Are Conspiracy Theories All Bad?

When it's just a 'theory' then it's bad.

IMO:
People who believe in them are the type that feel they have no control of their lives.
Mainly because of their intelect level.

A wise man once said:
If you turn off your computer all these conspiracy theories disappear.

People who believe in them are the type that feel they have no control of their lives.
Mainly because of their intelect level.

A wise man once said:
If you turn off your computer all these conspiracy theories disappear.

Bravo, and you have a point with the theories disappear and also you do admit that this is just your opinion in which I have no reason to bash and force my views upon you. But just try to bare with me and see things from a different angle here. You don't have to believe me, just consider it.

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle.

What defines someones intellect level? Degrees? Qualifications? I may be disillusioned here but I would like to think I am quite intelligent. Yes there are smarter and wiser men out there in the world but intelligence is simply an understanding of knowledge. For instance the doctor may be perceived to be more intelligent than the plumber by the general public until his hot water cylinder burst than the plumber laughs at the doctors ignorance. There are countless examples I could use to demonstrate the same point over and over again.
I myself hold two diplomas, which in my country is the equivalent of associate degrees. One in medicine, and another in civil engineering technology.. They are pieces of paper that say I have a general understanding of the subjects from an institute, I do not hold a degree or phD. Do the subjects I know make much sense to me... Well enough for day to day living and to earn my bread. However there are and have been countless men who have revolutionised and changed the world as we know it without degrees, phD's or whatever society demands us to have before possibly being "qualified" to form an opinion.

But just consider, what if as conspiracy theorist keep yelling to everyones anguish... That the schools are all indoctrinating us to not see outside the box and keep us working only for a capitalistic and materialistic world we have come to see. And by doing so, stopping and disallowing research outside this established way of thinking. Either by, as mentioned countless times on this ATS website, by ridicule, character assassination and purposely suppressing facts. How could you prove this either way. Hence why there is no moving forward or at least in my opinion very little.

Now bare with me but I would like to think I have a reasonable grasp on nutritional science, through years of health studies. I believe I am reasonably well informed on mainstream nutritional concept... When there becomes these debates over trivial matters such as "what is better for you, margarine or butter" I wanted to form an opinion.

Now I live in New Zealand, a country who has a very large dairy industry and the common belief that butter was full of cholesterol and saturated fats and thus was bad for you was held for a long time.. Until the media started stating that butter was actually better for you than margarine or other spreads because its natural and has more micro nutrients. Ok wow whatever, its a trivial issue and most people or almost everyone I know, took that theory immediately and went with it. (I'm not saying I don't agree with it I am just saying that there could be something bigger going on here so please stay with me on this.)
Anyway so just because I like to question things, I tried to research it myself and spent days reading studies. Which turned out to be a stalemate debate (in my opinion) between two large companies. One which was funding the studies on butter (our dairy industry) and the other (margarine).

Now again, such a trivial issue but lets look outside the box here, what do these industries especially the dairy industry have to gain by changing public opinion, using statistics in their favour to "prove" to people that butter is more healthy than margarines or alternatively the other way around. $$$$$$$$. Immediately after that study was released on the mainstream media, butter sales sky rocketed (go figure). So I know that this is only one trivial case, but the fact is any normal person who doesn't take the time to look would never have been able to see that this was all about money and that it could go either way depending on who's research you read. So what other area's of science share the ability to be able to twist and manipulate statistics in order to sell more products? Well all of them really. When you think about it,research labs exist for a profit, all scientist's who are hugely in debt to universities need money, so they too work for a profit. All statistics can be twisted in order to form an agenda, statistics is essentially just the politics of math. Only raw data really matters but who has the time to check all these things? Not the common "apparently more intelligent in your opinion" working man who is busy and distracted doing other things.

In my opinion, the second biggest issue with today other than the fact we value economy more than that of humanity. Is that we all perceive that unless you have spent years "studying" we are not intelligent enough to make an informed decision.
That, science as we know it now is unfortunately not science any more but essentially a tool used to promote sales.
That until we challenge this over all concept, we can never move forward because there are vast amounts of views that exist outside the "materialistic science" that just keep getting ignored. Not funded or otherwise censored in some cases.

And unfortunately this creates essentially a new form of dark ages which I would like to call (the information dark ages) not because we have no access to the information, but because so much of it contradicts itself that unless the time is taken to untangle it we are essentially at the mercy of whoever tells us more of these lies.

Turning off the computer, and burning all the books doesn't make these problems go away. It compounds further ignorance. Will it ever be transparent? Honestly I don't know but I would like it to be.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: LiveForever8
If approached rationally and in a healthy manner, with rigour and with clarity, then it is capable of being a vital tool to ensure the future freedom of the species, from those who would seek to enslave or blind us.

And what if it is not approached rationally and in a healthy manner, with rigour and with clarity? What if it is an all-you-can-eat buffet of folly, foolishness, forgery and outright fraud?

How do we regain clarity when people have muddied the waters of truth by taking a great big dump in the well-spring of ideas?

a reply to: Expat888

Well I don't know about your use of the word 'good' to describe them, I mean, they're all bad aren't they?

My question to you would be; why must one wade through #?

I think people need to focus on theorists rather than theories.

a reply to: LiveForever8

I have been delving into the arcane bowels of many subjects discussed here on ATS for nine or so years now, and previous to that had my concerns and questions about certain matters since I was a little boy, and did everything I could to figure the world out for myself, using simple logic, by reading up on matters scientific, by examining the economic and political landscape for myself.

