$15 an hour isn't all it's cracked up to be.

a reply to: onequestion

I was blind for a long time. I take that back, I was complacent.

a reply to: TheArrow

Not for everything. Some things are better served by other places.

What's the matter with choice? You don't like it?

a reply to: onequestion

That's how come economists say that raising the minimum wage is good for the economy - it allows people to spend money. Businesses need customers. That's why they recommend a national minimum wage of at least $10.00.

LPC's Leather Personnel Carriers!

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: TheArrow

Not for everything. Some things are better served by other places.

What's the matter with choice? You don't like it?

That was a reply to Jamie.

Choice is fine with me. If someone has a good product or service, it will find a place in the market. If not, it probably wasn't a very useful product or service.

originally posted by: darkbake
a reply to: onequestion

That's how come economists say that raising the minimum wage is good for the economy - it allows people to spend money. Businesses need customers. That's why they recommend a national minimum wage of at least $10.00.

Have any articles i could read?

originally posted by: darkbake
a reply to: onequestion

That's how come economists say that raising the minimum wage is good for the economy - it allows people to spend money. Businesses need customers.

But that's in the extreme short term. Long term, the economy stabilizes out at a new rate that basically reflects the new wage floor. In short, everything gets more expensive so you might as well not have gotten that minimum wage hike. If they were so effective at fixing everything, we wouldn't need to keep coming back to the issue and calling it such a fix now would we?

And I am speaking through the voice of experience having lived through one as a minimum wage worker.

Basically, you artificially raise the floor, and no one else gets a raise ... except for union workers whose contract wages are often based on the minimum wage. Everyone else has their wages devalued, and we all get to watch in woe as the prices around us get hiked.

a reply to: ketsuko

Whats the solution?

a reply to: TheArrow

It's what happens next that he probably doesn't like. Check out history. Lime pits for the masses isn't something I look forward to. Yeah, that may be a little over the top but I know humanity doesn't have a good track record. I'll keep the little bit of paranoia I have and use it to cut the cord.

It will be on my own terms. Not some rich bastard. If I do have to fight for that little bit of sanity, so be it. I can adapt. You chase the cheese they dangle in front of you. The wheel turns. You get older. You die. I'm not going out like that. My terms.

originally posted by: darkbake
a reply to: onequestion

That's how come economists say that raising the minimum wage is good for the economy - it allows people to spend money. Businesses need customers. That's why they recommend a national minimum wage of at least $10.00.

If it was so "good" for business, why haven't "businesses" done this on their own?

a reply to: infinityorder

That is why the lil 'snip'eating grin Gremlin is always advertising a reduction of .88¢.. You have revealed a sad TRUTH and I'm using the definition of TRUTH being something that will NEVER change.. You know it is non-positive if it doesn't change. The only constant in the world is "change" yet the guys at the top and their "greed meter" Like the bank robber that pulls enough licks that He becomes a "serial" bank robber. When one has enough $$ that their grandkid's grandkid's won't have to toil, isn't that enough???

Or...

Is this part of "their" evil plan? To starve out all the Serfs, if 'they' continue to accumulate all which is construed as "money" then the only folks that will be able to procreate are the ones with the $$$ and the greed shown here/now will grow exponentially down the time spiral. "They" would also be privy to the 'Pharaohs Secret" and work diligently to set things up ..

At one time most of the Top 10 wealthiest people in the U.S. were employed by Chinama...Walmart™ and at one time 'they' prided themselves on offering products Made in the U.S.A. now the only thing Made in the U.S.A. is "Mort" the greeter and He is 77 and NONE of them are scheduled for more than 30 hrs. this way 'they' can make them work OverTime and Walmart™ won't have to pay 1.5 wages and being 'part-time' they don't have to provide health insurance...

I'd also wager that the people who have read/contributed to this thread pay more in income tax than the top5 at Walmart™

a reply to: JimNasium

Only one problem with that. Squeeze too much and the peasant WILL revolt. The oppressed will eat their children. You can't oppress the human spirit. One of these days we're all getting organized. Many will die but after it'll be great. Pick a side. I already did.

a reply to: onequestion
Downsize,live with buddies/in-laws.
work cash jobs on wk/ends,
be creative with rice and potatoes,beans and eggs for protein; gotta do what you gotta do
Diversify: learn and practice a cheap-to-start trade that could result in self-sufficiancy eg painting, gardening,window gutter cleaning.
Take the bus or ride bike,avoid insurance/gas costs
live within your means: avoid credit (it is better to have no money than owe money)
For happiness: reading,excersize and sex, costs less than a dollar if you do it right

Poverty line in the late 90's was around 2000 a month, just a tad under that, think it was 22 000 a year.

