Poor Leelah!

Reading about Jeb Bush being the leading contender for Pres put me in a bad mood but this thread here just pushed me over the edge - www.abovetopsecret.com...

Why?

Because Joshua Alcorn decided to involve someone else in his suicide - the truck driver. You know they had to stop and get out after he jumped in front of the truck. That poor driver had to see the mangled body of that kid knowing that they ran him over. No fault of the drivers but that doesn't mean that they won't be scarred for life or have constant nightmares about it.

What Joshua did to that truck driver is unforgivable.
Yet it seems they want to make some kind of transgender martyr out of this kid.
If someone else's life is ruined nobody cares, they have their newest media hero.
If media bothered being factual they wouldn't constantly refer to him as "her".
But news isn't about facts anymore, it's about issues and agendas and screw anybody that gets hurt in the process.

Joshua wrote "I want my death to have meaning"
Well Joshua, you were so selfish and didn't care who else got hurt (the driver might have swerved and wrecked as well) I would say your death was selfish, cowardly and a waste of the life you were given.

Because he chose to make a total stranger the instrument of his demise he doesn't deserve all the fuss being made.

Rant off/

You just put into words my exact thoughts on this. Such a selfish act, giving no thought to his parents, family, or the truck driver. Permanent solution to a temporary problem, very selfish act. I don't think it should be getting this much attention at all, and he's definitely not a hero for it..

a reply to: Asktheanimals

I have to agree...the truck driver is in shock and trauma...what about his life? He was forced into a horrible situation not of his choosing.

I personally don't think suicide solves anything...because once you kill yourself all your chances are over with.

That former 17 year old is no hero; he is an example of what not to do.

I couldn't agree more. Kid didn't have the guts to face his/her problem. So he/she decided to make somebody else's life miserable. Nice choice kid, very thoughtless.

The kid in question was too depressed and far gone to be able to think about the truck driver's feelings at that time. When you're in that kind of an anguished pit, you are in an altered state and not capable of thinking the way you did, understanding consequences. I really hope you never reach that state. We had suicides in the extended family, ie my two oldest half brother, and aquaintance who hung herself as well. And I attempted suicide years ago, and you're not in normal mode of thinking, you can't see any alternative either, its an extreme place to be in.

Suicidal people do not think about the consequences of their actions. My Dad commited suicide in my garage about 8 months ago aand without disclosing too much detail-it was a violent and messy death.

Before committing the act, he took the house phone (unbeknownst to my wife and I) out to the garage and called the police to tell them what he was doing.

The police responded to our home in full force (again, completely unbeknownst to us as it was only 10 AM and we had just started cleaning)-and to my terror and confusion I rounded a corner after hearing authoritive voices and found myself staring down the barrels of assault rifles and pistols. The police literally came out of nowhere and could have shot me, my wife my kids or sister in law. No one knew what was happening until it dawned on me he was in the garage.

My wife, kids, sister in law, niece and I were held at gunpoint and forced from our home. I heard the gunshot and then had to watch as he was loaded into a helicopter and flown to Tucson where I sat by his side for 12 hours before I made the decision to pull the plug.

I still relive that day, every day. I had to literally clean up the mess, explain to my kids why grandpa killed himself and why cops came in guns drawn (chief came later and apologized gave the kids some stuffed animals and introduced them to the swat team, which helped immensely)

He never once thought about his actions which destroyed our family, drove all my siblings apart and left me with the memories that still haunt me to this day.

Sorry if it's TMI, its just I can relate to this kind of selfishness and it makes me angry all over again.

a reply to: Asktheanimals
Admittedly, I very much sympathize with the teen in this case, and defended his choice. I think we need to be better prepared to handle cases like these. However, I must agree that involving another person was a really bad choice, and could affect this driver for many years to come.

I have a friend who looked into a motorcyclists eyes on the highway, just before that same cyclist died underneath a tractor trailer right in front of him. He says he still sees and thinks about that day, many years later.

I do think we need to remember, that those who have been driven to suicide, whatever the cause may be, are not in their right minds at the time. This kid certainly wasn't.

a reply to: Asktheanimals

Joshua wrote "I want my death to have meaning"
Well Joshua, you were so selfish and didn't care who else got hurt (the driver might have swerved and wrecked as well) I would say your death was selfish, cowardly and a waste of the life you were given.

Couldn't have said it better. You hit the nail on the head.

a reply to: phoenix9884

There was a lot of selfishness going around in Leelah's case. Her parents were selfish in only thinking about how it made them feel to have a transgender child. Society is selfish in wanting to reject anyone who doesn't fit into their paradigm of what is considered normal. Lots and lots of selfishness.

originally posted by: Klassified
a reply to: Asktheanimals
Admittedly, I very much sympathize with the teen in this case, and defended his choice. I think we need to be better prepared to handle cases like these. However, I must agree that involving another person was a really bad choice, and could affect this driver for many years to come.