In my experience, although there is a significant representation of fallacy and flawed logic being used by certain individuals to justify their own brand of conspiracy related nonsense, the vast majority of people with whom I have interacted on this site, have very valid methodology when it comes to formulating their world view, albeit some of them having a bias toward or away from certain political ideologies, which is to be expected.

Those who really have allowed fantasy to drive their understanding of events are in the minority, but their example is held up by certain elements of the press and intelligentsia, as reasons to dispose of the entire practice of thinking about conspiracy theories, despite the fact that conspiracy theories have been proven as conspiracy fact, and in a massive way over the last few years. From the arming of certain rebel groups over the last two decades, to the way wars are funded, to the NSA and their antics, there are damned good reasons to continue to keep ones eyes open for signs of fishy business, and no amount of smearing to the contrary is going to change the fact!

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: LiveForever8
Those who really have allowed fantasy to drive their understanding of events are in the minority, but their example is held up by certain elements of the press and intelligentsia, as reasons to dispose of the entire practice of thinking about conspiracy theories...

Well, I'm not sure about it being a minority. Go to your average conspiracy convention and you will more than likely come to realise that you are surrounded by truly unbelievable people. I went to such an event a few years back and despite being a lot more naive than I am now, I still felt 95% of the information being offered was at best inane and at worst downright ridiculous. But what made it worse was that I didn't really believe that the theorists themselves believed it.

Yes, we can blame outside influences, that's all too easy. But how about we stop giving them ammunition? How about we start condemning the crazies as hard as they do?

Maybe then the lunatics will stop running the asylum.

a reply to: LiveForever8

Well... I do not know about you, but I tend to give total nonsense pretty short shrift myself.

Personally speaking, I am interested in the possibility of intelligent life elsewhere in the galaxy or the universe, than our own planet. However, I cannot say, given the evidence which I have seen thus far, that we are or have been visited by such intelligences. There are cases which, despite years of research and very good, reliable witnesses, have yet to be fully understood, and it is very possible that they never will be for one reason or another, but I tend to apply the reasonable doubt measure to matters such as these, and there is a significant amount of reasonable doubt around to be had in these cases.

The UFO issue is just one of the many conspiracies out there which is often held up as being responsible for some of the bad reputation that conspiracy theory has in general, as are the call of "The Queen is an alien reptile!" and the joke that never gets old "Steven Greer is a legitimate source of information, and so is Alex Collier!".

To address your point about the contents of your average conspiracy convention, I must ask your forbearance while I lay out a counter argument.

I am a metal head, and I am fanatical about my music. I go to a metal festival every year, and it is full of other fanatical metal heads. I love lots of bands, and lots of bands that I love show up to these events! There are however, people who like a couple of metal bands, who would only enjoy a few of the bands that show up, and so they do not come to the festival, because they would rather concentrate their efforts on the stuff they really like, by going to a couple of gigs a year, featuring only the couple of bands that they really, really enjoy! There are more people doing that in any given year, than there are people who go to the festivals.

With conspiracy conventions, I personally see little point in attending any such thing, because although I like to think about these things and ruminate on their implications, I am also fundamentally aware that:

a) I am not fanatical about conspiracy theory, because to be fanatical about something which requires logic and reason, is somewhat missing the point of the whole affair, and does the enemies of truth and freedom more good than it does me, and...

b) That when one compares the number of things one hears about during a year, and the number of conspiracies one actually BELIEVES the tales of, one is often left with the impression that the signal to noise ratio is firmly biased toward the "total nonsense" category. The canny conspiracy theorist therefore, knows that a great many stands at the local convention, are likely to be taken up with products and information about the most unbelievable twaddle one has ever heard of in ones life, ownership or possession of which would mark one out as either having a marvelous sense of humour, or absolutely no capacity to separate the real world, from the landscape of ones dreamland.

However, these things do not mean that conspiracy theorising is bad. It just means that undertaking a mental discipline which requires logic and reason, and becoming fanatical about it to the point where reason and logic are abandoned in favour of a thrilling narrative or a reason to hate on the government, is bad. Thinking about the issues reasonably, evenly, without bias against or toward any particular group, race, religious conviction, or continental powerblock, and thinking about things from the perspective of the human race, not individual nation states, the better to shrug off propaganda from various sources, and maintain objectivity, THAT is a good thing, and always will be. THAT is what I believe it is to be a conspiracy theorist, in the best sense, and I think that they are in the quieter majority, than the louder, but more foolhardy conspiracy thinkers.

originally posted by: Astyanax
The question isn't really whether they're bad or good, though, is it? The question is whether they're true or false.

Well I suppose it depends upon your meaning of 'good' and 'bad'.

For instance;

9/11 is a good conspiracy in so much as it was a real event that effected millions of people all over the world and so it is therefore critical to discover the truth.

The face on Mars is a bad conspiracy in that it doesn't really matter to you and I whether there is a giant face on Mars and it is being covered up by the government/Illuminati for nefarious reasons. Also, it is tinged with madness and reflects badly upon the good conspiracies.

If that makes sense?

originally posted by: samkent
A wise man once said:
If you turn off your computer all these conspiracy theories disappear.

So basically, ignorance is bliss and don't mind the man behind the curtain?

Sorry, no.