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Jesus Didn't Die For Your Sins to be Forgiven

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posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 06:34 PM
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a reply to: jmdewey60




I think the idea is more like if you do not forgive, do not expect forgiveness.


But, if you do forgive, you can expect forgiveness, right? At least, on a relative level.

Don't the forgiven get to move upward and forward, in the spiritual divide?




posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 06:36 PM
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I think people like to believe in reincarnation because it provides the sense that you can screw up and get a do over.

Much like the false belief that you can sin and always be forgiven.

The fundamental problems are inherent within all manmade religions, doctrine and beliefs.

God created YOU. Mankind created religions.

Jesus died because he offended a manmade religious theocracy...

The ultimate lesson, perhaps completely missed.



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 06:37 PM
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a reply to: ausername

With respect

I believe we have been here on Earth many times
We are given more than just one go at fulfilling our purpose

It is not about how "Spiritually" learned we can become ... it is about how we care for one another and our Earth

If another does you intentional harm ... that other has failed ...
If you seek justice/revenge you also have failed and so the cycle continues

Hence Jesus taught to turn the other cheek and never complained of the treatment he received ... he forgave for he knew that those who persecuted him and his followers did so in ignorance and fear

edit on 3-1-2015 by artistpoet because: Typo



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 06:38 PM
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a reply to: windword

God forgave man from the start, why do you think Adam was allowed to live? The fact that Jesus was sent as the "Lamb of God who removes the sin of the world", was God's justification for forgiving us. He is now justified in forgiving us because our sins are removed by the blood of the Lamb.



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 06:38 PM
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a reply to: Grimpachi

Trying to confuse and mislead?

The two apostles might not have been together every single second when Jesus was walking up the hill to be crucified. Maybe Mark had to take a piss and did not hear when Jesus spoke or maybe he was praying and crying out loud. There are millions of reasons.

Trying to show contradiction based upon the story from two different men aspects is ridiculous. That is the beauty of the Gospels - seeing the story told from an apostle and what he saw and experienced - not what others saw and heard.

Its not like they compared notes before turning in their work.



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 06:39 PM
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dbl post



edit on 3-1-2015 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 06:46 PM
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a reply to: windword


I don't believe in empirical "good and evil". I don't believe that God is, and thus are we, at war with factions that rebelled against God in "heaven" and now have it out for us.


You don't believe that God is what?
edit on 1/3/2015 by Bleeeeep because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 06:52 PM
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a reply to: BELIEVERpriest




God forgave man from the start, why do you think Adam was allowed to live? The fact that Jesus was sent as the "Lamb of God who removes the sin of the world", was God's justification for forgiving us. He is now justified in forgiving us because our sins are removed by the blood of the Lamb.


(Shakes head)

Adam is a mythical figure. whom, if he didn't exist, none of the Abrahamic religions would exist. But, mankind still would be here.

The idea that the biblical God can only justify forgiving his creation, for doing what he could only have known ahead time that they'd do, by accepting final sacrifice, a human sacrifice of HIS OWN human blood, shed while being unjustly murdered by an ungodly crowd, is ludicrous and sick. Add to that the idea that God will condemn anyone that can't wrap their head around the concept to eternal damnation in Hell!



But, I know that's how the doctrine is justified.



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 06:54 PM
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a reply to: Bleeeeep




You don't believe that God is what?


At war.

Sorry about the sentence structure.



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 06:56 PM
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a reply to: Klassified

no need to research it myself anymore , decades of catholic private schooling covered it😏



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 07:09 PM
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originally posted by: DeathSlayer
a reply to: Grimpachi

Trying to confuse and mislead?

The two apostles might not have been together every single second when Jesus was walking up the hill to be crucified. Maybe Mark had to take a piss and did not hear when Jesus spoke or maybe he was praying and crying out loud. There are millions of reasons.

Trying to show contradiction based upon the story from two different men aspects is ridiculous. That is the beauty of the Gospels - seeing the story told from an apostle and what he saw and experienced - not what others saw and heard.

Its not like they compared notes before turning in their work.


They contradict each other. Did the two robbers on either side of him mock him or did one have a conversation with him? Was he silent till the very end or not. Why is there such a contradiction in what he said just before he died.

