways the gun owners that come out and say 'not in my name' after a shooting and that how it needs to be seen as isolated and nothing to do with gun owners as a whole.
Which fine, have that thought process but be willing to apply it to more then just guns.
edit on thSun, 11 Jan 2015 13:16:16 -0600America/Chicago120151680 by Sremmos80 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:08 PM
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originally posted by: kaylaluv

originally posted by: Krakatoa

Perhaps not. However, it does (in a deeper sense) equate a gun owner with extremist fanatical Muslim killers.



You're wrong there. It is equating a law-abiding gun owner with a peaceful Muslim.


Which, conversely, means that those gun owners that do not stand on the rooftops and openly rail against the psychos killing with guns are secretly in favor of it too. You cannot have one without the other. By dividing a group, as the OP did, you must have at a minimum two sides (which was clear in the OP was 2 sides).



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:10 PM
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originally posted by: kaylaluv

I know for a fact that there are people on ATS who think all Muslims should be wiped off the face of the earth. I don't know if any of them are on this thread though...


Ya there are some like that in all groups, don't see anyone coming forward though so maybe this whole point is wasted. I would love to debate a person with views like that, BTW.



I also know that there have been several members of ATS who say that it is up to the peaceful Muslims to stand up in massive numbers against the extremists. They say that these peaceful Muslims should do whatever it takes to "root out" the extremists and turn them in.


Since the vast majority of extremist are killing other Muslims I would say that would be a prudent choice. Muslims (over there) are very good at weeding out those who break Sharia Law, so I'm not sure the correct answer here other than they let this crap happen in their countries.



They say that if a peaceful Muslim does not publicly stand on a street corner and shout out their disgust with the extremists' action, then they probably secretly agree with what the extremist is doing. They say that the whole Muslim religion is a real problem (not even taking into account that it is the psychos that have hijacked the Muslim religion that are the real problem).


Having honest Mosques and down the street having a Mosque that doubles as a terror cell doesn't help the matter.



This type of thinking only fosters more distrust and more animosity towards a large group of people who haven't done anything and won't do anything to harm another. Rather than bringing us together to fight the good fight, it only separates us more and more.


Once again it is still a LARGE number even when it is a SMALL percentage of the whole. I do not know the answer here, but I do know that extremist are being created in schools as we speak and 6 year olds today that have zero connection with anything will be terrorist in 10 years if WE all do not stop it.



Your joke about drinking tea and smoking a peace pipe with the peaceful Muslims is actually a really good idea.


Hell no, I'm not joking.. I spent years over there, love to do it and play back gammon. BTW I love Ramadan..its like Thanksgiving every night for a month...hehe I think I'll be in Pakistan during that time so I'm stoked.



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:12 PM
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originally posted by: LiveForever8
A thread that should have been a discussion about the responsibilities of those who hold certain religious beliefs becomes a discussion about those who hold certain cultural beliefs which then turns into a discussion about the legitimacy of a specific genre of literature which seems to be turning into a specific critique of the OP's use of Satire.

I need a drink.


If you'll make two I'll have a double.



posted on Jan, 11 2015 @ 01:12 PM
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a reply to: Xtrozero

I agree with you X, very much so...



But I don't say these people are not Muslim...
I just stand by my point they're not living life in the way by the Quran...
So they're Muslim but they're not Islamic...

To make sense of this pedophile priests are Catholic/Protestent...
But they're not living a Christian life...


The only difference is excommunication...
Which isn't really a thing in Islam...
We leave excommunication up to Allah rather than just a human who says "they're not such and such anymore"...



The truth is there is a problem in the Muslim World, and we do our best to fight it whether speaking out, protesting, teaching young community members or like Hezbollah, the FSA, Iraqi Army, Kurds & the likes literally taking up arms to fight the scourge...
You may have seen my thread from yesterday establishing this...



I wouldn't say it's "a few", but it is "the few"...

I'd put money on the notion it's probably close to millions rather than hundreds of thousands...
All we can do is fight it on all fronts...




Sharia is confusing to me because the Quran does advocate Sharia Law & I defend the Quranic version...
Though punishment for crimes is rarely mentioned & it's usually for very serious crimes against Humanity...
Most times punishment is left up to Allah on the Day of Judgement, & I also advocate this barring serious crimes...

As an example, I'd never lose a wink of sleep watching or being involved in a Stoning of an IS henchman for their severe crimes against innocent humans.

But the common perception of Sharia is Saudi Arabia's or Sudan's etc versions which punishes the most minor transgression with barbarism...
& I'd never stand by this.


I'm more in favour of Secular Law, as Sharia is only meant for Muslims...
Outside the Muslim community punishment is still meant to be left up to the Law of the Land.



Hopefully this all makes sense, I'm not that good at expressing myself.



edit on 11-1-2015 by CharlieSpeirs because: (no reason given)

edit on 11-1-2015 by CharlieSpeirs because: (no reason given)



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