I have a friend who looked into a motorcyclists eyes on the highway, just before that same cyclist died underneath a tractor trailer right in front of him. He says he still sees and thinks about that day, many years later.

I do think we need to remember, that those who have been driven to suicide, whatever the cause may be, are not in their right minds at the time. This kid certainly wasn't.

I sympathize to a certain extent. I understand they're not in a stable frame of mind-many of us can't begin to comprehend such hopelessness-that's why it's important to recognize the signs beforehand and help. We've become so disassociated as a society we actively look away when people cry for help. We call then weak and tell them to deal with it.

I for one have 20/20 hindsight. I saw the signs and ignored them. We all saw them, as I'm sure her family did. The guilt is spread around to so many people it's amazing one death can have such an impact.

I believe that suicidal people can be saved...we just need to listen to their cries and take their hand when they reach out.

I'm no longer angry with my dad (it pops back up now and then as was the case earlier) but I've forgiven him and now I try my best to be there for the people I care about. No one should experience the loss of suicide.

I had no sympathy from the beginning...


This just cements my personal opinion on this.




Hopefully the driver feels no way about all of this & gets on with life, he has no reason to be scarred for life.

My grandpa used to drive a dump truck. One day he accidentally backed over a man and killed him. He became an alcoholic after that and went into early retirement because he didn't want to drive a truck anymore after that accident, even though he was only a couple of years away from retirement age.

So, yes. That truck driver is a victim, in a sense. He will have a hard time getting over this incident, and I hope he may find peace and stay away from the bottle, or any other self-destructive means, as a way of coping with this trauma.

Something like this makes people think about how death can affect those that still live. Ask a railroad engineer how they sleep at night after hitting somebody on the tracks. Some of those guys are messed in the head for a long time.

a reply to: Asktheanimals
Would it have been a spectacle that the media would have reported with such veracity if he had killed himself at home? I tend to think not so much. Also, what happened to the unspoken rule of not reporting on suicides in the media for fear of copycats? At least where I am from you don't hear about them...

a reply to: phoenix9884

I am sorry for your loss and for what your family had to go through.

My wife and I were just discussing how her father had found his Dad dead after shooting himself. He was 8 years old when it happened. I will admit to being very close to suicide on several occasions and even considering doing exactly what Joshua Alcorn did but the thought of how it would affect others was what always kept from acting it out. Depression is very debilitating and often suicide is simply a cry for help.

I know someone who was fired from their job and for a month all they could do was lay on the sofa. It took a lot of patience, prodding and listening to get them off the couch and back in to life. With help both they and I have managed to muddle through and keep living. Without it? I don't know if I would still be here.

Suicides are always a tragedy but in this case the fact the driver was left completely out of not only the kid's thoughts but the media's response struck a nerve with me. We must consider how our actions will affect others even in our final moments. That's not a bad philosophy for living either because we all make ripples in the big pond that everyone can feel.

originally posted by: superman2012
a reply to: Asktheanimals
Would it have been a spectacle that the media would have reported with such veracity if he had killed himself at home? I tend to think not so much. Also, what happened to the unspoken rule of not reporting on suicides in the media for fear of copycats? At least where I am from you don't hear about them...

I doubt the method mattered at all, I think the media is only concerned with the fact he was transgender.
That's what I meant by issue and agenda driven news.
For some reason LGBT teen suicides are newsworthy while other kids are not.

originally posted by: Asktheanimals


We must consider how our actions will affect others even in our final moments. That's not a bad philosophy for living either because we all make ripples in the big pond that everyone can feel.

On this, we can agree.

Funny how mental issues are treated differently in society.
Somebody that commits suicide is looked on with compassion as being sick.
A child molester obviously has mental issues but is looked at as a monster.
Yes a molester has a victim, but does he not also have a mental problem? Does he choose to desire children, or is his brain chemistry forcing him to act?

Gays don't decide to be gay, their brain chemistry decides that for them. I'm sure many struggle with this issue especially in their younger years. Do they act on their feelings or suffer internally with societies expected norms?

We have much to learn about the human brain.

If Joshua Alcorn wanted to commit suicide, that's his business. I support a persons right to choose to live or not. But I wish people who did this wouldn't involve others in their actions. I feel bad for the truck driver and for the parents of Joshua Alcorn.

a reply to: phoenix9884

I feel so terribly bad for you and your family. I sincerely mean that.What a horrible shock to have to go through. Suicide is a selfish act. They may not be thinking of it as such at the time,but it does irreparable damage to those that must carry on after. I thank goodness I have never had to go through that,and I pray I never will. People turn inward and start only thinking of themselves and the pain they are in(whether actual or imaginary)physical or emotional. They end up putting aside all those that could help them,and all those that love and care for them. They get so wrapped up in what they are going through,they can't see anyway out at all. It must be a horrible place to be.