$12 dollars and hour is what dry wallers got in the early 80's and in those day, apartments were 200 a month and you could purchase a house, also roughly 60 000, on that salary.

Do ya think we have a problem watson?

15 dollars an hour is peanuts and you can't raise a family on it, you can't rent a 1400 dollar a month house, a 1200 dollar townhouse, or a 1000 dollar a month apartment, and pay over a 1000 for groceries, all your bills, and have any money left over, oh wait, you're already vastly in negative numbers.

Some of us just keep waiting for the majority to say NO and not go to work, or whatever, but line up in front of their elected employee minions offices until everything is straightened. ie homes for all. Abolish money if necessary, and get a good world that does not involve forced slavery, but part time, and more Venus Project like, or shove it. Just everyone refuse to participate and take land in majority and build your homes and plant your gardens.

I just keep waiting.

This system is slavery, and therefore violates all forms of law, common and constitutional and is outrageous crimes against humanity.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: muchmadness

Its almost like whats the point right?

If you cant live to be an artist or a father or a brother or a whatever then whats the freaking point?

Are you lucky enough to at least be doing something you love?

This is the real point isn't it - not being able to do what you love/enjoy, that which makes life worth living.

It's a pretty new concept actually - quite progressive in fact - it was written into the Declaration of Independence the American Colonies.

This is where imagination, productive (rather then destructive - ATS calls destructive imagination - doom porn) imagination come into play. We have no example of a society (perhaps in some ways Bhutan with their 'Gross Domestic Happiness') were people actually can do what they are called to, without worrying about day to day survival.

Some will say, "Nobody will do the 'icky' jobs or the dangerous jobs." And I think that is a sign of the lack of imagination that keeps pulling us back towards the dark ages. I know people with, what I think, are 'nasty' jobs but when I hear them talk about them, I can get excited about 'solid waste management' or 'dog grooming'.

I can imagine a world where Doctors are Doctors, not for money, but because they want to help people and are facinated by the endless puzzles of people's health. Where leaders are servants and willingly drafted into service for the good of the people governed on a rotating basis and not seeking power and fame.

It's said that you are what you eat, I believe it's more likely that your life is what you think.

Because when it all come down to it survival isn't enough for humans (for animals masquerading as human - sure it's enough), True humans require more, require meaning.

originally posted by: LOSTinAMERICA
a reply to: TheArrow

It's what happens next that he probably doesn't like. Check out history.

Government steps in and breaks up the monopolies.

Yup, that's what happens next. I think this will be the 5th cycle of Anti-Trust bull# our country is dealing with, and it has to be reset every few years.

I imagine it will start in the 2020s.

a reply to: Unity_99

15 dollars an hour is peanuts and you can't a family on it,

Then people need to plan better. Why in the hell would people try and start a family making only 15 dollars an hour?

a reply to: Unity_99

Illegals are doing the drywall now. This is how bad it's gotten. I worked in a CNC shop and 80% were Hispanic. The company was in the news for hiring illegals. They were fined but still have ILLEGALS. In Michigan! That woke me up. Innovation will take more jobs. Greed will take more jobs. What happens when people can't find a job? They better make one.

I'll bite.

The reason it is so hard in the states, and the world really, Is because they need money to fund all their black projects. You guys still think humans aren't in space?

You think D.U.M.Bs don't exist?

I think you guys get the jist. My solution:

Find your passion and go wild. Who cares anymore how far up the ladder you go. You can't take it with you when you die.

I have a skilled trade and pretty much have broke even my whole adult life. I've tried to make strides, but sh*t happens.. you know?

I had more to say but it would take forever to go through it all.

originally posted by: thesaneone
a reply to: Unity_99

15 dollars an hour is peanuts and you can't a family on it,

Then people need to plan better. Why in the hell would people try and start a family making only 15 dollars an hour?

No they don't. There is no planning better. I just gave the cost of a family, and that wage is not covering the basic expenses.

Oh, and that cost didn't include the real costs: medical, vehicles, breakdowns, repairs, emergency money, savings. The real cost is higher.

There is no planning for anything.

I WOULD NEVER WORK FOR ANYONE AS A SLAVE. It just takes others also not complying with the system in numbers for it to change.
Anyone who doesnt is committing hate crimes with their opinions and answer in the end.