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If the Universe created itself all on its own

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posted on Dec, 30 2014 @ 08:48 PM
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a reply to: Belcastro

I don't see the conspiracy in this OP.




posted on Dec, 31 2014 @ 12:03 PM
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a reply to: NOTurTypical




I don't see the conspiracy in this OP


So we cant discuss anything other than conspiracies on ATS? Just have a look at some of your own threads or even the forums. I do see perhaps wasting bandwith with no clear intent



posted on Dec, 31 2014 @ 03:06 PM
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originally posted by: TheConstruKctionofLight
a reply to: NOTurTypical




I don't see the conspiracy in this OP


So we cant discuss anything other than conspiracies on ATS? Just have a look at some of your own threads or even the forums. I do see perhaps wasting bandwith with no clear intent



This forum "Conspiracies in Religions", is about Conspiracies in Religions. Imagine that? Why didn't you make this in the "Origins and Creationism" forum?

So I'd like to know where the conspiracy is please, that's all.


edit on 31-12-2014 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 1 2015 @ 01:20 AM
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a reply to: Belcastro


believe this because Albert Einstein said the seperation between past , present, and future is an illusion so that means the moment of the big bang still exists , as does the present, as does the future.


I've always thought that the reason past, present, and future all exist at once was not because all things are one, but because we can only perceive the current moment. We need the assistance of nostalgia and memory to perceive the past, or daydreams and fantasies to perceive the future, but we can be acutely aware of the present by its very nature of existing right now.


This kind of thinking makes me want to believe that the law of one is real, but then again i dont know how the universe created itself all on its own via the big bang without something that created it.



If the big bang is real does that mean everyone and everything was God?


The same problem, of course, arises in the opposite model. Without the use of some kind of special pleading, which finds the Creator timeless, beyond space, and possessing an immaterial form, but still somehow capable of interacting with space, time, and matter, there can be nothing and no one that exists prior to the Universe's conceptual beginning.

In other words, "God did it" is no more satisfactory an answer than "the Universe made itself" is. Whether God or the Big Bang, you have something (the Universe) arising from nothing (the Big Bang, or a deity who is beyond time, space, and matter).

Therefore, God is a poor choice of word for what you're asking. God isn't anything more than a construct, derived from the minds of men, and used to fill in the gaps when our current understanding lacks an answer. The more that we study ourselves, our environment, and our universe though, the less necessary God becomes.

The origin of life is more likely to be found through scientific study rather than theological philosophy. Theories, like the Abiogenesis Model, provide a much more sound hypothesis for the origin and evolution of life from chemical reactions and cellular evolution, than ideas of godhead do.

The place for philosophy and spirituality is internal and personal. Those avenues exist to make you a better person. They do not belong in textbooks expounding the origins of life, or what our eventual fate is.


~ Wandering Scribe



posted on Jan, 1 2015 @ 04:07 AM
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If the Universe created itself all on its own

Then be afraid. Be very afraid.

Because if the universe can do this spontaneously, then whose to say that it won't at any minute spontaneously recreate itself? Of course to recreate itself, first everything in the universe would have to be destroyed. Because creation means coming to be from nothing.

IMHO, I'd rather believe in the creationist view of how things started. Much safer and makes more sense.



posted on Jan, 1 2015 @ 05:34 AM
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I bet there were big bangs happening all over the place. Some even overlapping eachother, not perfectly out of each bangs way. Matter comes together with other matter and it explodes into all kinds of energy forms and goes through stages of which DNA is one. There was no first big bang and there is no last one, it continuously goes on forever.

Sometimes I wonder if there are 2 universes, one seen and one unseen (maybe the hereafter) and energy goes from one to the next back and forth, setting things in motion to create new big bangs ad infinitum. Or even three, two unstable existences which continuously interact and a third (heaven), a soul would be created by matter then goes on to non-matter and when it is ready to go to the third, it leaves behind a soul which becomes neutral energy again and interacts with the first (matter) to charge it and create new big bangs.
edit on 1-1-2015 by johnnyjoe1979 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 1 2015 @ 05:57 AM
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In regards to matter, energy or 'stuff' .. you can't get something from nothing. You can add zero's all day, and you will never get a value.

In regards to 'God' or creator - if there is a creator, then what created it?

Based on whatever the case is, maybe all of this 'reasoning' is nonsense.


Thinking about these things will (likely) get us nowhere; though reflection based on experience and observation may get us somewhere.

