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Jesus Didn't Die For Your Sins to be Forgiven

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posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:18 PM
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a reply to: Akragon

That is not what Paul said.

Jesus said HE will forgive us 70 x 7... So is that saying that we can sin all we like? How does that coincide with Be ye Holy even as I am Holy?

Its not a free ticket to sin, and never what Paul said.




posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:19 PM
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a reply to: Akragon

Amen, you are correct Jesus is the way. It's simple And you are right also that blood sacrifice does nothing is just a human act, not godly. And is also why Jesus came to start the reset Amen.

God Bless you and yours in these times Amen.





posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:20 PM
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a reply to: Akragon

I got it but decided to throw it in the garbage after coming to my senses.


Best decision I've ever made.



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:24 PM
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a reply to: Eunuchorn

A star for your avatar alone! Man, that gif lures out the ROFL in me every time.



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:24 PM
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originally posted by: OpinionatedB
a reply to: Akragon

That is not what Paul said.

Jesus said HE will forgive us 70 x 7... So is that saying that we can sin all we like? How does that coincide with Be ye Holy even as I am Holy?

Its not a free ticket to sin, and never what Paul said.


I know that's not what he said... but that's how it works with many Christians

As long as WE have faith... We are saved...

We're good people because we go to church and praise our God...

Until we leave that building, then we lie, cheat, and turn our backs on anyone who we dislike...

We shall commit all manor of sin whilst we are not in "Gods house" because we can just go back and sing a few hymns and praise him a little more... and all is forgiven...

sigh



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:27 PM
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a reply to: Akragon

And to get there they had to throw out over half the bible and you well know it!

This is why we don't pick and choose parts of the bible we might like the most and throw the rest away as if we had the ability to be gods and determine HIS truth for HIM.



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:27 PM
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a reply to: OpinionatedB

If Jesus forgives your sins through his sacrifice and sin is unavoidable then technically his sacrifice is a golden ticket to sin and get away with it.

Why make a concerted effort to not sin when it's unavoidable? Why try to not sin when you've already been given a free pass to do it as long as you believe a story from 2,000 years ago?

Christians may not realize it but they have convinced themselves that sinning is ok because they have a scapegoat that has, does, and will forgive all sins.



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:28 PM
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originally posted by: OpinionatedB

Jesus said HE will forgive us 70 x 7


No, Jesus told Peter to forgive 70 times 7. Big difference, but this mixing of sources and not understanding even the most basic of implications -- is very Christian. Ask 100 people about who said 20 classical Paul quotes, and nearly every Christian will say they are Jesus' words. Then try to ask them 20 Jesus quotes and see what happens. Christians aren't Christians, they are Paulians.



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:30 PM
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a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

I do not think sinning is okay. I think sinning is very very bad.. the last state of man is worse than the first.. that is what sinning after being saved is.

I personally like this state way too much, God speaks to me, teaches me, wraps me in this cocoon of love and peace.. I am not trading it for sins again.



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:30 PM
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originally posted by: OpinionatedB
a reply to: Akragon

And to get there they had to throw out over half the bible and you well know it!

This is why we don't pick and choose parts of the bible we might like the most and throw the rest away as if we had the ability to be gods and determine HIS truth for HIM.


Theres nothing in the bible that says "The bible" is all true... Gods word... or anything even close to that

That is called the traditions of the church and man...

The only verse that can even come close to it was from Paul... "All scripture is God breathed" and he was speaking of the OT, not the NT

and the OT is a Mess of mythology, legends, and atrocities commited by men with agendas




posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:31 PM
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a reply to: Utnapisjtim

I prefer to ask Christians if they've heard of the apocrypha or gnosticism. Then I point & laugh at them.



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:35 PM
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Watching this conversation go turbo....Have you ever considered that the discourse on these semantics, in truth may actually be we are feeding our own emotional needs and spiritualism has little to do with the conversation?

The behaviour rather than the words may need reflecting on.

Just a thought.



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:36 PM
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originally posted by: Eunuchorn
a reply to: Utnapisjtim

I prefer to ask Christians if they've heard of the apocrypha or gnosticism. Then I point & laugh at them.


Why?

PS: The eunuchorn's horn ought to be hanging down between his eyes



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:39 PM
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a reply to: OpinionatedB

What are the requirements for a true Christian?

Every Christian claims to be saved while condemning other Christians. Seems like they're all in the same boat to me.