Look if you want to mishmash the two stories together and find some continuity that is fine but you should be sure that you are not following either gospel you are authoring your own gospel.



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 07:10 PM
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a reply to: windword

I am so going to hell lol.



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 07:14 PM
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originally posted by: zazzafrazz
a reply to: Klassified

no need to research it myself anymore , decades of catholic private schooling covered it😏


Ah, I see. Well, the Catholic church certainly has their own take on it. I don't know all of their doctrine on it, but I'm familiar with it. I'm much more fluent in the protestant/evangelical/fundamentalist doctrine.



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 07:16 PM
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a reply to: windword

The question I would pose to you is this:

Are we unconditionally loved in the afterlife or not ?



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 07:18 PM
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originally posted by: DoctorTruth

I am so going to hell lol.


Maybe you are.

You have Anubis as avatar, and if you cling to sinful western way of life where your actions hurt people and hurt yourself as well

Maybe you are..



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 07:18 PM
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a reply to: TryAndStopTheFuture555 no living person can answer that realistically.



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 07:20 PM
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a reply to: TryAndStopTheFuture555 anubis is a symbol of western way of life ???



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 07:21 PM
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a reply to: TryAndStopTheFuture555

I just do not get why God has to try so hard to kill his poor Son so everyone believes in him. I mean, there are perfectly decent, genuine people who do not believe in Jesus, like Gandhi, who will be damned to eternal hellfire. This is where my internal battle lies.



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 07:24 PM
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originally posted by: windword
According to one of the most basic of the teachings of Jesus, our sins are forgiven upon the "act" of forgiving the sins we perceive people are committing against us.




Matthew 6:14

For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.




Jesus reaffirms this promise in "The Lord's Prayer":




Give us this day our daily bread.

And forgive us our trespasses,

As we forgive them that trespass against us.





There is a certain Christian teaching that disregards this mandate, and claims that Jesus had to die in order for you to be forgiven. And even then, they add that you must BELIEVE that your sins are ONLY forgiven through Jesus' death and blood shed, or your sins won't be forgiven at all, even though Jesus went through all that trouble, FOR "YOU"! (Ungrateful Heathen)



More contradictory teachings from the doctrine of these Christians goes on to claim that if your sins are not forgiven, you will be sorted like wheat from chaff, and your worthless essence will be burned away. Some insist that even that's not the end, and that God will award your soul to Satan to torture for eternity. All this because God, supposedly, can't be in the presence of your "sin" of non-belief.



Jesus teaches us something different in his Sermon on the Mount:




And he opened his mouth and taught them, saying:



3 “Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.




Who could be poorer in spirit than those who have no faith and do not believe?



The "True" message of salvation that Jesus' teachings impart is that our "sin" is forgiven by "God" ONLY when others' sin is forgiven by us. It's really simple.




Matthew 9:13

Go and learn what this means, ‘I desire mercy, and not sacrifice.’ For I came not to call the righteous, but sinners.
















When you get a memory eraser when you come into this world, how DO you to really know any of this bible books writings, or any of the other crap is true? WERE YOU ACTUALLY THERE WHEN JESUS DIED ON THE CROSS FOR U, BUT YET SOME BOOK SAYS SO. WHO WROTE IT, WELL YOUR FELLOW MAN DID AND CHANGES IT NOW AND THEN. I have no #in clue about anything anymore. This world is a ses pool of
get one over on your fellow man. In other words, GO AND LIE,CHEAT,STEAL,RAPE,PLUNDER,KILL AND DECIEVE ONE ANOTHER WHILE YOU GO PRAY AT CHURCH TO BE SAVED. WHAT A BUNCH OF HIPPACRITS. YOU DESERVE WHAT YOU GET.
Happy New Year ASS.



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 07:24 PM
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originally posted by: TryAndStopTheFuture555
a reply to: windword

The question I would pose to you is this:

Are we unconditionally loved in the afterlife or not ?


Are we unconditionally loved by a being that is separate from us and judges us, or are we unconditionally loved by our higher selves?

I believe the later. I believe our essence is pure love.



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