Even if we knew the answer to these things - There was a beginning / There was no beginning, There is Creator/God, No Creator/God .. how will that benefit us? Will these ideas improve our lives?



posted on Jan, 1 2015 @ 06:12 AM
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If the universe created itself then why is there a doubly-even self-dual linear binary error-correcting block code first invented by Claude Shannon code created in the 40s in built into the very fabric of our universe? Makes you wonder huh?




posted on Jan, 1 2015 @ 11:17 AM
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a reply to: FormOfTheLord

The obvious answer is that Claude Shannon was not the first to utilise such code. Certainly lends credence to the Holographic principle as im sure you already aware. Apparently once we are able to measure at the scale of individual Planck units we will be able to determine whether or not our reality is a simulation. My bet is that the Holographic principle proves to be true.


en.wikipedia.org...
edit on 1-1-2015 by andy06shake because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 2 2015 @ 03:25 AM
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originally posted by: Belcastro
then does that mean that everyone and everything in it would be considered God, as in the universe was at one point, as science tells us, all One before the big bang, are we still One through space and time? I believe this because Albert Einstein said the seperation between past , present, and future is an illusion so that means the moment of the big bang still exists , as does the present, as does the future.

This kind of thinking makes me want to believe that the law of one is real, but then again i dont know how the universe created itself all on its own via the big bang without something that created it .

Maybe the law of complexity applies and matter itself evolved from the beginning.

i have other theorys that were shot down pretty quick, like god being from the future, but also from another universe.

If the big bang is real does that mean everyone and everything was God?


That's basically the tenets of pantheism



posted on Jan, 2 2015 @ 01:55 PM
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I think this is the sane and logical way to reconcile religion and science. God is the universe. That is why God always has been and always will be and why God can make all things possible. God tells us he knows the whats and the wheres. God NEVER tells us he knows WHY he is here at all. God created us out of loneliness and a desire for companionship. He knows life is especially confusing for us and so he is especially forgiving and accommodating. The only thing God will not forgive or accommodate? Hubris and ego, i.e. having the nerve to tell him that he does not exist because you know more than he does. In short, God wants people to hang out with as he passes eternity...and he won't hang out with smug jerks who think they know more than he does. That seems fair. Pretty simple and also jibes with science.



posted on Jan, 2 2015 @ 01:56 PM
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originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: FormOfTheLord

The obvious answer is that Claude Shannon was not the first to utilise such code. Certainly lends credence to the Holographic principle as im sure you already aware. Apparently once we are able to measure at the scale of individual Planck units we will be able to determine whether or not our reality is a simulation. My bet is that the Holographic principle proves to be true.


en.wikipedia.org...


Yeah but that just pushes back the question. It's a sad cop-out, in my opinion. This is a hologram? Great, who created the one creating the hologram? It's just moving the goal posts. Sooner or later you must deal with the ultimate question.



posted on Jan, 2 2015 @ 03:35 PM
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a reply to: andy06shake

That's creating a false dichotomy. There doesn't need to be a beginning or an end. Those are constructs of the human consciousness.

There can be many beginnings and endings without the need for a single beginning or ending.

A big bang would basically be all of totality existing without space/time existing, it would be infinitely large and infinitely small at the same time. Then once the big bang occurred and space/time was created, the existence as we know it came into being.

There's nothing to say that eventually, all of totality won't collapse back in on itself and everything start all over again.

Jaden



posted on Jan, 2 2015 @ 08:44 PM
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a reply to: jaffo

So what's the ultimate question? I imagine there are many questions humanity in its present iteration simply cannot address due to our 3 dimensional perspective regarding reality.

edit on 2-1-2015 by andy06shake because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 02:38 AM
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a reply to: Belcastro Forget invoking a deity, the term god should be avoided in this subject. As it is a non answer until a gods existence is proven after it can be universally defined. The effects of the big bang are still in effect as the proof for its occurrence is also its current effects on the universe, the expansion which is currently happening. The cause frankly no one knows. Its likely that we wont ever find out for thousands of years.



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 06:33 AM
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I think about the same things daily. Unfortunately these existential questions are most often impossible to answer, but I think more people should ask them.

The bible says "I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High." if you wanna take it there.

The way I look at it we all came from one condensed point that expanded outwards at the beginning of time. We are made up of stardust and suspended in space by a star that brings us food and warmth. We have to thank the stars for everything we have, so in a way we can even look to the stars as gods, and us secondary to them.

Quantum entanglement is something worth taking a look at. I don't want to attempt explaining it, but it can shine light on the interconnected universe, and it's just simply amazing and ongoing research that began with Einstein and other physicists.

We are living the "Big Bang" right now, we are it, it's happening and trailing out, not something of the past, but a part of how we define ourselves.