Again, what are the requirements for being a true Christian? If faith is enough then all Christians are saved. If their actions betray them then works are more important than faith.



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:40 PM
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a reply to: Akragon

No, but God told me it was HIS word and that I could accept it as from HIM.. cannot prove that, you will simply have to discuss it with HIM.



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:43 PM
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originally posted by: OpinionatedB
a reply to: Akragon

No, but God told me it was HIS word and that I could accept it as from HIM.. cannot prove that, you will simply have to discuss it with HIM.


Again, bro, this is called a Positive Symptom of schizophrenia. I'm a sufferer of acute negative symptom schizophrenia. I believe something so fully it inhibits my ability to function within a normal society. I just don't have voices telling me what to believe.



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 12:53 PM
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a reply to: OpinionatedB

You are aware that if you hear voices in your head telling you what to do and don't, you are schizophrene. And if you act upon such intrusive thoughts carrying out such orders, I'd say you'd be a danger to society. Especially since you explain the identity of these voices as God, a known war criminal claimed to have ordered and committed war crimes of rather epic proportions, even having his own son killed for simply being his son.

So I ask you: If this God whose telling you what to do, one day tell you to kill the president. What would you do?
edit on 6-1-2015 by Utnapisjtim because: ....



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 01:01 PM
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a reply to: Utnapisjtim

"If God tells me to kill someone then it's not God. "

He did it in the OT so why not now?
edit on 1/6/2015 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 01:07 PM
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originally posted by: OpinionatedB
a reply to: Akragon

No, but God told me it was HIS word and that I could accept it as from HIM.. cannot prove that, you will simply have to discuss it with HIM.


I have... many many times just to be sure...

And I can prove it...

The NT says God is love...

Even Paul had some things right honestly...

4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

See if you can find any evidence that the so called god of the OT is ANYTHING like what Paul describes love as being...

I'll save you some time... but you can check for yourself...

The OT god is NOTHING like what Jesus describes... This entity does not know love, or mercy... or forgiveness even though that is what he/she/it claims... it is jealous, envious, prideful, blood thirsty, and seems to love to see humanity suffer... See Job for evidence of that

Thus... IT is not God

You want proof... all you have to do is look

open your eyes my friend, don't be deceived by the masses... take the narrow path


edit on 6-1-2015 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 6 2015 @ 01:41 PM
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originally posted by: BlessedLore
a reply to: zazzafrazz
I am yet to get a reasonable explanation.

Simple. Jesus died for our sins, God sent Jesus to die for our sins so the connection we lost with the fall of Adam and Eve could be re connected in whole again at the wedding of the lamb. Look at it like this. God did already forgive our sins, and manifested that by sending Jesus Christ to the earth to die for our sins. People then say if my sins are already forgiven what do I need Jesus for then? Well if Jesus died for our sins and we don't accept that we erase that blessing God gave to us. Without Jesus that is the second death because we turned from the son and the father. An example, At the food store a 12 pack of cokes cost 4.95 and 3.45 with your member's card. Now we know the price is 3.45 but if you don't show your member card you don't get that special price. Same thing with God, we know Jesus died for our sins and if we don't accept him then we don't get in at that special price(heaven and ever-lasting life) it's that simple.

Hope this helps and God Bless


Hi and thanks for your reply


It is similar to what I have heard before. I guess no one can give me a non faith based answer what death has to do with sins. That is my own fault in a way as religion is based on mostly faith and little evidences and fact.

I also find it hard to define sin. Sin back then is different to now, sin in asia is different to sin in india, sin in Nairobi is different to sin in Iran and sin in England. There are different cultural indicators for morality and they vary geographically and historically.

Also Mark is the oldest gospel and the earliest versions of Mark do not mention actual resurrection sighting, that was added a bit later. Rather it states historically in both Codex Vaticanus and Codec Sinaiticus that the apostles in their grief went to fish in Galilee, they were grief stricken at Jesus' death and felt no elation at being "saved". Being witness to such a global historic moment "the saving of mankind" should inspire some sort of elation yes? No sighting, no communication between jesus and the apostles is mentioned in these oldest artefacts/works on skin and papyrus.

It leads me to think that resurrection, death bathing in blood etc attaches the jesus figure to old testament prophesy and gives people hope that they don't just go away after death,....that's all its about really, is people are scared to die. Mummify yourselves, pray to a christ... it is all just a mortality fear issue.

Anyhoo thanks for your thoughts they are appreciated.

edit on 6-1-2015 by zazzafrazz because: (no reason given)



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