The following are 3 quotes by Alan Watts, my favorite writer/speaker/philosopher.
“It’s like you took a bottle of ink and you threw it at a wall. Smash! And all that ink spread. And in the middle, it’s dense, isn’t it? And as it gets out on the edge, the little droplets get finer and finer and make more complicated patterns, see? So in the same way, there was a big bang at the beginning of things and it spread. And you and I, sitting here in this room, as complicated human beings, are way, way out on the fringe of that bang.

We are the complicated little patterns on the end of it. Very interesting. But so we define ourselves as being only that. If you think that you are only inside your skin, you define yourself as one very complicated little curlique, way out on the edge of that explosion. Way out in space, and way out in time. Billions of years ago, you were a big bang, but now you’re a complicated human being. And then we cut ourselves off, and don’t feel that we’re still the big bang. But you are. Depends how you define yourself. You are actually–if this is the way things started, if there was a big bang in the beginning– you’re not something that’s a result of the big bang. You’re not something that is a sort of puppet on the end of the process. You are still the process.

You are the big bang, the original force of the universe, coming on as whoever you are. When I meet you, I see not just what you define yourself as –Mr so-and- so, Ms so-and-so, Mrs so-and-so– I see every one of you as the primordial energy of the universe coming on at me in this particular way. I know I’m that, too. But we’ve learned to define ourselves as separate from it. ”

"Jesus Christ knew he was God. So wake up and find out eventually who you really are. In our culture, of course, they’ll say you’re crazy and you’re blasphemous, and they’ll either put you in jail or in a nut house (which is pretty much the same thing). However if you wake up in India and tell your friends and relations, ‘My goodness, I’ve just discovered that I’m God,’ they’ll laugh and say, ‘Oh, congratulations, at last you found out"

"Through our eyes, the universe is perceiving itself. Through our ears, the universe is listening to its harmonies. We are the witnesses through which the universe becomes conscious of its glory, of its magnificence."



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 07:00 AM
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Perhaps all the Super Massive black holes that hold all the galaxies together already existed and something happened at the quantum level or other dimension that allowed the Black holes to release matter forming each galaxy. So maybe each black hole or each galaxy represents a big bang event. Maybe all the matter that forms the suns, gas and planets came from the black holes at some point. Maybe they cycle...


If a light Photon leaves the sun traveling toward earth and it takes the Photon 8.2 minutes to get here. How much time passed relative to the photon? How old is the photon when it arrives at earth?

Does the Suns gravity slow the photon below light speed as it leaves? Does it speed up as it gets further away from the gravity?
edit on 3-1-2015 by Xeven because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 08:04 PM
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originally posted by: NOTurTypical
a reply to: Belcastro

I don't see the conspiracy in this OP.



You being God and religion itself is the conspiracy.



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 08:08 PM
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originally posted by: Xeven
Perhaps all the Super Massive black holes that hold all the galaxies together already existed and something happened at the quantum level or other dimension that allowed the Black holes to release matter forming each galaxy. So maybe each black hole or each galaxy represents a big bang event. Maybe all the matter that forms the suns, gas and planets came from the black holes at some point. Maybe they cycle...


If a light Photon leaves the sun traveling toward earth and it takes the Photon 8.2 minutes to get here. How much time passed relative to the photon? How old is the photon when it arrives at earth?

Does the Suns gravity slow the photon below light speed as it leaves? Does it speed up as it gets further away from the gravity?


if always wondered why the galaxies were so necessairly spread out so far and why each one had a black hole.
perhaps you are right that each galaxy had its own big bang event and we would then be Gods instead of God and truly live in a sea of multiverses! also us humans know not much about how much gravity effects light at such large massess
edit on 3-1-2015 by Belcastro because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 3 2015 @ 08:14 PM
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originally posted by: St Udio

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: Belcastro

"If the Universe created itself all on its own"

Even if the our universe was responsible for its own creation the question still begs what did it create its self from and what existed before?

)


the universe came out of the 'vacuum + nothingness'...
just as Nature abhors a vacuum
and just as water seeks it's own level

the 'deep' = void/vacuum of space/nothingness
coaxed pre Quantum energy into existence... as these energies became weaker (denser) they became Quarks & stuff...as these combined and interacted then even slower/denser 'stuff' came into existence which we call Atomic particles which condensed further into matter... physical material matter... the lower down the energy scale stuff descended, it became dead & dense stuff of creation which requires it to consume or even cannibalize it's related (cousin) material

check out Eastern religions


You cant have a vacuum unless there is matter present. No finite matter can be absolute neutral.

- Nothingness must be a absolute neutral state, not a vacuum.



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